Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
I totally agree . It was a very tough image to deal with
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M9 and B&W?
- Thread starter fotografz
- Start date
Please re-read that post. It was in reference to subject matter and appropriate cameras for certain subjects ... not Image quality.Hi Marc,
I remember that you are familiar with different cameras, e.g. Sony Alpha900, Nikon D3x and now M9. And that you have no problem with telling the truth. Hope there is no error so far with my assumptions.
When I see some of M9's pictures here and on other places I get the impression that these pictures have a presence, clarity and easy natural sharpness that cameras like the A900 even with Zeiss glass can't deliver.
Of course I can be wrong because I only saw these web pictures and a few big prints from Leica in real life. (which were very convincing!) Therefore I would like to ask for your personal opinion on this topic.
Could it be true that the CCD sensor is responsible for this different look?
Thanks!
-Marc
N
nautilus
Guest
Oh, sorry. I think now I that I misunderstood you (English is not my first language). You just donwloaded picture examples from the web.
I thought that you already own the M9 and have personal experiences from several hundred shots and therefore could say something about the image quality compared to the Alpha 900.
But Jono Slack did test the M9 and also was a messenger for the Alpha 900 camera in this forum. Maybe he will find this question and tell us his opinion.
I thought that you already own the M9 and have personal experiences from several hundred shots and therefore could say something about the image quality compared to the Alpha 900.
But Jono Slack did test the M9 and also was a messenger for the Alpha 900 camera in this forum. Maybe he will find this question and tell us his opinion.
I do have a M9 and a A900, and shoot with them in the same conditions.
Yes, they are different looks. Both are very nice. The cameras themselves are very different and lend themselves to different styles of shooting.
N
nei1
Guest
:deadhorse:As youve said the image has its problems,wether because its digital or analogue the brilliant white out of the chair back is a problem that is going to occur,for many reasons,a mistake or impossible lighting conditions,.......I was hoping that one of the many experts here would have a fix for this but it seems not,its a little disapointing but I suppose every system has its limits.
However with an example like this thats maybe on the edge of possibility another way round the problem coud be shown,different exposure etc,because as it is this photo would not be acceptable to any client,Imean what would you professionals do if you brought this home without the possibility of a reshoot,,,,:deadhorse:
all the best,Neil
However with an example like this thats maybe on the edge of possibility another way round the problem coud be shown,different exposure etc,because as it is this photo would not be acceptable to any client,Imean what would you professionals do if you brought this home without the possibility of a reshoot,,,,:deadhorse:
all the best,Neil
Well, with the Highlight Warning enabled on the M9, you'd do the"reshoot" 5 seconds after taking the shot, not 3 days later like if you did it on film.:deadhorse:As youve said the image has its problems,wether because its digital or analogue the brilliant white out of the chair back is a problem that is going to occur,for many reasons,a mistake or impossible lighting conditions,.......I was hoping that one of the many experts here would have a fix for this but it seems not,its a little disapointing but I suppose every system has its limits.
However with an example like this thats maybe on the edge of possibility another way round the problem coud be shown,different exposure etc,because as it is this photo would not be acceptable to any client,Imean what would you professionals do if you brought this home without the possibility of a reshoot,,,,:deadhorse:
all the best,Neil
-Marc
Ben Rubinstein
Active member
This is ACR with very minimal local adjustment brush, recovered highlights, didn't use the shadows tool which kills skin tones, about 15 seconds in total in ACR then running my B&W action which is the Gradient Map tool that Marc taught me years ago in the photo.net days plus a bit of Local Contrast Enhancement that I apply as part of the action.
Didn't like the look of the file at all personally, very over gritty and flat mid tones. Have to try it in C1. No doubt an Adobe thing?
Didn't like the look of the file at all personally, very over gritty and flat mid tones. Have to try it in C1. No doubt an Adobe thing?
Ben Rubinstein
Active member
You're right Marc, it is flat, glad you found an action that works for you.
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Did not know you wanted it fixed. Was just waiting for everyone to tear it up first. LOL:deadhorse:As youve said the image has its problems,wether because its digital or analogue the brilliant white out of the chair back is a problem that is going to occur,for many reasons,a mistake or impossible lighting conditions,.......I was hoping that one of the many experts here would have a fix for this but it seems not,its a little disapointing but I suppose every system has its limits.
However with an example like this thats maybe on the edge of possibility another way round the problem coud be shown,different exposure etc,because as it is this photo would not be acceptable to any client,Imean what would you professionals do if you brought this home without the possibility of a reshoot,,,,:deadhorse:
all the best,Neil
Ben Rubinstein
Active member
I only use this forum for the opportunity to use all the cool smilies....
N
nei1
Guest
Id love to know how you did this Guy;but to be honest all I wanted to know was that it could be done,so thanks for that,all the best.............Neil.:thumbup:
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
On iPhone right now but actually quite simple will explain in detail later
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Okay what i did was bring it in C1 and as soon as you bring the image in the highlight warning goes off. I have my C1 for 255, now what I did was raised the highlight slider till the red clipping goes away. I'm doing this all in color right now. When you raise the highlight the image gets darker so I pumped a little shadow in to raise its level than brightened the exposure ever so slightly to the point of not clipping again. From here I decide to clip just a touch of the shadows. Basically get the color image just perfect. Than I used style and the yellow filter and than under lens correction I vignetted the image some. I probably lightened the exposure even more after the conversion. Than converted and brought into CS4. Now the white highlight is still below 255 and more like 248 or so. Now using the magic wand I selected the chair than expanded that selection 3 pixels than feathered 1 pixel. What this does is soften the transition area than I adjusted using brightness and contrast and just lowered brightness down a little extra to get a little more detail in the highlight. Level now is like 241
Than deselected and added .5 noise to the whole image. here you need to be careful noise pushed to far can get more ugly than add the look of grain so I put in a very small amount. Now obviously this is by taste and if you have a nice grain action or plug in than a good time to apply it here. After that just went into curves and just fine tuned to taste. Trick here is have a monitor calibrated so anything you do you can see . Also it is still RGB so go to mode and convert to B&W and that is about it. So when you run into some real trouble you can isolate it and make the correction. Hope that helps
Than deselected and added .5 noise to the whole image. here you need to be careful noise pushed to far can get more ugly than add the look of grain so I put in a very small amount. Now obviously this is by taste and if you have a nice grain action or plug in than a good time to apply it here. After that just went into curves and just fine tuned to taste. Trick here is have a monitor calibrated so anything you do you can see . Also it is still RGB so go to mode and convert to B&W and that is about it. So when you run into some real trouble you can isolate it and make the correction. Hope that helps
N
nei1
Guest
Thanks Guy,........."quite simple";....I"d be 50 years working that out...,Neil
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Already past that . LOL
You need to come to a workshop -- we teach you how to do all that in like three minutes.
,
PeterA
Well-known member
I think you guys should consider doing an internet based 'course' on C1...
surprised MRiechman hasn't - since he is such a fan of Phase One - but sticks to LR???
as for teh pic above - the problem with Guy's final shot - is teh muddy grey washed out blonde girl's face..
I have started playing with C1 again loading a bunch of snaps made on holidays in Greece - I much prefer it to LR for raw conversion and basic prep. I can understand why a pwerson would stick with Phase One backs - because of C1 workflow..
with M9 ariving in a week or so I thought I'd brush up on C1 and woudl love to have a downloadable 'course' I could use to really get to know the nitty gritty of the programme.
*just a suggestion/thought - you can cut me in for a 10% spotters fee if you like -
surprised MRiechman hasn't - since he is such a fan of Phase One - but sticks to LR???
as for teh pic above - the problem with Guy's final shot - is teh muddy grey washed out blonde girl's face..
I have started playing with C1 again loading a bunch of snaps made on holidays in Greece - I much prefer it to LR for raw conversion and basic prep. I can understand why a pwerson would stick with Phase One backs - because of C1 workflow..
with M9 ariving in a week or so I thought I'd brush up on C1 and woudl love to have a downloadable 'course' I could use to really get to know the nitty gritty of the programme.
*just a suggestion/thought - you can cut me in for a 10% spotters fee if you like -
Peter,
Doug does C1 web training at Capture Integration:
http://www.captureintegration.com/2008/11/24/capture-one-web-seminar/
Doug does C1 web training at Capture Integration:
http://www.captureintegration.com/2008/11/24/capture-one-web-seminar/