Some scanner help would be appreciated

[TRSmith]

Arrgh, my head is burning! I want all this stuff. But a step at a time.

A question regarding B&W film, does anyone develop film, make traditional silver prints and THEN scan the prints? I keep reading about a compressed dynamic range from scanners and wondering how that balances with the print-scan approach. How much control in post processing is possible with negs scanned to digital? Are the results you can get that way; better than, the same as, or worse than what a silver print looks like?

 

[jlm]

granted they were from 4x5, but i have a few images in the large format film thread that were scanned on an epson 700 from tri-x negs developed in HC 110. they look pretty good to me, even compared to my original silver prints

 

[robmac]

FYI the latest issue of View Camera has a short but timely article on best results scanning larger negs on the V750M Pro. Essentially with the right (betterscanning.com) accessories, profiles, care, workflow, software and practice it can do well (again on LF in this case).

The biggest issues again being keeping the film flat, especially as the scanner gets warm from multiple scanning passes and getting negative JUST the right height above the bed for sharp results.

Personally, if no need for LF scanning, flatbeds are a compromise best avoided IF the budget permits. Dedicated films scanners be they Minolta or Nikon deliver great, repeatable results with minimal PITA. Scanning is never FUN, but the PITA factor and frustration can be minimized and saved time can be spent shooting.

 

[kevinparis]

here are a couple more scanned today from the Plustek OpticFilm 7300. Having a real bad time with my own processed HP5 - but these are from some kodak colour film that was lying around

shot on borrowed M2 and noctilux, some PP in Aperture and Define

will have to find a less dusty apartment, find some distilled water for the final wash and learn to be really careful about scratches - you know I don't think this whole film thing will ever catch on

K

 

[nei1]

Tim ,if you print using enlarger paper and chemicals your best efforts will be like small treasures,you will love them.On the other hand a scanned neg,photoshopped to hell,heaven and back again will be technically perfect but not nearly as lovable.

 

[TRSmith]

I don't disagree Nei1, but I like to share the love. Which means there will be digits involved.

 

[Jeremy]

I went to B&H Today
looking at Scanners.... :ROTFL:
I have narrowed it down to Two

Nikon 9000 /$1995.00 ...The Dream scanner
Epson 750 / $795.00 ...The Practical & Exc Scanner

If you go with an Epson flatbed go with the V700 and not the V750 as the wetmounting platform that comes with the V750 is a POS as it scans through the low-quality plastic on it--after much testing there is zero difference at scans up to and including 2400ppi from the V750 and V700's in our lab. There's also no point in going above 2400ppi as you are optically limited by the lens in the scanner.

My suggestion is to save/bite the bullet and buy the Nikon 9000 if it's within the realm of possibilities.

 

[kevinparis]

jeremy

would be interested to know your thoughts on the plustek - i bought it as a way of archiving old negs with sentimental rather than artistic value.

the software that comes with it (silverfast) has the worst interface ever seen...I am sure it is capable of doing great things but what is it with germans and interface design

Vuescan is a little better - but all those options sheesh... both are designed to confuse... and I am someone who has spent the last 20 years working with all sorts of software and demoing it to the public...

K

 

[emmawest72]

@Kevinparis

Hi Kevin,

From your screen name i assume you live in Paris so If you want to get your negs developed nicely I recommend Negatif+ ( blvd Lafayette) or just google it. They propose a lot of diffrent services and they do huge volumes so their chemicals are always up to date.

I don't know the scanner but I have always been pleased with my nikon coolscan IV which is the model from around 2001. Have a look at ebay or around shope in paris as they tend to pop up. Or go for the more recent model the coolscan V.

Vuescan is the way to go to get nice flat bw negs when scanning. check this tip:

http://www.flickr.com/groups/ishootfilm/discuss/72157608204093047

Good luck.

 

[kevinparis]

thanks for that william

 

[Cindy Flood]

Kevin,
I use a Nikon V and an approach similar to the one outlined in this tutorial. I always lightly brush off my negs with a dedicated sable brush before I scan them. Scanning is pretty easy with the Nikon V.

 

[robmac]

A brush that works well is the Visible Dust sensor brush - statically (word?) grabs the dust off negatives. Like Cindy (I used the 5000ED) - the scanning process itself is very easy with the Nikons. If doing any volume at a time, the 35mm slide feeder works very well. There is also a roll-film feeder but I've no experience with it.

Hide the penny jar: http://www.rangefinderforum.com/photopost-classifieds/showproduct.php/product/15047/limit/recent

 

[nei1]

If your scanning mainly black and white then a cold cathode light source is better,its pretty good with colour too,again the old minoltas are the only ones that have this light source and again I dont know what Ill do if the bulb goes.The nikons are I imagine easier to fix.

 

[viablex1]

well in my experience, the nikon 9000 does not do as well with black and white negatives as it does with black and white positives. It does phenomenal with color negative film like fuji pro 160C, it does okay with color positive film like provia. I have both glass holders and there are advantages to each. Of course you know it is still consumer grade but it is as good at some films as the older generation imacons but not with velvia, imho..

 

[emmawest72]

Viablex,

Do you have some straight scans from films like fuji 160c or portra 160 or 400 you could show as I'm planning on getting a new scanner soon?

Thanks.

 

[Lars]

I modded one of the trays for my Nikon 8000 for wetmounting. Results are stunning. if your negs can resolve 112 megapixels then the Nikon will, albeit with a slight softness so MTF might seem a little low until you sharpen. With 16x multisampling the tonal smoothness and deep densities will match a midrange drumscanner (but pixel to pixel contrast will of course not). And for convenience it's great too, for a quick scan just pop in a MF strip into the glassless holder and scan it.

Personally I think the Nikon software is OK, the least bad of all scanner softwares. Digital ICE is fantastic, a huge timesaver but works best on E6 film and has problems with silver halide.

If you can find a used 8000 or 9000 at a good price then that might be a great choice for dedicated MF scanner.

 

[Lars]

Here is a straight scan from Velvia, 16x oversampling, with ICE. Scanned in the glass MF holder so no wetmounting.



The frame along the top is from the film holder.
Some tonal adjustments give brings up shadow details:

 

[robmac]

Lars - nice.

I actually played with wet scanning 35mm slides (sandwiched between glass mounts) did a nice job. ICE (an issue with B&W negs sadly) and 16x is worth it's weight in gold.

Knew I shouldn't have started participating in this thread - keep thinking M7II 1-2 lenses or maybe the CV Bessa III or a nice used Hassy 500 kit and a 9000ED. Ouch.

One thing to bear in mind is that scanning 35mm let alone 120 film creates BIG files (35mm + 16x = 110MB+) and any PP work in PS will require a computer with LOTS of RAM if, like me, your an adjustment layer junkie.

 

[Lars]

The cool thing about wetmounting on a Coolscan MF scanner is that it's really easy and you can work fast - between the fluid and ICE, almost all defects are taken care of. No need for dust paranoia like on a drum scanner - and believe me with a drumscanner you have to be really paranoid.

As a parenthesis, my dusting setup for my drum scanner consists of a 240-120V transformer, a small compressor (for airbrushing) with a humidity filter, an airtool hose, a Wilkerson coalescing filter, and a Simco TopGun ionizing airgun. The coalescing filter is a bit expensive (a few hundred dollars, cheaper on ebay) but really scrubs the air clean from oil as well as humidity. The TopGun emits both positive and negative ions into the air stream, which gets rid of any and all static, period. It's quite a setup but if you spend up to an hour dusting each 8x10" scan then it's worth it. Great for cleaning keyboards and camera sensors as well.

 

[Cindy Flood]

The cool thing about wetmounting on a Coolscan MF scanner is that it's really easy and you can work fast - between the fluid and ICE, almost all defects are taken care of. No need for dust paranoia like on a drum scanner - and believe me with a drumscanner you have to be really paranoid.

As a parenthesis, my dusting setup for my drum scanner consists of a 240-120V transformer, a small compressor (for airbrushing) with a humidity filter, an airtool hose, a Wilkerson coalescing filter, and a Simco TopGun ionizing airgun. The coalescing filter is a bit expensive (a few hundred dollars, cheaper on ebay) but really scrubs the air clean from oil as well as humidity. The TopGun emits both positive and negative ions into the air stream, which gets rid of any and all static, period. It's quite a setup but if you spend up to an hour dusting each 8x10" scan then it's worth it. Great for cleaning keyboards and camera sensors as well.

Lars,
What solution do you use for wetmounting?