P65+ and ColorChecker Passport

[David Rosenzweig]

I am trying to use the X-Rite ColorChecker Passport with a P65+/H2 camera and have not been able to get it to work. When the ColorChecker is photographed with a Nikon D3x or Canon 1Ds MKIII the profile is produced correctly.
An email to X-Rite support did not help solve the problem.
Has anyone been successful in producing a profile with a P65+ back?

Thank you,
David

 

[Jack]

If you use C1, the profiles they include for the Phase backs are excellent. If you're trying to use ACR or LR, you are (IMO) wasting image quality as ACR/LR simply doesn't do a good job with Phase 40+ or 65+ files.

Cheers,

 

[dfarkas]

I am trying to use the X-Rite ColorChecker Passport with a P65+/H2 camera and have not been able to get it to work. When the ColorChecker is photographed with a Nikon D3x or Canon 1Ds MKIII the profile is produced correctly.
An email to X-Rite support did not help solve the problem.
Has anyone been successful in producing a profile with a P65+ back?

Thank you,
David

David,

You could try to open the P65+ file in C1, and output a DNG. Drag the resulting DNG file into the standalone Color Checker Passport program. Then, if you are using LR for DAM and further editing after conversion, you should have a better DCR profile. You may want to check out Michal Reichmann's workflow. He uses a combination of C1 and LR pretty successfully.

If you are trying to generate a profile for C1 for your P65+, the Color Checker Passport probably isn't going to work. You'll need an EyeOne XT or Profile Maker 5 package to generate ICC camera profiles.

David

 

[Jack]

Actually, the Passport will work fine in C1, but you'd use the Color Editor tool generate an ICC profile that you can save and call up later.

 

[Christopher]

For me the best way of working is CF card --> LR --> sort edit select --> Develop raw files to tiffs in C1 --> import in LR and finish the files

 

[tashley]

I speak as one frustrated by X-rite's rather rude 'customer service' but my understanding from them is that that the Passport and its associated software can produce only DNG profiles and not ICC profiles and therefore is not suitable for use in C1 unless somehow round tripped through LR or the Passport software. Sounds like Jack has a way to make this work in C1 though and I'd love to learn how to do it!

quote from support email:

'Sorry for misunderstanding,

ICC profiles cannot be created with ColorChecker Passport, but with
other X-Rite products.

With i1 Xtreme ICC profiles can be created for monitors, beamers,
scanners, digital cameras
(ColorChecker SG needed) and printers.

http://www.xrite.com/product_overview.aspx?ID=1240

http://www.xrite.com/product_overview.aspx?ID=938

Perhaps you could spend a second more in reading the product
description, the comprehensive
user manual and the related articles on the xritephoto website, where
this is clearly stated.

http://www.xritephoto.com/ph_product_overview.aspx?ID=1257&Action=Suppor
t&SupportID=5118&catid=28

And within the ColorChecker PASSPORT video is nothing stated otherwise.

Regards,

Wolfgang Renner '

 

[Eden]

If you use C1, the profiles they include for the Phase backs are excellent. If you're trying to use ACR or LR, you are (IMO) wasting image quality as ACR/LR simply doesn't do a good job with Phase 40+ or 65+ files.

Cheers,

Jack: Could you clarify -- once a P-40+ RAW file is adjusted and processed in C1 with its native profile and then sent to LR as a TIFF for further editing, is there a problem, or do you just mean don't start in LR?

Thanks,

Lynn Noah (about to upgrade from P-21 to P-40+)

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Don't start in LR, you want to start in C1 is the preferred method, save as a Tif or DNG than people bring into LR for other work. I don't normally work this way but some folks do and my guess is mostly for the cataloging and some feature sets in LR. I have the P40+ and in C1 the profiles for it are pretty much dead on the money. LR is basically dumb to the Phase files. I never get out of C1 except to CS4.

 

[David Rosenzweig]

I appreciate the replies....here's my concern...foregetting C1 for the moment....I would expect that using Lightroom and the X-Rite software that since the image imported into LR is converted to DNG that it should not matter what camera was used to produce the original image. What I don't yet understand is why the Color Checker software will process images from both Nikon and Canon cameras but not from the Phaseone P65+ back....I might be doing something wrong here and that's why I was looking to see if anyone with a P65+ back found that the ColorChecker software would process the image and produce the profile in LR.

 

[David K]

Perhaps you could spend a second more in reading the product
description, the comprehensive
user manual and the related articles on the xritephoto website, where
this is clearly stated.

Gotta love a company that responds to a customer inquiry with RTFM :wtf:

 

[docmoore]

I appreciate the replies....here's my concern...foregetting C1 for the moment....I would expect that using Lightroom and the X-Rite software that since the image imported into LR is converted to DNG that it should not matter what camera was used to produce the original image. What I don't yet understand is why the Color Checker software will process images from both Nikon and Canon cameras but not from the Phaseone P65+ back....I might be doing something wrong here and that's why I was looking to see if anyone with a P65+ back found that the ColorChecker software would process the image and produce the profile in LR.

Try DNG conversion with Adobe DNG converter then import to Colorchecker Passport software to develop DNG profile...then see if ACR can see the profile when a raw is opened. If so LR should also see the profile. This is the only way I can develop a DNG Profile with the Passport on an H3DII file at the present time that can be seen in ACR. It will process by the software if DNG is made by any other way but cannot open it in ACR or LR.


It seems that the critical step is the DNG conversion from raw...why LR cannot open the raw to convert to DNG as Adobe DNG converter does is beyond me.

Bob

 

[David Rosenzweig]

The conversion of the P65+ image to DNG format goes fine.....it's the failure of the ColorChecker Passport application to "digest" the DNG file that I haven't solved yet.....the ColorChecker program starts ok but eventually fails to "see" the pattern and create the profile.....again using the same work flow with images from a Canon or Nikon works well.....it's as if there is something in the P65+ file that even after the DNG conversion the ColorChecker software does not like.
I did write to X-Rite but they did not provide a helpful answer.

 

[docmoore]

The conversion of the P65+ image to DNG format goes fine.....it's the failure of the ColorChecker Passport application to "digest" the DNG file that I haven't solved yet.....the ColorChecker program starts ok but eventually fails to "see" the pattern and create the profile.....again using the same work flow with images from a Canon or Nikon works well.....it's as if there is something in the P65+ file that even after the DNG conversion the ColorChecker software does not like.
I did write to X-Rite but they did not provide a helpful answer.

Is this DNG conversion with Adobe DNG Converter or LR?

Bob

 

[tashley]

Gotta love a company that responds to a customer inquiry with RTFM :wtf:

Believe me I was P***d especially because it was their own video instruction download that IMHO heavily implied that the Passport could be used to produce ICC profiles. Man.....:cussing:

 

[docmoore]

The conversion of the P65+ image to DNG format goes fine.....it's the failure of the ColorChecker Passport application to "digest" the DNG file that I haven't solved yet.....the ColorChecker program starts ok but eventually fails to "see" the pattern and create the profile.....again using the same work flow with images from a Canon or Nikon works well.....it's as if there is something in the P65+ file that even after the DNG conversion the ColorChecker software does not like.
I did write to X-Rite but they did not provide a helpful answer.

David,

Have you tried a Plus file binned at a somewhat smaller file size to test whether the software hangs on the large file size? Say 800 at lower resolution only to see if it will find the target?

Bob

 

[docmoore]

Believe me I was P***d especially because it was their own video instruction download that IMHO heavily implied that the Passport could be used to produce ICC profiles. Man.....:cussing:

Yes,

Kinda interesting that Adobe products do not use ICC profiles for cameras and one has to resort to 24 patches for a DNG profile.

I purchased two CC Passports to do the same and ended up needing the large Colorchecker SG in order to do the ICC profiles with my i1extreme.

Still a good product for those areas you can use it...nice little travel pack to keep from bending the target when carrying a lot of stuff.

Bob

 

[David Rosenzweig]

Using a smaller file size seems to be the answer....setting the back to produce a 10mb file worked fine...thanks for the help here.

 

[Wayne Fox]

For me the best way of working is CF card --> LR --> sort edit select --> Develop raw files to tiffs in C1 --> import in LR and finish the files

I've been using a similar workflow with my p65+ most of the time. On a few shoots I've converted the entire shoot into dng with C1, then done everything in LR. Results have been good, haven't tried comparisons with same files in C1 to see if the conversions have significant differences.

I'm just too dependent on the local adjustments and the interface.

 

[Jack]

I'm just too dependent on the local adjustments and the interface.

You *really* owe it to yourself to try C1 start to finish, then try your local adjustments in LR or CS afterward. I am willing to bet once you do, you'll never go back to LR for your Phase files after that...

 

[Henry Goh]

One of the reason I bought C1 pro was because I found it has about the best color out of the box. If I needed faithful colors, it is very easy to obtain by using the Color Editor. Once I started using C1 Pro, I dropped all my other efforts to color calibrate my cameras.

Although I have not used Passport and its related software, I'm quite sure it won't produce better images for me out of my Canons and Nikons and especially so for my Phase back.

Just my 2 cents..