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M Monochrom . . . . it's not a review folks
- Thread starter jonoslack
- Start date
bradhusick
Active member
I don't understand why people think the price of the M9M should be lower than the M9P. Are there fewer parts? Less firmware? Nope.
V
Vivek
Guest
Hi Peter,Counterbalanced by the cons:
- No highlight headroom. Expose carefully.
- No color (will be an advantage for some, disadvantage to others).
- No PP color filtering, must use traditional filters at exposure.
- May need an ND filter for bright sunshine.
- Wide-open bokeh nuts will need to stop down a little, which will kill them
- The price is bleeping ridiculous, but this is Leica, so we knew that.
--Peter
I would think there IS PP color filtering as the output isn't true monochromatic at all. This is where the Nik pluggin comes into play.
FWIW, if someone wants a monochrome camera for less, they could look up maxmax site (they offer custom conversions of two stock Canon DSLRs- only Canon DSLRs). That conversion and file outputs are exactly like the one the M9M produces ie., RGB.
V
Vivek
Guest
Like I said earlier, it is very clever of Leica to produce a very affordable monochrome camera! If it had been one with a true monochrome output, it would have been ~3X the price of the M9P! Quite frankly I am stunned that they kept the price at M9P level!
Brian Mosley
New member
Well, I'm really glad you got this opportunity Jono - there are some stunning images in those sets, so Leica made an excellent choice. Some very jealous folks over on that stuffy forum :loco:
All the best :salute:
Brian
All the best :salute:
Brian
W
wilsonlaidlaw
Guest
Jono,
Thank you for the blog and pictures - well done. I can see the point of the M9M for people who take a lot of B&W and in comparison to the M9. However how is it going to compare with converted images from the M10. Now with a bit of guesswork, the M10 will have a CMOS sensor with around 28MP and ISO up to 12,000ish + boost. If those figures are anywhere near correct, I feel a converted B&W from the M10 will be close to indistinguishable from an M9M even at high ISO's. The M10 will have the obvious benefit of taking colour but for B&W it has the not inconsiderable benefit of being able to apply filters retrospectively at the conversion stage, in adjustments or even better in lab colour space. For me it's wait for the M10.
Wilson
Thank you for the blog and pictures - well done. I can see the point of the M9M for people who take a lot of B&W and in comparison to the M9. However how is it going to compare with converted images from the M10. Now with a bit of guesswork, the M10 will have a CMOS sensor with around 28MP and ISO up to 12,000ish + boost. If those figures are anywhere near correct, I feel a converted B&W from the M10 will be close to indistinguishable from an M9M even at high ISO's. The M10 will have the obvious benefit of taking colour but for B&W it has the not inconsiderable benefit of being able to apply filters retrospectively at the conversion stage, in adjustments or even better in lab colour space. For me it's wait for the M10.
Wilson
V
Vivek
Guest
Hi John,
Yes, no Bayer dyes but it would appear that the plain pixels are treated (are assigned) the same pattern so that it would out put like the M9 file.
See B&W Conversion
Has a bit more detail as what might go in to such processes.
Yes, no Bayer dyes but it would appear that the plain pixels are treated (are assigned) the same pattern so that it would out put like the M9 file.
See B&W Conversion
Has a bit more detail as what might go in to such processes.
jlancasterd
Active member
Jono
What effect will the electronic monochrome filters in LR4 have on the images produced by the M Monochrome? There's a full set in that software from yellow to deep red, plus infrared.
What effect will the electronic monochrome filters in LR4 have on the images produced by the M Monochrome? There's a full set in that software from yellow to deep red, plus infrared.
jonoslack
Active member
Hi there everyone
I'm just back from Berlin, rather knackered after a 4.30am morning and too much fun with too many people!
Thank you everyone for the kind words (and the less kind as well). from my point of view writing the words is one thing, posting the pictures always leads to a little heartache.
I can't answer everyone personally tonight, much as I'd like to, but when I say Thank you I mean you!
There have been some perfectly reasonable requests to do some comparisons between M9 and MM files. Of course, I have done this exercise -you will be astonished to hear that I actually got my tripod out and took pictures at all the available ISO values for each camera in good conditions and in bad. The conclusion I came to was:
1 The MM has better dynamic range
2 The MM has much better high ISO (10000 is quite usable, and 6400 will do A1 prints)
3 The mid tones are rather a revelation on the MM
4 There is a resolution advantage - but with the subjects I tried it wasn't huge
5 You Better Not Overexpose - but this isn't a problem in itself, the roll off burned out areas is perfectly gentle and the shadow detail goes on forever
.......... But I'm not going to publish my results! Sean Reid and Michael Reichmann are much better at this stuff than I am: they make their living from it! Added to which I haven't the time or inclination to get into the inevitable discussions about methodology and results!
I'll try and answer more specific questions tomorrow.
all the best Jono
p.s. Cam - the Lobster diner for you and Kevin is definitely on me after your help and encouragement!
I'm just back from Berlin, rather knackered after a 4.30am morning and too much fun with too many people!
Thank you everyone for the kind words (and the less kind as well). from my point of view writing the words is one thing, posting the pictures always leads to a little heartache.
I can't answer everyone personally tonight, much as I'd like to, but when I say Thank you I mean you!
There have been some perfectly reasonable requests to do some comparisons between M9 and MM files. Of course, I have done this exercise -you will be astonished to hear that I actually got my tripod out and took pictures at all the available ISO values for each camera in good conditions and in bad. The conclusion I came to was:
1 The MM has better dynamic range
2 The MM has much better high ISO (10000 is quite usable, and 6400 will do A1 prints)
3 The mid tones are rather a revelation on the MM
4 There is a resolution advantage - but with the subjects I tried it wasn't huge
5 You Better Not Overexpose - but this isn't a problem in itself, the roll off burned out areas is perfectly gentle and the shadow detail goes on forever
.......... But I'm not going to publish my results! Sean Reid and Michael Reichmann are much better at this stuff than I am: they make their living from it! Added to which I haven't the time or inclination to get into the inevitable discussions about methodology and results!
I'll try and answer more specific questions tomorrow.
all the best Jono
p.s. Cam - the Lobster diner for you and Kevin is definitely on me after your help and encouragement!
Isnt a B&W sensor the same base like a color sensor but without color filters and without interpolation?
I assume the production cost is about the same, but since there are lower production numbers + some r&d cost they made the price a little higher than the M9p.
V
Vivek
Guest
Yes to the first part of that question. Frankly, I can only speculate as to the second part and I do think (speculation) there is some interpolation going on.
Tom, Come on!
The price is is at the same level as the M9P!You use a color wheel with RGB filters and make three exposures. Kodak sold them with the DCS200m and DCS400 series monochrome cameras. The filter wheel interfaced with the camera for the three exposures. I'm sure we can rig something up with the data port of the M9-M. I could use the color wheel with my Polaroid Palette film recorder with it, also has a serial interface with the computer.
Or better yet, print out the picture and hand-tint it. Now that would have a real vintage look to it.
Jorgen Udvang
Subscriber Member
Me thinks the biggest different between the M9 and the MM will be in the mindset of the photographer. The same way as there's a big difference between going on a diet in New York City and being stranded on a desert island with no food. One thinks differently, and often more creatively, when there are no options.
jonoslack
Active member
Absolutely - hooray hooray - you hit the nail on the head. It's the biggest difference . . it isn't, however, the only difference!
alas, i don't have lenses quite that vintage... but i do have some golden oldies (like the v.1, 8 element 35 Cron) that i will shoot on an MM first chance i get!i wonder how the M9M would render with vintage lenses ( saying thats my bag
1930s summar on a 18 MP mono sensor!