how quiet is the GF1 shutter?

[nostatic]

I really like a quiet shutter. That was one nice thing about the K7 (comparatively for a dSLR), and a downside to any current FF camera. I figured that the mirror-less cameras would have a very quiet shutter as for instance my DLux4 is barely audible. But the G1 isn't what I'd call particularly silent, and neither was the E-P1. I assume the GF1 is similarly not that quiet? By contrast, the audio recording of the X1 on LL indicates that camera will be nearly silent.

 

[barjohn]

I wouldn't count on what you heard on that video on the X1 as being representative of the volume since you don't know how far the mic was from the camera.

 

[nostatic]

Also it was shooting continuous and was pre-production so I'm taking it with a salt lick. BUT, we know that Leica actually worries about things like shutter noise. It isn't clear to me that Oly or Panny do. I frankly was a little taken aback at how loud the E-P1 shutter was.

 

[barjohn]

Well, having both and having just tried them in a quiet room. I would say the GF1 is quieter than the E-P1 but neither is as loud as the M8.

 

[Vivek]

But the G1 isn't what I'd call particularly silent, and neither was the E-P1.

The shutter noise was the "decisive moment" (got the subject's attention) for this shot (Amsterdam, traffic noise and all).

Yeah, they are all too loud, especially considering the tiny size of their shutters.

 

[Terry]

Vivek

Unless you took more than one shot I would say that is impossible. By the time he would have heard the shutter and turned it would have been closed and the shot done. What am I missing?

 

[Vivek]

Yeah, 2nd shot. He didn't break his conversation over his mobile and I have "stealth" shoes.

 

[Brian Mosley]

Doesn't the X1 use a central shutter (in the lens)? same as the Sony R1 and every P&S camera, it should be nearly silent... but maximum shutter speed is only 1/2000sec.

Cheers

Brian

 

[Vivek]

The shutter unit takes a up a considerable amount of space in the G1. It is held together by only three screws.

The way the sensor unit is screwed behind it (3 small, short screws) is very surprising. Most P&S cams are a better constructed, IMO.

If the m4/3rds is rid of the electro-mechanical shutter altogether and go for a completely electronic shutter based on the sensor, it would make everything better, IMO.

Flash sync speed can be as high as the final shutter speed (1/4000s is possible, for example, a feature that Nikon's D70 had)!

 

[pellicle]

If the m4/3rds is rid of the electro-mechanical shutter altogether and go for a completely electronic shutter based on the sensor, it would make everything better, IMO.

might improve the through the EVF monitoring of action then too

 

[Vivek]

Not only that, the video features would improve...cost would be a lot less for the camera makers.....the size could be the same as the current EP and GF with a swivel/articulating TFT screen....battery performance will be better...and the list goes on and on..:thumbs:

 

[pellicle]

some quick research on electronic shutters

Hi

I hadn't thought much about this before, so I did a quick google, and from this link.

In layman's terms, a mechanical shutter is used to control how long the pixels on an image sensor collect light. A simple mechanical shutter can be used to turn the entire sensor array on/off during the exposure. This eliminates the need for added electronics at each pixel location that would be used to turn on/off the pixel and store the charge (accumulated light). By using a mechanical shutter, a simpler, less expensive, and more efficient sensor can be used: one that has a higher fill factor (uses more of each pixel to actually capture light). Of course, nothing is ever cut and dried.

 

[Brian Mosley]

Yes, it's not at all a straightforward problem to solve - but I'm sure this area must be under development with Panasonic... how does the camera operate in video/live view mode?

Cheers

Brian

 

[pellicle]

. how does the camera operate in video/live view mode?

based on assesing my camera when waving it around and looking at the view finder in some sort of raster line mode

 

[barjohn]

I took some sound level measurements with the sound meter 5" in front of the camera. The meter was set to A weighting, and 60db scale.

The Olympus E-P1 measured 60db
The Panasonic GF1 measured 62db
For comparison the Leica M8 (original) measured 66db
The Canon G7 measured 55db

I hope this helps resolve the question

 

[Brian Mosley]

Thanks again, John to the rescue :thumbup:

We need a superhero emoticon :ROTFL:

Cheers

Brian

 

[Vivek]

I took some sound level measurements with the sound meter 5" in front of the camera. The meter was set to A weighting, and 60db scale.

The Olympus E-P1 measured 60db
The Panasonic GF1 measured 62db
For comparison the Leica M8 (original) measured 66db
The Canon G7 measured 55db

I hope this helps resolve the question

With or with a lens? Also, did you hold the camera you would normally hold while focusing (assuming a manual focus lens is used)?

 

[barjohn]

All measurements were taken with a lens on the camera and in the case of auto focus lenses after the autofocus beep and the focus mechanism had stopped (which measured higher by a considerable margin than the shutter sound). Those are peak (not average) readings. I was hand holding the cameras. At a greater distance the readings would have been much lower.

 

[ChrisJ]

The shutter unit takes a up a considerable amount of space in the G1. It is held together by only three screws.

The way the sensor unit is screwed behind it (3 small, short screws) is very surprising. Most P&S cams are a better constructed, IMO.

If the m4/3rds is rid of the electro-mechanical shutter altogether and go for a completely electronic shutter based on the sensor, it would make everything better, IMO.

Flash sync speed can be as high as the final shutter speed (1/4000s is possible, for example, a feature that Nikon's D70 had)!

This is the way shutters work on webcams and the like with very small sensors and very slow shutter speeds (1/30th of a second required for the frame rate).

It wouldn't work on a large sensor the time it takes to ripple through every pixel location of the 12Mp sensor and send the data to the buffer would mean (on a very rough calculation) that the fastest shutter speed would be around 1/30th of a second (this is assuming four channels on the sensor there may be more). The GH1 in video mode doesn't use all the sensor and can only manage a shutter speed (frame rate) maximum of 1/60th of a second.

To get faster shutter speeds on a digital stills camera is the reason they use mechanical shutters. It also enables such things as rear curtain flash and other goodies.

Chris

 

[Vivek]

In that quote is the example I pointed out (Nikon D70). Not the electro-mechanical shutter that allows for flash sync even as high as 1/4000s.

BTW, I am not aware of any digital cam that uses a mechanical shutter. Those hand cranked gizmos are history.