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new Fuji X Pro1 camera

jonoslack

Active member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

You are not going to take my position that both the numbers and perceived image quality are important and suggest that only one or the other is the valid perspective on judging a camera.
Well guys - I seem to have started this argument (quite unwittingly/unwillingly).
I think that the perceived image quality is most important to me - but I certainly don't think that the figures are unconnected with this - just that it's not necessarily a very tight connection.

Certainly, a fine IQ doesn't necessarily relate to a good dXo score (M9 is a case in point, but there are many others, some Olympus sensors I can think of). In the same way, the Nikon D7000/Pentax K5 has a stonking good DXO score - and doubtless the IQ is good as well, but I'm not sure that it's quite as good as the ranking suggests.

the remarks before were nothing to do with Dxo - so this post is probably entirely irrelevant - apologies to shashin.
I shall now go and wash my head in a bucket of water!


I would delete it, but I do believe what I said - and anyway, deleting it would invalidate Shashin and Vivek's responses.
 
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Shashin

Well-known member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

Now, don't you start!

;)

These things are easier if people question what I say, rather than inventing up stuff I didn't say.
 
V

Vivek

Guest
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

Well guys - I seem to have started this argument (quite unwittingly/unwillingly).
I think that the perceived image quality is most important to me - but I certainly don't think that the figures are unconnected with this - just that it's not necessarily a very tight connection.

Certainly, a fine IQ doesn't necessarily relate to a good dXo score (M9 is a case in point, but there are many others, some Olympus sensors I can think of). In the same way, the Nikon D7000/Pentax K5 has a stonking good DXO score - and doubtless the IQ is good as well, but I'm not sure that it's quite as good as the ranking suggests.
Is the link from Robert anything to do DOX site or scores? :confused:
 

dhsimmonds

New member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

Sometimes a hands on review by an every day pro photographer with sample images can speak louder than words written by those who have never handled the camera or don't even wish to handle the camera.

This one is by Nick Devlin, who is also an experienced M9 users and Leica enthusiast:Fuji X-Pro1 Review
 

ptomsu

Workshop Member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

1) I so far do not see any results I could not get with an M9 or with a Nikon or Canon XYZ.

2) In contrast there is the uncertainty what right feel and quality means - obviously something different for each individual.

3) coming finally to Luminous Landscape - I have read most of their reviews and almost no one reflected what I finally felt when I held a specific camera in hand. So why should that be different this time????

Point is - maybe Fuji will once get to have a great system here, maybe, but for sure what we see today is just a try and far from being a system.
 

kit laughlin

Subscriber Member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

Dave, I do like Nick's reviews; and he can spell, punctuate and use words beautifully. Thanks for the link; reading it now.
 

markowich

New member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

peter, i need to comment on this. you know me and have seen me with big cameras in my hand and loving them and their feel. but since i picked up the fuji last week in japan i have changed my mind-somewhat. camera + three lenses < 1kg, built quality is not leica-ish but beats pana and oly hands down, ergonomic buttons on the camera, good but not nikon-ish fast autofocus, very good lenses (the 35mm f1.4 gets close to the summilux in my view, the 60mm macro is fantastic), IQ excellent up to 3200iso, hardly any moiree (you really need to provoke it, even fabric comes out very good normally), excellent optical viewfinder, ok EVF, great live view...i could go on but you get the picture. IMHO fuji has created a marvel with breakthrough technlogy (dual VF, sensor randomized arry). is it perfect, no, there are a few minor issues i do not like (rubber lens caps fall off all the time, the sunshade of the 90mm is ridicolously large, silky pix is a pain..).
can it do things the M9 cannot do? clearly above base iso it beats the M9 hands down, i even concur with steve huff that base iso IQ (including color representation) beat the M9 IQ.
i am going to wait for the M10 but it is hard for me to imagine that leica will get close to the fuji overall package. surely enough, the M9 will have FF, live view hopefully focus confirmation and more MPX but i think that retro-looking leica (see the ridicolous M9 bottom plate) is unable to do a project like fuji did. i'd be happy to err on this.
well we still have to see fuji's quality control, but i have seen enough of leica's. in japan both my leica systems turned into rather useless paper weight (M9 sensor crack and S2 exposimeter and/or shutter failure). i dragged the stuff from saudi arabia to japan and back for nothing.
this is why i bought the fuji and i love it.
give it a try, you will be surprised.
peter

1) I so far do not see any results I could not get with an M9 or with a Nikon or Canon XYZ.

2) In contrast there is the uncertainty what right feel and quality means - obviously something different for each individual.

3) coming finally to Luminous Landscape - I have read most of their reviews and almost no one reflected what I finally felt when I held a specific camera in hand. So why should that be different this time????

Point is - maybe Fuji will once get to have a great system here, maybe, but for sure what we see today is just a try and far from being a system.
 

KeithL

Well-known member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

Any feedback on the manual focus capabilities and their impact on using manual focus lenses would be appreciated. Also feedback on the 18mm, so far I've seen nothing outstanding from it but I live in hope.
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

peter, i need to comment on this. you know me and have seen me with big cameras in my hand and loving them and their feel. but since i picked up the fuji last week in japan i have changed my mind-somewhat. camera + three lenses < 1kg, built quality is not leica-ish but beats pana and oly hands down, ergonomic buttons on the camera, good but not nikon-ish fast autofocus, very good lenses (the 35mm f1.4 gets close to the summilux in my view, the 60mm macro is fantastic), IQ excellent up to 3200iso, hardly any moiree (you really need to provoke it, even fabric comes out very good normally), excellent optical viewfinder, ok EVF, great live view...i could go on but you get the picture. IMHO fuji has created a marvel with breakthrough technlogy (dual VF, sensor randomized arry). is it perfect, no, there are a few minor issues i do not like (rubber lens caps fall off all the time, the sunshade of the 90mm is ridicolously large, silky pix is a pain..).
can it do things the M9 cannot do? clearly above base iso it beats the M9 hands down, i even concur with steve huff that base iso IQ (including color representation) beat the M9 IQ.
i am going to wait for the M10 but it is hard for me to imagine that leica will get close to the fuji overall package. surely enough, the M9 will have FF, live view hopefully focus confirmation and more MPX but i think that retro-looking leica (see the ridicolous M9 bottom plate) is unable to do a project like fuji did. i'd be happy to err on this.
well we still have to see fuji's quality control, but i have seen enough of leica's. in japan both my leica systems turned into rather useless paper weight (M9 sensor crack and S2 exposimeter and/or shutter failure). i dragged the stuff from saudi arabia to japan and back for nothing.
this is why i bought the fuji and i love it.
give it a try, you will be surprised.
peter
I bow to the fact that you have the Fuji, and can compare, yet I still have questions in mind.

On the positive side, this X Pro1 may be the first foray into XPan territory that many have wished for. Anyone that had a XPan has no doubts about Fuji's ability to make stellar optics ... and the XPan quality wasn't too shabby ... as are the Hasselblad designed, Fuji made lenses I use daily on my H4D/60 ... none of which are like the S2 optics I use ... the character is simply different.

Whether "breakthrough" technology results in better images, or simply offers a different route to making images, remains to be proven over time. I see no evidence of that at this very early stage. Words about the X Pro's IQ are quite convincing ... the images so far are not. To my eye, what you see as being "clearly" so, is subjectively not evidenced by actual results ... I do see decent images from the X Pro 1 so far, but I do not see the specific look, snap, blacks and a bunch of other characteristics that identify a M8/9 shot from all others ... even when viewed on a Lightoom Library array mixed in with shots from other cameras ... like I do every week.

My caveat to all of the above, is that I've become a raging skeptic regarding marketing hype and the initial enthusiastic subjectivity of early adopters, and/or technology chasers ... no matter who they are. I also admit to being loath to return to a crop frame camera of any flavor, and if a camera incorporates AF, it had better be as good as the Nikon at this stage of available technology, or why even bother? AF needs to work well where it is needed ... in very fast situations, or in very low light where MF is more difficult.

Skeptically yours,

-Marc
 
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monza

Active member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

Words about the X Pro's IQ are quite convincing ... the images so far are not.
Images I have seen from the usual test sites are, well, the usual test images. Images I've seen from real photogs, quite a different matter. I find the IQ to be outstanding. And this is from my own use as well, although I'm hardly a 'real' photog.

I also don't quite understand what the urgency is. If manual focus on an M8 or M9 is acceptable, then reasonably fast and accurate AF should be, too. ;)
 

monza

Active member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

Any feedback on the manual focus capabilities and their impact on using manual focus lenses would be appreciated. Also feedback on the 18mm, so far I've seen nothing outstanding from it but I live in hope.
The X-Pro1 would not be my first choice for using adapted lenses, with the current user interface, especially with any focal length close to the Fuji primes.

Key sequence.

--press center of command dial to magnify (this button is on the center right of the camera)
--press AF button and then the arrow buttons to move the focus point (AF button on far left of camera; arrow buttons back to center right)

It should instead be:

--press center of command dial to magnify
--press arrow buttons to move focus point

Press an AF button for manual focus? hmm. :)

If adapted lenses were my priority I'd go for a Ricoh or NEX first.

--The EVF on the NEX is pretty much agreed to be the best available
--focus peaking.

That said, the fantastic sensor and amazing high ISO might be enough for some users to go with the Fuji anyway.

A wide manual focus lens like a 15mm Voigtlander might be quite enjoyable on the Fuji by presetting the focus.

Perhaps Fuji will improve the UI and add focus peaking...that would change the game quite a lot.
 

markowich

New member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

Any feedback on the manual focus capabilities and their impact on using manual focus lenses would be appreciated. Also feedback on the 18mm, so far I've seen nothing outstanding from it but I live in hope.
i have trief MF a couple of times when the autofocus made chices i didn't want. there is a button which gives you 100% zoom-in on live view. worked pretty well.
peter
ps: still, i shall refrain from using my M lenses on the fuji. too much of a hassle.
 

markowich

New member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

well i bother with it mainly because of the weight factor. this overides the cropped sensor for me.
the fuji does not have the color-snappy look of the M9 imagesbut it is a matter of taste which color rendering you prefer.
peter


I bow to the fact that you have the Fuji, and can compare, yet I still have questions in mind.

On the positive side, this X Pro1 may be the first foray into XPan territory that many have wished for. Anyone that had a XPan has no doubts about Fuji's ability to make stellar optics ... and the XPan quality wasn't too shabby ... as are the Hasselblad designed, Fuji made lenses I use daily on my H4D/60 ... none of which are like the S2 optics I use ... the character is simply different.

Whether "breakthrough" technology results in better images, or simply offers a different route to making images, remains to be proven over time. I see no evidence of that at this very early stage. Words about the X Pro's IQ are quite convincing ... the images so far are not. To my eye, what you see as being "clearly" so, is subjectively not evidenced by actual results ... I do see decent images from the X Pro 1 so far, but I do not see the specific look, snap, blacks and a bunch of other characteristics that identify a M8/9 shot from all others ... even when viewed on a Lightoom Library array mixed in with shots from other cameras ... like I do every week.

My caveat to all of the above, is that I've become a raging skeptic regarding marketing hype and the initial enthusiastic subjectivity of early adopters, and/or technology chasers ... no matter who they are. I also admit to being loath to return to a crop frame camera of any flavor, and if a camera incorporates AF, it had better be as good as the Nikon at this stage of available technology, or why even bother? AF needs to work well where it is needed ... in very fast situations, or in very low light where MF is more difficult.

Skeptically yours,

-Marc
 

KeithL

Well-known member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

If adapted lenses were my priority I'd go for a Ricoh or NEX first.

--The EVF on the NEX is pretty much agreed to be the best available
--focus peaking.
Thanks, the problem is every time I've picked up an NEX all I've wanted to do is put it down again.

If the 18mm proved to be an outstanding lens I'd probably buy into the X-Pro1system, but everything I've seen so far indicates it's the weak link.

I'll probably wait for the M10.
 

markowich

New member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

Thanks, the problem is every time I've picked up an NEX all I've wanted to do is put it down again.

If the 18mm proved to be an outstanding lens I'd probably buy into the X-Pro1system, but everything I've seen so far indicates it's the weak link.

I'll probably wait for the M10.
the 18mm lens is by no means bad. not too much distortion and rather sharp when you stop down a bit, but i have no serious comparism test.
peter
 

KeithL

Well-known member
Re: new Fuji X Pro1 camera (formerly called "new camera")

the 18mm lens is by no means bad. not too much distortion and rather sharp when you stop down a bit, but i have no serious comparism test.
peter
Thanks. The distortion I've seen so far is wave, a nightmare to correct. I was also hoping to be able to use the lens wide open.
 
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