Starting to play with some S2 files

[dougpeterson]

Oh yes. I have made every normal human effort to master C1's file management (i.e. not that much because it sort of should be almost obvious!) and have failed. How many trash cans does an app need? Why, when you copy an entire folder and all sub folders to an external HD so you can move them from your travel laptop to your main computer do all the LCC profiles you have made go missing?

You only need one session (ergo one trash) can to do what you do with the application.

If you use the EIP format then the LCC's, adjustments, tags, ratings, keywords etc stay with the raw file no matter how/where you move the image.

 

[tjv]

Any more files to share?

 

[Stuart Richardson]

Great work Terry! It's nice to see some examples of the S2 files. I must say I am with tjv and Carsten regarding dynamic range and contrast though. It's funny, slide film has the smallest dynamic range of any film/digital media, yet when you look on a lightbox, it is the one that is most lifelike. I found that when shooting medium format digital the shots looked unnatural out of the box, and part of that is the huge dynamic range can make things look much flatter than they were in reality. It is a fair argument to say that the human eye is capable of seeing a very wide range of brightnesses, but I would counter that it is because of the pupil's constantly shifting aperture and the scanning nature of the eye. For that reason I think slightly contrastier images tend to be more convincingly real, and why HDR in particular almost always looks unnatural. Anyway, more dynamic range IS better in a camera or film, but for me it is better because it gives me more flexibility to decide what to throw away! This was just something that came to mind to me when looking at all the different samples, but I will repeat that the S2 files look great, and I also agree that one of the prime benefits of medium format digital is the flexibility of the files.

 

[Terry]

Any more files to share?

Yes, over the weekend I will do some more. I had to go to Charlotte on business for most of the week.

 

[dfarkas]

Great work Terry! It's nice to see some examples of the S2 files. I must say I am with tjv and Carsten regarding dynamic range and contrast though. It's funny, slide film has the smallest dynamic range of any film/digital media, yet when you look on a lightbox, it is the one that is most lifelike. I found that when shooting medium format digital the shots looked unnatural out of the box, and part of that is the huge dynamic range can make things look much flatter than they were in reality. It is a fair argument to say that the human eye is capable of seeing a very wide range of brightnesses, but I would counter that it is because of the pupil's constantly shifting aperture and the scanning nature of the eye. For that reason I think slightly contrastier images tend to be more convincingly real, and why HDR in particular almost always looks unnatural. Anyway, more dynamic range IS better in a camera or film, but for me it is better because it gives me more flexibility to decide what to throw away! This was just something that came to mind to me when looking at all the different samples, but I will repeat that the S2 files look great, and I also agree that one of the prime benefits of medium format digital is the flexibility of the files.

Stuart,

I agree with you 100%. :thumbs:

I prefer more contrasty and saturated images (like a good slide film). I like actual blacks and actual whites, and find all too often many final images are just plain flat and lifeless in the name of more DR.

...but, having the flexibility in the file to chose what to throw away is key. Then, the photographer is making the decision, and not at the mercy of a camera's limitations.

Terry, anxiously awaiting your S2 images as well.

David

 

[tjv]

Yes, looking forward to seeing more examples.

I was out shooting with my trusty Mamiya 7ii yesterday in the harsh NZ sun and the shifting light, deep shadows from trees and glare off the water on a near by river sent my heart racing - how the heck does one expose on E6 with 100% confidence in that situation? A wide DR digi MF would have cured my anxiety right then and there, I'm sure of it! Then again, I could stop being a masochist and shoot neg film I suppose...

I think it's without a doubt the S2 produces files on par, and in some ways better than other equally specd MF systems. Here's hoping sales volume increase for Leica so cost per unit can eventually come down and more lenses arrive to those how already own the camera. I also hope that Adobe is working on some special magic as part of their end of the deal to help get the best out of the S2 DNG files in LR3. LR is a great program but I agree it's not the best by far and, especially compared to C1, produces a less refined, more digital conversion.

 

[Terry]

I am happy to throw some RAW files up on my public folder for you to download and work with. Just send me a PM and I will copy some over and send you the link.

 

[tjv]

Terry kindly sent me some DNG files today to play with.
Here are some full frame JPG files and their respective ACR develop settings + histograms. Will post crops in a sec.

They sure do take a beating. There is shadow noise but it's easily dealt to and I only used colour noise reduction value of 6 and below for all images. I used no lens corrections for fringing and see there is some CA here and there on f2.5 shots. There is some moire on some wood grain...

I very much like these files from the S2. I don't claim to be a raw conversion expert but there are near enough to my liking. I converted all on my Macbook Pro laptop so colour may be a little off on high end monitors...

Crops to follow...

Tim

 

[tjv]

Ok, here are the 100% crops selected for shadow noise, detail and highlights. Some show CA.

One good thing: My partner who possesses a far greater mind and eyes than I said she thought these files exhibit a three dimensionality she finds lacking in my Mamiya 7 kit but that she liked with my Leica ASPH lenses (she is an artist but not camera literate so didn't mention what lenses specifically just "that Mamiya of yours and your old Leica shots.") I suppose that's an endorsement!

 

[tjv]

Forgot to add the third picture has significant blur from hand holding so don't judge too heavily on the detail...

 

[tjv]

I know there aren't any real profiles available for the S2 yet but I very much like the colour it puts out. I'd love to see some skin tones to back this up though.

Thanks again, Terry.

 

[Terry]

Forgot to add the third picture has significant blur from hand holding so don't judge too heavily on the detail...

Whoops must have sent you a wrong file I was trying to look for that. I can send something else. I was handholding a lot and it was the first time I was using medium format so getting used to DOF, stopping down much more than I'm used to and shutter speed weren't fully engrained.
I have shots with people for skin tones but I didn't want to send the files without their permission. I can ask.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

I know there aren't any real profiles available for the S2 yet but I very much like the colour it puts out. I'd love to see some skin tones to back this up though.

Thanks again, Terry.

Extremely well done review right here

http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12243

 

[Jack]

Extremely well done review right here

http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12243

Extremely well done AND had skin tones

 

[Terry]

Absolutely,
I am not trying to do any sort of review whatsoever. My original post was about what I was learning in the process.

 

[docmoore]

One good thing: My partner who possesses a far greater mind and eyes than I said she thought these files exhibit a three dimensionality she finds lacking in my Mamiya 7 kit but that she liked with my Leica ASPH lenses (she is an artist but not camera literate so didn't mention what lenses specifically just "that Mamiya of yours and your old Leica shots.") I suppose that's an endorsement!

I could not let this pass me by....the following are Mamiya 7 with 65:

Sheldonian

Christ Church Building

I hear this criticism of the Mamiya periodically and personally think that it may not be completely accurate. After shooting Leica M Hassy V and H and Alpa with Schneider and Rodenstock in addition to LF my assessment is that the Mamiya 6/7 lenses can hold their own against any system. I have begun looking for another Mamiya 7II to reaquire a 65 as most of my files with this combination are very pleasing to me. Hard to find a better travel camera for good light.

Now back to the S2!:salute:

Bob

 

[tjv]

Hey Bob, yes I agree. I personally don't find anything lacking with my Mamiya lenses. In fact they're the best I've ever shot. I think what my partner is talking about is the out of focus look and how the S2 files seem show smoother oof areas, making the foreground pop.

Like you, I just opened a box containing yet another M7 lens so my lens collection is still steadily growing despite lusting for a digi MF system...

Tim