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Thread: Canon 5D MK IV

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    Senior Member DougDolde's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Looks like nice all-round camera, but:

    - The video crowd is tearing it down, and for good reason: the crop factor when shooting 4K is 1.74x.
    - If it's not an attractive video option, the 5Ds seems to be a more attractive camera at a similar price, not to speak about alternatives from Nikon, Pentax and Sony.
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    Senior Member DougDolde's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    LOL about as much interest here as in an old shoe. Canon is on the slow boat.
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    I think the video crowd will soon realize what Hollywood has known for years: it's a lot easier to keep a Super-35 frame (approx APS-C) in focus. That's a good part of the reason why almost every big budget movie ever (film or digital) has been shot in that format. Bigger frames sizes (Vistavision, Imax, etc) are mostly only used for special effects shots and a few showcase films.

    The new 5D looks good, but it's an evolution of the previous 4 models, which won't impress the gadget bloggers. The crowd here at GetDPI probably favours the 5DSr for its higher resolution, but the Mark IV has higher ISO and shooting speed.

    Personally, I wish Canon had upgraded the viewfinder. The Mark III and Sr have very poor finders that don't work well for manual focusing. This one seems to be more of the same, based on the fact that the focusing screen is not interchangeable.

    By the way, anybody remember when the 5D Mark II came out, and people were claiming that it would lead to the death of medium format?

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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by DougDolde View Post
    LOL about as much interest here as in an old shoe. Canon is on the slow boat.
    Personally I think it looks kinda interesting, especially with the updated 24 - 105, but Iím waiting to see what the OM-D E-M1 II is like. The less weight I have to carry these days, the better.

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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernard View Post
    By the way, anybody remember when the 5D Mark II came out, and people were claiming that it would lead to the death of medium format?
    I suspect it's more likely to be a death of a thousand cuts rather than a bullet to the head, and pixel-shifting technology is probably going to be the whetstone on which many of those knives are sharpened.
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    it will probably sell very well. the crop factor for video is not an issue, its not quite the same as the Sonys where the space for an adapter means more lens choice but shooting s35 (or thereabouts) is fine.
    Canon have the in the hand usability, focus and menu system sorted, i have kept a select few canon lenses as if i ever have to go back to shooting things that move and involve looking through a real viewfinder then iíll buy hire a 5 (mk IV/5ds)
    i expect the dxo fans and peepers will slate it.
    never trust the opinion of anyone who lists a load of gear in their forum signature. Dealers do not email me asking to buy your products.

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    Subscriber Member Jorgen Udvang's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmith View Post
    it will probably sell very well. the crop factor for video is not an issue, its not quite the same as the Sonys where the space for an adapter means more lens choice but shooting s35 (or thereabouts) is fine.
    Canon have the in the hand usability, focus and menu system sorted, i have kept a select few canon lenses as if i ever have to go back to shooting things that move and involve looking through a real viewfinder then i’ll buy hire a 5 (mk IV/5ds)
    i expect the dxo fans and peepers will slate it.
    The crop factor is an issue because WA lenses will not be very wide anymore (16mm translates to 28mm eqv.) and the fact that EF-S lenses can't be fitted. I agree that smaller sensor make sense for video, and I'm using m4/3 myself for that. The GH5 is awaited with a lot of anticipation.

    I agree that the Mk. IV will probably sell very well, just as the D810 does for Nikon.
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    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Interesting video about the 5D Mark IV video features

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgRZsEtXIn8

    This camera is very appealing, especially for video (no issues with the crop factor as this is not much different from other 4k DSLR implementations) and video AF seems to be miles ahead of any other implementation as well (Nikon are you looking?)

    Plus I find the 30MP a very great sweet spot for FF, would have preferred that over the 36MP of so many other implementations. And it shows its benefits with great DR etc.

    Adding some of the great L glass, especially my preferred 1.2 50 or 85 and one must be in heaven

    KUDOS to Canon for this great product!

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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Interesting video about the 5D Mark IV video features

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgRZsEtXIn8

    This camera is very appealing, especially for video (no issues with the crop factor as this is not much different from other 4k DSLR implementations) and video AF seems to be miles ahead of any other implementation as well (Nikon are you looking?)

    Plus I find the 30MP a very great sweet spot for FF, would have preferred that over the 36MP of so many other implementations. And it shows its benefits with great DR etc.

    Adding some of the great L glass, especially my preferred 1.2 50 or 85 and one must be in heaven

    KUDOS to Canon for this great product!

    Peter
    While it seems to be a very impressive stills camera, I'm not at all impressed with what the guy in the video says about its video capabilities, and if the rumours about the GH5 are true, that there will be no crop factor with 4K, we are looking at very similar sensor formats between these two cameras shooting 4K, and the PanaLeica 42.5mm f/1.2 will be a worthy competitor to Canon's 50/1.2. The high ISO capabilities of the Canon seem great though.
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    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    While it seems to be a very impressive stills camera, I'm not at all impressed with what the guy in the video says about its video capabilities, and if the rumours about the GH5 are true, that there will be no crop factor with 4K, we are looking at very similar sensor formats between these two cameras shooting 4K, and the PanaLeica 42.5mm f/1.2 will be a worthy competitor to Canon's 50/1.2. The high ISO capabilities of the Canon seem great though.
    Only that the GH5 will still be smaller sensor area even if FF m43 compared to 1.7 crop of the FF 5D4, that results in APSC size and is much bigger than m43.

    I agree with the lenses for m43 as the 1.2 42.5 is a stellar lens.

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    Senior Member Lucille's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Interesting video about the 5D Mark IV video features

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgRZsEtXIn8

    This camera is very appealing, especially for video (no issues with the crop factor as this is not much different from other 4k DSLR implementations) and video AF seems to be miles ahead of any other implementation as well (Nikon are you looking?)

    Plus I find the 30MP a very great sweet spot for FF, would have preferred that over the 36MP of so many other implementations. And it shows its benefits with great DR etc.

    Adding some of the great L glass, especially my preferred 1.2 50 or 85 and one must be in heaven

    KUDOS to Canon for this great product!

    Peter
    Sez the guy in the Video with the Canon shirt. Well, other video's with folks not wearing Canon shirts are saying its horrible for video because of the codec it uses makes for terribly large file sizes and Canon felt compelled not to upgrade the memory cards to a faster more modern technology allowing the use of faster card. Canon folks have waiting 4 years for this, a camera with a AA filter, 61 autofocus points, it runs UHS-1 card tech, mono input and output. All for $3500. But maybe I guess inspite of the AA filter it will still produce nice stills but again, all for $3500.

    I have no bone to pick here, merely reading a thread and commenting, good luck Canonites, hopefully this works out for those interested in it.
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucille View Post
    (People) are saying its horrible for video because of the codec it uses makes for terribly large file sizes and Canon felt compelled not to upgrade the memory cards to a faster more modern technology allowing the use of faster card.
    The internet is arguing both sides on this one. CF cards are fast and modern enough to record "terribly large" 4K files, so they can't be all that slow.

    The codec they chose is better for editing and post-processing, but you will go through a lot of CF cards at 4K. Some competitors either don't record 4K on-board at all, or else they compress it so much that it falls apart with very little post-processing. Canon's choice was to maintain the highest quality and convenience, so that must be what 5D customers asked for. It's actually quite refreshing to be able to record decent 4K without an external recorder.

    I guess Canon's other option was to switch to C-Fast cards, but that would have been even more controversial.
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucille View Post
    Sez the guy in the Video with the Canon shirt.
    That guy in the video keeps talking about "full frame". For video, this camera is nothing of the sort. It's somewhere between APS-C and 4/3 without access to ultra-WA lenses. Even Canon's own $3,000 11-24mm won't be wider than 19mm eqv. Without an EVF and articulated LCD, I'd say that it's pretty much dead in the water compared to the current 4K competition, mainly the A7s II, A7r II and the coming GH5. The codec doesn't help much either.



    As for the advanced AF features, similar solutions have been available on the GH3 and GH4 for a while, and without an articulated LCD, the touch screen is of limited value. You have to see it to use it, and when shooting video, the camera isn't always at eye level.

    Here's Philip Bloom's view:

    The Canon 5D legacy, what made the video so special and what does the 5D MKIV mean? | Philip Bloom

    And Andrew Reid's:

    An in-depth look at the video specs of the Canon 5D Mark IV - EOSHD

    Again, this seems to be a great stills camera, and at least on par with the D810. I also like that they stay with CF-cards.
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    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Jorgen,

    I think WRT video you are unfortunately right ....

    1) although the 4K crop of the Nikon D5 is also 1.5 and IMHO the difference between 1.5 or 1.7 (5DM4) is not what would really scare me - both are just BS when using FF glass

    2) the most annoying fact is the video codec being MJPEG 4:2:2 that produces really big files and it is a shame that they did not use something like H.264 like Panasonic does or even Fuji now in their new XT2

    3) Dual Pixel AF while a great feature also brings lot of physical issues (smaller photo sites at even decent pixel count resulting in decreased high ISO and DR capabilities) and my experiences with even old mirrorless cameras like the Olympus EM1 and video AF are pretty good, so not much to gain from that feature anyway

    Not sure what the PM teams at Canon (and BTW also Nikon) are really smoking, as with each and every new release the latest DSLR offerings get more questionable whereas the latest mirrorless offerings start rocking.

    Interesting where this all will end up in 4 to 5 years from now

    Peter

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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Jorgen,

    I think WRT video you are unfortunately right ....

    1) although the 4K crop of the Nikon D5 is also 1.5 and IMHO the difference between 1.5 or 1.7 (5DM4) is not what would really scare me - both are just BS when using FF glass

    2) the most annoying fact is the video codec being MJPEG 4:2:2 that produces really big files and it is a shame that they did not use something like H.264 like Panasonic does or even Fuji now in their new XT2

    3) Dual Pixel AF while a great feature also brings lot of physical issues (smaller photo sites at even decent pixel count resulting in decreased high ISO and DR capabilities) and my experiences with even old mirrorless cameras like the Olympus EM1 and video AF are pretty good, so not much to gain from that feature anyway

    Not sure what the PM teams at Canon (and BTW also Nikon) are really smoking, as with each and every new release the latest DSLR offerings get more questionable whereas the latest mirrorless offerings start rocking.

    Interesting where this all will end up in 4 to 5 years from now

    Peter
    A big difference between the D5 and the 5D IV is that the Nikon accepts APS-C lenses while the Canon doesn't. That solves the WA challenge for the Nikon. I have a feeling that Canon wants to sell more of their high-end video cameras to the established EOS customer database.
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    People over-estimate how wide a lens they need for moving images.
    The standard Zeiss motion picture rental set for 35mm (roughly the same as APS-C) starts at 16mm, with a 12mm as an extra-cost option. There's a Kinoptik 9.8mm available too, but most cinematographers go entire careers without using it.

    Now you hear complaints that you can only go down to 11 with a zoom and 10 with a prime.

    Wides don't work very well for moving pictures. You can make them work for the occasional locked-off shot, but any camera movement makes them go all weird.

    Even directors who are known for their wide look, such as Kubrick, Renoir, Welles, Wenders rarely went anywhere near that wide. Kubrick shot a few scenes with a 9.8, but his favourite lens was a Cooke 19. Wenders' classic wide-angle film, Paris Texas, was shot using a Zeiss 25.

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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Jorgen,

    The 5D cameras accept APS-C lenses in cinema and third-party mounts. The only APS-C lenses they don't accept are Canon's own consumer lenses, like the ubiquitous 18-55 kit lens.
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernard View Post
    People over-estimate how wide a lens they need for moving images.
    The standard Zeiss motion picture rental set for 35mm (roughly the same as APS-C) starts at 16mm, with a 12mm as an extra-cost option. There's a Kinoptik 9.8mm available too, but most cinematographers go entire careers without using it.

    Now you hear complaints that you can only go down to 11 with a zoom and 10 with a prime.

    Wides don't work very well for moving pictures. You can make them work for the occasional locked-off shot, but any camera movement makes them go all weird.

    Even directors who are known for their wide look, such as Kubrick, Renoir, Welles, Wenders rarely went anywhere near that wide. Kubrick shot a few scenes with a 9.8, but his favourite lens was a Cooke 19. Wenders' classic wide-angle film, Paris Texas, was shot using a Zeiss 25.
    I agree and disagree. With a crop factor of 1.74x, the popular 16-35mm lens will be 28-61mm eqv. While professionals will mostly find ways around this, amateurs will mostly have to stick with whatever they have for budgetary reasons. It's the amateurs who represent the bulk of Canon's 5D customers. As an amateur video-maker, a GH5 body that will presumably cost less than two thirds of the 5D IV and with access to the Panasonic 7-14mm that costs around $1K is a very wallet-friendly alternative that will produce excellent quality video.

    I'm not really criticizing Canon for this, just concluding that they have chosen not to follow up on the fantastic success of the somewhat revolutionary (at least for video purposes) 5D II and 5D III models. It looks like a much more stills oriented model, which is also the case for the corresponding Nikon, the D810.
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Just saw this quoted at "the digital picture" and was hoping somebody could elaborate on it...

    "As always, JPG images can be generated at any size desired when converting from a RAW image. The 5D Mark IV supports 4:3, 16:9 and 1:1 (square) aspect ratios as well."

    Just wondering if this blocks out the viewfinder as in the Nikon D810 or there is something else going on...Live view only maybe?

    Thanks in advance!

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    Senior Member Chris Giles's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Pixel pitch:

    645z 5.32
    5D4 5.36

    As a user of both, I feel they share the same glossy look I loved so much in the 645z.

    Really nice four year camera there.
    Chris Giles Photography

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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    I'm not a huge video person but this does seem like a great camera that goes above and beyond the requirements of most photographers. I like the 30mp pixel count, refined AF system, dual pixel technology, and updated lens line.
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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/574q49zvf2...DPRAW.rar?dl=0

    Dual Pixel RAW this fale possible create 3D photo of stereoglasses in 3D TV


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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Create 3D photography in #5DmIV&85/1,2 only one DP RAW file
    anaglyf look mettod

    https://goo.gl/L2Hw96

    https://goo.gl/yEV3Mm
    Last edited by Hasselboy; 9th October 2016 at 14:12.

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    Re: Canon 5D MK IV

    Quote Originally Posted by wallpaperviking View Post
    Just saw this quoted at "the digital picture" and was hoping somebody could elaborate on it...

    "As always, JPG images can be generated at any size desired when converting from a RAW image. The 5D Mark IV supports 4:3, 16:9 and 1:1 (square) aspect ratios as well."

    Just wondering if this blocks out the viewfinder as in the Nikon D810 or there is something else going on...Live view only maybe?

    Thanks in advance!

    Pretty sure it is only in live view unfortunately...

    Could be wrong though, anybody know for certain?

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