Hmmm . . . no M lens announcements? Weren't we expecting a 28mm Lux?
The R adapter is quite interesting. I guess I wonder why now and not before . Anyway the other issue is some of them are old designs and how they will hold up, great on a 10 mpx fat pixel DMR but times have changed to a more demanding smaller micron sensor. My bet they will be fine but something to think about and now need to go find them in the deep corners of shops. LOL
Geez just thinking of the 180 F2 just makes me silly thinking about it. I'm actually kind of thinking about it again. I will certainly wait till its all out and settled down but I always said I want to retire with a M in my hand. Now retire I mean commercial shooting and I'm working on that right now. I'm actually looking for a job. I want out of freelance commercial shooting but stay in the business.
LOL. It's funny I saw something in the specs I suggested a long time ago with Stephan Daniels in a bar and we talked about all this electronic stuff but the lit up frame lines was my idea. Now not sure it came from me exactly but it gave me a chuckle when I saw that in the press release. Leica is pretty good at listening to ideas sometimes. I miss my buddy over there Christian but love to review this damn thing for sure.
One question witht he evf and a polarizer, are polarizer easy to work with the evf?
Anyone is annoyed by the use of AA filter on the M sensor? I find it quite a deal breaker to be honest, but perhaps it is a weak one.
M262 ZM 25/2.8 35/1.4 50/2 85/2
Funny to see that they finally sourced gorilla glass and dropped this whole sapphire nonsense. Probably shaved a few hundred from the bottom line. Why they couldn't have done this from the get go with the M8 is beyond me.
Otherwise looks interesting. I'll probably pick up a used one here on DPI in a year or so from now.
Thorsten says No AA-filter ...
See for yourself here: leica.overgaard.dk - Thorsten Overgaard's Leica Pages - (Leica M10 or) Leica M and Leica ME Digital Rangefinder Camera - First Impressions from Photokina
All the best.
Bart ...1 Member(s) liked this post
I already saw the link above. Maybe Thorsten can confirm?
M262 ZM 25/2.8 35/1.4 50/2 85/2
So whats the focus assist button on the front do exactly? The make or break for me on this camera will be the high ISO performance in low light and the video quality. Had an M8 and was completely frustrated at the low light high ISO results. Uber noisy. My 5D Mark 2 puts out no noise on 4000 ISO (if not higher I'm sure but I never need to go higher) so that's my frame of reference. Mind you I haven't even shot an M9 so I don't even know how improved it is over the M8. Moving on - certainly video isn't necessary on an M but if it's a feature, I want it to be good. The grip has great extra use/accesories, seems a bit big though since I'm use to seeing the size of the bassplate. I'm curious if they are another brand will make a slimmer grip that doesn't have the bells and whistles.
So, just to be clear... Does the new M have an AA filter, or not?
No aa filter
Over-all, very interesting Photokina for Leica ... IMO. They have been quite busy!
The new M is most certainly food for thought if M is your weapon of choice. I found this video to be pretty convincing, including initial indications of IQ (which remains to be investigated further):
John Dooley demonstrates The Leica M on Vimeo
The Key aspect is that the more traditionalist M user like me can ignore many of the do-dads and add-ons, but they are there should interests change. Basically a new M choice with different performance characteristics than the M9.
ISO 6400 is plenty for me, as long as the 3200 is good. I seriously doubt it will take three firmware updates to zero in the new M's IQ. I think Leica gained experience with the M8s and M9s and has a better grip on this. More importantly, M users have learned a lot, and quick sharing of techniques will shorten the learning curve to arrive at that M look. Not only is the company smarter, so are we.
For those wishing to trim down gear choices, but still have an occasional need for a longer lens, the R option seems just the ticket. Even the great 75s, 90s and M135AA will become for more usable when needed.
Those into video in any big way probably will dismiss the M except for some special lens applications ...like use of the Nocti or 21/1.4 (think Stanley Kubrick). So, something like the new Sony A99 is definitely the better choice compared to anything else other than a full blown video camera system. However, for the "gentleman" shooter, the ability to use both M and R glass will have its video attractions.
Studio/location shooters have new options to incorporate the M camera into the work-flow ... the sync port in the new base grip speaks to that.
Then there is the S:
24mm, 30-90 zoom, Elpro for the S180mm, and a surprise 120 T/S for the S system ... evolutionary performance enhancements for the S Body, all in the right areas. Improves and diversifies the S kit. S lens emphasis at this launch with no M lenses being announced shows serious commitment to the S system. Kudo's to leica
Odd to place any attention on the special "Lego Clown" edition X2. Reminds me of when Porsche made orange 911s with green interiors.
over-all, Good Job Leica!
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Even my first feeling about the "M" announcement was not so postive I think it will come down for me how the IQ/look compares to the CCD-M9 sensors I am used to.
I would not need to extras like video, and I prefer to use OVF but I agree for certain applications the option EVF doesnt hurt. Even though I find the solution of the x-pro1 with hybrid viewfinder much more "elegant" (but then the Fuji is not a rangefinder)
If I had allready R-glass -fine - but I still wonder how balanced the package feels.
I like it
website under construction
on the EVF it really depends on how good the implementation is - it could be a godsend for Nocti, 90 chron and 135 AA users. EVF also provides an additional tool for working with some very good lenses with focus shift issues.
I'm assuming resolution about the same as the MM (which I'm very happy to have and will be very happy to keep). I think at this point the MM out resolves a lot of older glass - the incremental resolution doesn't improve the image - it just shows up lens faults. This leaves me skeptical on the R lenses. A few may be fine but many won't. Of course there are other Leica M adapters available from third parties and the EVF opens up a world of specialized and interesting lenses (the Canon 24 TS comes to mind for example).
But it really comes down to images quality and we won't really have a view of that until some trusted reviewers get their hands on finished cameras.
All in all a very interesting evolution. The really good news is that this will help keep Leica in good financial shape for another product iteration.
I'll probably be looking for a way to tape over the video button so I don't accidentally fill my cards with junk.
Are any of your guys married, or at least have a steady girlfriend? First you talk about everything you want in a body and when the company finally delivers that you complain about her hair color. Tough crowd.
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BTW, it is called the M Type 240. Nice ring, don't you think?
Over all I like the new M. I would have preferred a built in EVF, but better actually to not get a hybrid finder and keep optical and electronic apart.
For some older lenses with focus shift the LV is a great feature, especially thinking about my 1.0/Nocti, which is now suddenly getting useable again.
WRT old R glass I am VERY sceptic, as most of these lenses are easily 20 year old designs and simply will not be up to this demanding 24MP sensor without AA filter.
Will I get one? Still not sure yet, as there are other interesting solutions available meanwhile
SLR lenses in general perform better on digital sensors than RF lenses, due to the basic design constraints of the SLR mirror and deeper lens mount registration, so I expect most will do reasonably well. I'm eager to see how well my favorite Nikkors do once I have the new M; they work very well on Olympus FourThirds, Panasonic Micro-FourThirds, and Ricoh GXR-M APS-C bodies so far. Pixel density of the 24x36 @ 24Mpixel format is a little bit lower than 16x24 @ 12Mpixel (36 mm^2 @ Mpixel vs 32 mm^2 @ Mpixel) and both the GXR-M and new M are without AA filter, so the geometry factors of the larger format are the most important influence.
Godfrey - GDGPhoto Flickr Stream1 Member(s) liked this post
Anyone else notice that the CMOSIS chaps also produce a 70 megapixel 35mm sensor? :O
Love the M. Never considered myself to be a Leica guy, but I'll definitely be checking it out in Cologne.
As for the AA filter, it is not mentioned and not shown in the brochure. I forgot to ask directly but should be doing a video interview with Stefan Daniel tomorrow and will find out there.
I bought and have been using the Olympus version with the X2 ... same piece. Very nice.
Have to get to a store and try it. I really need to get this whole thing in my hands. I'll send Leica a note for press demo so I can do a review on it.
I'm very disappointed that the size has increased(again) vs. a film M or M9. My guess is this is due to the EVF which(being external) is a no go. I'd like to see a hybrid finder without an add on OR, better yet, a CMOS sensor M with the same ol' beautiful rangefinder we've enjoyed all these years. Just keep the size down. My M9 is a little chunky vs. the MP, and this new M - it's creeping up on the Digilux 2 brick in size.
Just a minor warning on this adapter :
To mount 3 cam i.e. modern lenses, it is necessary to modify the adapter by filing a way about 1mm of the left edge of the R mount at 120degrees from the release lever.
Recently I've been using it with a Apo Telyt 180/3.4 on the 2x crop OM-D with good results. IBIS really becomes essential when using magnified EVF focus.
Using it on the GXR is a lot harder - no IBIS and poorer EVF.
I hope the M10 edge peaking works as a better alternative.
[QUOTE=Guy Mancuso;451848]The R adapter is quite interesting.
By chance (or technique) do you know if this adapter close the iris of lenses when you take the picture ?
Maybe it will mean I can nearly afford a second hand M9-P!
As I understand it (and on the basis of other reports) the size of the body itself is so close to that of the M9 as to make no difference. The 5mm difference in width on the specs is due to the thumbgrip on the back - this isn't direct information from Leica, but I'm almost certain that this isn't a bigger camera (it looks like it IS slightly heavier though).
Perhaps Thorsten could enlighten us on this matter as well?
all the best
Just this guy you know
No (at least, I imagine not). Why should it? you set your aperture and focus at the correct aperture just like any mirrorless camera with a 3rd party lens. Stop down metering is then a thing of the past. The EVF will gain up to the brightness you have set whatever the actual Exposure value.
all the best
Just this guy you know
Set the distance with closed aperture is not so easy if you do macro, for instance, or even portraits.
All the best
M262 ZM 25/2.8 35/1.4 50/2 85/21 Member(s) liked this post
What a gorgeous modern camera as seen in the video. I just wish I could imagine that the FF Sony Nex won't just make so much more sense when it comes out (as it must).
I am not a painter, nor an artist. Therefore I can see straight, and that may be my undoing. - Alfred Stieglitz