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Returned M8 Maze Pattern - faulty sensor?

jonoslack

Active member
HI There
I took a few shots today, and this one sprung out at me - I know one can sometimes expect moire, but I haven't seen that maze pattern since the very early days . . . is it a faulty sensor?



this is the original




it was taken with the Zeiss 25mm

So, is it just moire that one sometimes gets, or is it a faulty sensor?
 

Woody Campbell

Workshop Member
Jono -

If it's the color banding in the roof of the cottage that you're referring to, it looks to me like classic moire. The downside of no AA filter.

What experiences have people had with software fixes for moires? (This one is fairly easy - desaturate the roof in PS - but some of them are much more difficult).
 

Bob

Administrator
Staff member
The capture one moire filter does a fair to middling job.
One might also shoot with a softer lens :)
-bob
 

jonoslack

Active member
Jono -

If it's the color banding in the roof of the cottage that you're referring to, it looks to me like classic moire. The downside of no AA filter.

What experiences have people had with software fixes for moires? (This one is fairly easy - desaturate the roof in PS - but some of them are much more difficult).
Hi Woody
thanks for chipping in :rolleyes::)
It isn't the moire pattern - I can deal with that quite easily with the Aperture tool (and it's rare anyway). it's the maze pattern on the roof. Here is a 500% crop:

 

Tim Gray

Member
I don't have an M8, but... that's exactly what you can get when you don't have an AA filter in front of the sensor. Perfect example of aliasing and moiré.

And yes, I'm talking about the color banding *and* the maze pattern.
 

jonoslack

Active member
Thank you Tim
I had pretty much came to the same conclusion - I have seen it before, but a long long time ago (the M8 does pretty well with moire anyway).

Aliasing - right - I'll relax!
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
Jono:

I think that is pretty classic "color moire" and as Tim states is one of the downsides of no AA filter. The other sad fact is that while pattern moire is relatively easy to deal with, color moire is not -- usually requires altering the angle of the sensor slightly at capture to avoid it...
 
V

Vivek

Guest
Jono, Do you see this with other lenses (I doubt it)?

I also think it is aliasing because the Zeiss 25mm is too sharp for the M8 sensor.
 

jonoslack

Active member
Jono:

I think that is pretty classic "color moire" and as Tim states is one of the downsides of no AA filter. The other sad fact is that while pattern moire is relatively easy to deal with, color moire is not -- usually requires altering the angle of the sensor slightly at capture to avoid it...
Thanks Jack
as I say, it's one (unimportant) shot, and I haven't seen it otherwise for a long time. One get's paranoid with M8's after they've been back to Leica!
Thanks for joining in
all the best
 
N

nei1

Guest
Jono,not to worry,the owner of the cottage is a cornish rugby supporter and hes painted the roof,KERNOW!!!!!:thumbs::D_____ regards,Neil.
p.s.I think my "hello" from cornwall has just arrived,my accent is thick with rrrrrrrs all of a sudden!
 
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jonoslack

Active member
Jono,not to worry,the owner of the cottage is a cornish rugby supporter and hes painted the roof,KERNOW!!!!!:thumbs::D_____ regards,Neil.
p.s.I think my "hello" from cornwall has just arrived,my accent is thick with rrrrrrrs all of a sudden!
Arrrh - actually, with me it's the o's and u's. I've been spending the last few days taking pictures of Clowds and Cowwws
:)
 

jonoslack

Active member
Jono, Do you see this with other lenses (I doubt it)?

I also think it is aliasing because the Zeiss 25mm is too sharp for the M8 sensor.
HI Vivek
I've seen it so rarely that i'm not sure - but it makes sense. Actually, I really like this lens - I was considering getting the new Leica 24 f3.4 . . . but it seems rather an extravagance when I already have the crispy Zeiss.
 

jonoslack

Active member
Hi Jono, This is one of the lenses I covet (Shh.....:)).:)
:eek: So it's not just me!
I swapped with Vieri for the E60 21mm leica (I found it hard to frame, and I don't like using external viewfinders), and I also had the 50mm sonnar from him. They are both coded, and they've turned out to be big favorites. The sonnar is very reminiscent of the Nocti at f1.5, but by f2.8 it's a real Zeiss.

The 25 is just sooooo sharp, right to the corners,a real contrast to the ZF lens I had with the Nikon gear (must sell that).
 

Peter Klein

New member
Jono:

When a screen hits your eye
With a strange DPI
That's a Moiré.


(Shamelessly stolen from Wikipedia, with profuse apologies to Harry Warren, Jack Brooks, and Dean Martin).

--Peter
 
3

35mmSummicron

Guest
Jono,

I don't believe there is anything wrong with your M8 sensor.

I have seen this on rare occassion on mine--I have also seen this on rare occassion with my Canon 5D when I was shooting in Paris.

What I attribute this to is the sensor trying to resolve detail/texture (usually) very far away (IE: cityscapes) that I suppose is just too fine for the sensor. Keep in mind that pattern won't really showup unless you print WAY bigger than 13inx19in....

/a
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Jono:

When a screen hits your eye
With a strange DPI
That's a Moiré.


(Shamelessly stolen from Wikipedia, with profuse apologies to Harry Warren, Jack Brooks, and Dean Martin).

--Peter
Hey that was actually our wedding song if you can believe that. No joke
 

Hank Graber

New member
Are you using Phase One? That pattern is easily provoked in Phase One with the M8. I had seen it with the Canon 1Ds as well but the M8 files are more sensitive to it. Try different settings or another raw converter to see if it changes or eliminates the pattern.
 

Peter Klein

New member
Jack: Thought that would elicit a groan or two. :ROTFL:

"That's Amore" appeared in the Dean Martin/Jerry Lewis comedy The Caddy in 1953--the year I was born. The song was written a year earlier. Yes, Dino (aka "Mr. Cool") recorded it, and it became one of his signature tunes.

But you don't have to 1950s-vintage or older to know the song, as it crops up in pop culture all the time. It was used prominently in "Moonstruck" (1987) starring Cher, Nicholas Cage and Olympia Dukakis.

More than you ever wanted to know:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thats_Amore

Guy: Why not? it's a perfectly good song. We traveled to Italy a few years ago, and I heard it played in a neighborhood restaurant in Rome. So I was singing along in English, and the locals were singing in Italian, and we had a great time. They were very impressed that I knew it.

Perhaps that motivated this series (film, M4-P, several pictures on the page):
http://users.2alpha.com/~pklein/italy/amore.htm

--Peter
 
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