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The Leica S2 System and Image Quality

carstenw

carstenw

Active member
gdwhalen said:
"Easier to sell.." That may not be why some people shoot. Shooting for the market may be a smart $ way to go, it also may not be. That is like writing songs for the market. I happen to think that you have to shoot to touch your own personal soul. Whatever that happens to be.

Not selling out to the market may be idealistic but, if history is any indication, it is the ONLY way to bring yourself real value. I'm not sure anyone remembers or cares about people that can't reach their own souls when they produce art. I know I don't.
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Missed this the first time around; the posts were coming so fast. My comment about easier to sell was just a reply to a comment about selling.

I agree with this, in general. I don't shoot to make money (although I would love to make some money from it, and am taking baby steps in this direction). I shoot primarily for the enjoyment of the process, in fact. Sounds odd, but there you have it. This I could do just as easily with my old M6 as with any newer camera.

Also up there is the enjoyment of the result, of course, and this is where I practice to get better, and why I sometimes upgrade equipment. I see technical flaws in some shots, and upgrade to remove them from future shots.
 
F

fotografz

Well-known member
Equipment is a funny thing. It has two main appeals, maybe even three.

Yes, it is merely a tool in the service of a vision or idea you want to create.

Yet, it does have some appeal as an object unto itself. We all do have a good eye for good looking, well made things.

And then there is some delight in mastering something ... to get control over it. In fact that can become an addiction by itself ... man over machine.
I've worked with hundreds of professional "photo techs" that thrived on mastering the technical aspects of any gear, but couldn't shoot worth a darn.

I have a very rudimentary attitude toward gear ... if I succeed with it then I love it and think it is the most beautiful thing made. If I don't succeed with it, I think it's a piece of crap and ugly ... and I don't care who uses it or how beautiful or wonderful they think it is.

I have an Elephantine memory for gear that failed me. I resent losing one good shot because something didn't do what I was lead to believe it'd do, and I never forget or forgive. (I've been around long enough now to know when I failed, and when it was the tool that failed).

I also truly believe what you select can influence your outcome ... based on your biases and beliefs.

-Marc
 
P

paulmoore

New member
we can't make a photographic image with the gear can we? seems a wonderful and vital part of the equation..sorry but the diana just doesn't do it for me.
 
G

gdwhalen

Guest
carstenw said:
Missed this the first time around; the posts were coming so fast. My comment about easier to sell was just a reply to a comment about selling.

I agree with this, in general. I don't shoot to make money (although I would love to make some money from it, and am taking baby steps in this direction). I shoot primarily for the enjoyment of the process, in fact. Sounds odd, but there you have it. This I could do just as easily with my old M6 as with any newer camera.

Also up there is the enjoyment of the result, of course, and this is where I practice to get better, and why I sometimes upgrade equipment. I see technical flaws in some shots, and upgrade to remove them from future shots.
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Makes perfect sense.
 
Guy Mancuso

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
carstenw said:
It is very expensive, granted, but I don't see how Leica could release a camera any other way :)
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Sure they can depends on really several factors but a easy one is how many units does it take to get back the ROI on that investment. You can do it several ways lower the cost increase the volume of the units being sold or sell high and don't sell as many units. You can get there both ways. The slippery slope here and what i hoped Leica would have done is get as many in the door easily with less costs and sell more or even more important sell more lenses to more people and actually come out way ahead of the game. This is where leica and i differ on pricing. BUT

Lets say we have 50 members right here on the forum and all 50 would buy if the price was lower but we have maybe 3 that will buy whatever it is. Now sit there as a OEM and tell me you would rather sell to 3 instead of 50. Now who is right and who is missing the boat. Now lets ask the 47 poor bastard that can't afford it how they feel. Obviously price is subjective and all that stuff but honestly that is just simple dumb *** logic there and we are all sitting here scratching our heads figuring if there is reason to go rob the bank for one. To me that is not good, you as a company want as many customers as you can get and that base grows into new customers and get that Leica itch that people have. LOL
 
carstenw

carstenw

Active member
Gary, yes, but the colours and the angle and the (dare I say it) crispness of the image add another dimension.
 
carstenw

carstenw

Active member
Yeah, sure! I guess your Hassie had something to do with that shot. What focal length did you use? I would guess, but there isn't enough context there. Okay, I will guess anyway. I am guessing that there was a lot more image, and that you used an 80 or 100.
 
G

gdwhalen

Guest
carstenw said:
Yeah, sure! I guess your Hassie had something to do with that shot. What focal length did you use? I would guess, but there isn't enough context there. Okay, I will guess anyway. I am guessing that there was a lot more image, and that you used an 80 or 100.
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150 and no. The pic took up pretty much the entire frame.
 
Guy Mancuso

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Okay I got two models for Jack and I to shoot on the 9th. One blonde and one brunette with excellent complexion for our test, also hair and makeup artist. Renting a studio for this and Jack is flying over . Also this is being paid for by US so that is our disclaimer on all of it. Just thought people should know this is out of our pockets to do this. BTW if any forum member wants to donate to our efforts you can certainly do that. Contact Jack for that info. We also have a a P40+ and new DF body being sent in from Capture Integration for our tests and that is the kindness from Dave and his crew to support our efforts.
 
G

gdwhalen

Guest
carstenw said:
Damn, I double-guessed myself. My first feeling was 180 or 150. Oh well, I lose.
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Well, if she had warts and was toothless I don't think you would care about the lens!!! :toocool:

Back on topic, I understand everyone wanting to get the best image they can and if they believe that a new piece of glass or a new camera will do it for them - wonderful. But I will always think that content trumps equipment. That is just what I believe.
 
G

gdwhalen

Guest
Guy Mancuso said:
We want to know what's behind that mask. LOL
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Guy, you should send that equipment to me. I can get all the free models you want. Good ones too. My gift to the cause. But there is a catch. I take the pics. :thumbs:
 
M

Mark Gowin

Member
fotografz said:
Equipment is a funny thing. It has two main appeals, maybe even three.

Yes, it is merely a tool in the service of a vision or idea you want to create.

Yet, it does have some appeal as an object unto itself. We all do have a good eye for good looking, well made things.

And then there is some delight in mastering something ... to get control over it. In fact that can become an addiction by itself ... man over machine.
I've worked with hundreds of professional "photo techs" that thrived on mastering the technical aspects of any gear, but couldn't shoot worth a darn.

I have a very rudimentary attitude toward gear ... if I succeed with it then I love it and think it is the most beautiful thing made. If I don't succeed with it, I think it's a piece of crap and ugly ... and I don't care who uses it or how beautiful or wonderful they think it is.

I have an Elephantine memory for gear that failed me. I resent losing one good shot because something didn't do what I was lead to believe it'd do, and I never forget or forgive. (I've been around long enough now to know when I failed, and when it was the tool that failed).

I also truly believe what you select can influence your outcome ... based on your biases and beliefs.

-Marc
Click to expand...
Marc, you make a good point here. I have found that new gear sometimes drives my desire to shoot more and try new things (sorta along the lines of our "mastery" case). Every once in a while a new camera comes along that revitalizes ones photography. I keep hearing the mantra that its the photographer not the camera, but there is no doubt the camera does influence the photographer's psyche good or bad.
 
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