Jumping in to MF!! P45 or H3DII-39? Advise..Please :)

[KETCH ROSSI]

These look like file sizes for the P45.
P45=39 Megapixels * 3 (RGB=3 channels) =117 MB (not sure why their files are 112MB)
24 bit means 8 bits per channel.
48 bit is 16 bits per channel so double the file size and CMYK is four channels so in 16bit is nearly 300MB.

Clear as mud?
Nick-T

Yes Nick they are of the P45, and understand now, but the Hassy can shoot just the same with full 16Bit per channel and 48Bit RGB, even so they list only 8Bit Tiff and full 16Bit Color, but they do mean per color, right?

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Keith, Nick is a great guy to chat about everything Hassy so do tap him on that system. I feel many time it sounds like I speak only of Phase but that is what i know and Hassy makes great stuff as well and leaf also but I do feel handicapped by not knowing those systems as well but i would rather those guys jump in with the correct data than me guessing at it which i never like to do.

 

[KETCH ROSSI]

thanks Guy, definitely will, as it is important I make my decision based on Correct info on both systems, especially when the full Move will see me spending well over 50K on either system!

Btw, my name is Ketch not Keith

 

[Nick-T]

Yes Nick they are of the P45, and understand now, but the Hassy can shoot just the same with full 16Bit per channel and 48Bit RGB, even so they list only 8Bit Tiff and full 16Bit Color, but they do mean per color, right?

Correct. It can be confusing, "8 bit" is used interchangeably with "24 bit" as most people are dealing with 3 channel files (like RGB). Thus 16bit and 48 bit are also synonyms.

To answer your question both Phase and Hasselblad are using the same chip (p45/H3d39) and are both capable of producing excellent files.
Nick-T

Oh and thanks Guy

 

[KETCH ROSSI]

Correct. It can be confusing, "8 bit" is used interchangeably with "24 bit" as most people are dealing with 3 channel files (like RGB). Thus 16bit and 48 bit are also synonyms.

To answer your question both Phase and Hasselblad are using the same chip (p45/H3d39) and are both capable of producing excellent files.
Nick-T

Oh and thanks Guy

thanks for the clarification Nick, then here is only really about choosing the System, not the DB, which is good as I have been considering exactly that for first and most important factor, camera system and lenses, as well as support and add ons for various works.

 

[thomas]

Correct. It can be confusing, "8 bit" is used interchangeably with "24 bit" as most people are dealing with 3 channel files (like RGB). Thus 16bit and 48 bit are also synonyms.

the "funny" thing with these "specs" is that they have absolutely nothing to do with the camera/DB as these are the files sizes of the resulting TIFs after processing. The actual RAW file (uncompressed) of the P45 is around 50MB, period

edit:
it's the same with this nonsense:

Fileformat:
(Phase One IIQ RAW)
TIFF-RGB
TIFF-CMYK
JPEG

Color Management:
RGB
embedded ICC profile
CMYK

... that is all referring to Capture One, not to the DB that produces RAW files in TIF (now in IIQ) without any color space (at least in the sense of an ICC profile color space)

 

[thomas]

thanks for the clarification Nick, then here is only really about choosing the System, not the DB, which is good as I have been considering exactly that for first and most important factor, camera system and lenses, as well as support and add ons for various works.

so try to get both in your hands... this is essential before buying. Differences are little and it boils down to what you prefer personally, how well the overall workflow goes and maybe which acessories you'd like to have (e.g. Mamiya has no changeable viewfinder, Hasselbald has... Too, there is the HTS adapter and though I am not very impressed of what I've heard and seen compared to high end tech camera solutions this might be the very tool for your occasional architecture stuff).

 

[dougpeterson]

I know you said you're heading out to LA, but if you want to change that up for the beautiful city of Miami or Atlanta we'd be happy to pick you up at the airport, set up a shoot for you to try the Phase One system, as well as have you do an entire workflow from pre-capture to processing/retouching.

Both systems are indeed great options; I'm openly biased (see my signature) towards Phase One and would be happy to show you were I think these backs have some very significant advantages.

For tethered capture you might consider looking at the trends among digital techs. Capture One is a favorite among digital techs for its very fast, stable, and feature-rich tethering. Having one program which can tether and process both dSLR and digital back files is also very nice.

If you're very serious about architecture the chances are extremely good that at some point you'll be looking at flat-plate technical cameras such as the Cambo Wide RS and here Phase One has a large advantage in that no external battery or storage device is needed since Phase One backs contain a battery in the back.

As noted several times above the image quality out of either digital back is going to be great in most conditions. However, you should test both systems at high ISO and long exposures where the Phase One system (IMO - please go test to see) really shines.

We have an upcoming workshop with Jeffrey Jacobs in Miami. This would be a really really great place for you to come and learn technique from an undisputed master of architectural photography as well work hands-on with the Phase One gear.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
__________________
Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One, Leaf, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870 *| *Cell: 740.707.2183
Newsletter: Read Latest or Sign Up
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[KETCH ROSSI]

so try to get both in your hands... this is essential before buying. Differences are little and it boils down to what you prefer personally, how well the overall workflow goes and maybe which acessories you'd like to have (e.g. Mamiya has no changeable viewfinder, Hasselbald has... Too, there is the HTS adapter and though I am not very impressed of what I've heard and seen compared to high end tech camera solutions this might be the very tool for your occasional architecture stuff).

Definitely will, even so I already have with the Hassy with both the H1+P30 and H3DII-31, when I friend came t my studio when it was open last winter, and I was immediately in Love with the system, but wanted to make sure I gather as much info as possible before making the move.

I think I just did

I know you said you're heading out to LA, but if you want to change that up for the beautiful city of Miami or Atlanta we'd be happy to pick you up at the airport, set up a shoot for you to try the Phase One system, as well as have you do an entire workflow from pre-capture to processing/retouching.

Both systems are indeed great options; I'm openly biased (see my signature) towards Phase One and would be happy to show you were I think these backs have some very significant advantages.

For tethered capture you might consider looking at the trends among digital techs. Capture One is a favorite among digital techs for its very fast, stable, and feature-rich tethering. Having one program which can tether and process both dSLR and digital back files is also very nice.

If you're very serious about architecture the chances are extremely good that at some point you'll be looking at flat-plate technical cameras such as the Cambo Wide RS and here Phase One has a large advantage in that no external battery or storage device is needed since Phase One backs contain a battery in the back.

As noted several times above the image quality out of either digital back is going to be great in most conditions. However, you should test both systems at high ISO and long exposures where the Phase One system (IMO - please go test to see) really shines.

We have an upcoming workshop with Jeffrey Jacobs in Miami. This would be a really really great place for you to come and learn technique from an undisputed master of architectural photography as well work hands-on with the Phase One gear.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
__________________
Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One, Leaf, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870 *| *Cell: 740.707.2183
Newsletter: Read Latest or Sign Up
RSS Feed: Subscribe

Thanks for the offer, unfortunately even so I love Miami, used to leave there , my business in Production takes me to LA on a tight schedule, and do to some help + my decision has just made to go with a H3DII-39 system to start out with, so I even so I will remain open to try out the Phase ONe, I will start working with the Hassy.

So thanks every one, this actually went pretty fast!

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Certainly did . Sounds like you had a lot of it down already which is great. Good luck and sorry for messing up your name. I can't remember mine after lunch so don't take offense.:ROTFL:

Nick your welcome.

 

[KETCH ROSSI]

Certainly did . Sounds like you had a lot of it down already which is great. Good luck and sorry for messing up your name. I can't remember mine after lunch so don't take offense.:ROTFL:

Nick your welcome.

Haha, that makes two of us Guy so no worries there and I appreciate you and this forum for the help, and I knew that this was a good idea, and so it was, and thanks to this forum and this thread I made my final decision and made some new friends in the process always a good thing

 

[thomas]

I was immediately in Love with the system

that's definitely solid ground for a buying decision.
have fun!

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Haha, that makes two of us Guy so no worries there and I appreciate you and this forum for the help, and I knew that this was a good idea, and so it was, and thanks to this forum and this thread I made my final decision and made some new friends in the process always a good thing

Absolutely and always ask the questions along the way , lot's of good folks here to help spend your money that is for sure. :ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL:

 

[KETCH ROSSI]

Thanks Peter, but as a twenty plus years 35mm media Photographer, I have found its limits in my new line of work, and hence the move to MF, when I say shooting in available light, this is under 5400 to 6000k some bounced off with Silver and white reflectors with some Balk netting blocking, additionally supported by HMI, fluorescents and LED's so I think Ill be alright, and I never shot above 200ISO any way so 400ISO will be plenty, in studio there is no brainer.

But I do agree with you that the 35 system especially the high end FF bodies do bring so much advantage, but not to me were my print sizes go Bill Board and above., and the 13 x 19' is basically used for viewing on the decision table.

 

[KETCH ROSSI]

Absolutely and always ask the questions along the way , lot's of good folks here to help spend your money that is for sure. :ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL:

Haha thanks, post of day :clap:

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Forum title. It's a reality. LOL

Medium Format Systems and Digital Backs "Abandon Hope All Ye Who Enter Here." (Dante)

 

[KETCH ROSSI]

Yeah I knew it was going to be a good ride the moment I read that

 

[thomas]

I never shot above 200ISO any way so 400ISO

note that the usable shutter speeds for handheld shooting are different compared to 35mm cameras. Slower than 1/125'' will be a problem as long as you want sharp images. The mirror offset / shutter delay of the Hasselblad might help here.

 

[Clawery]

Ketch,

I believe Chris Hollo had passed along our name (Capture Integration). I saw that Doug Peterson, our Head of Technical service has already replied to this thread, but please feel free to ask away any questions that you may have.

Chris Lawery (e-mail Me)
__________________
Sales Manager, Capture Integration
Phase One, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870 | Cell: 404.234.5195
Newsletter: Read Latest or Sign Up
RSS Feed: Subscribe[/font]

 

[KETCH ROSSI]

note that the usable shutter speeds for handheld shooting are different compared to 35mm cameras. Slower than 1/125'' will be a problem as long as you want sharp images. The mirror offset / shutter delay of the Hasselblad might help here.

Yes definitely aware of that, most shots outdoors will be in that range and and much faster.