A few S2 things

[tjv]

Hi all,

lets not get into another S2 sling fest here, I just want to talk about a few new features the camera has to offer in isolation.

From reading someones description of the new S2 firmware update, many improvements have been implemented. Eg. exposure comp in viewfinder and increased tethered speed. But one improvement, listed by another forum member, caught my eye:

11. Automatic detection of interchangeable focusing screen types.

Does this mean, when using a screen with crop lines, that files can be tagged with metadata so they are automatically cropped when imported into a RAW converter? It seems like a simple thing to implement - as long as there's the ability to turn off the function via the camera menu - and would be a big deal to me, especially if there was a screen available with totally blacked out cropped sides for 4x5 ratio. I'm assuming there would also need to be some electronic metering compensation to make sure the black strips didn't result in overexposure.

Anyway, I genuinely like the form and robust construction of the S2 and I hope the system continues to grow and Leica continues to implement further useful improvements via firmware and software.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

It seems to me you would have to have dedicated software to implement such a feature to actually read those tags.

 

[robmac]

Agree on Guy's comments. No way Adobe or Apple would make the investment to allow that feature for such a small volume user base. Custom software opens up that door.

It sounds like the feature adjusts the metering to compensate , if needed, for the focus screen used. Same as is done by say a Canon user manually via the on-camera menu.

Using off the shelf software you'd be limited to may a feature where the sensor masked itself based on the screen that was installed and it's ratio hash marks. IIRC doesn't the Nikon D3x have this feature for 4:5 ?

 

[Mark Gowin]

11. Automatic detection of interchangeable focusing screen types.

Does this mean, when using a screen with crop lines, that files can be tagged with metadata so they are automatically cropped when imported into a RAW converter? It seems like a simple thing to implement - as long as there's the ability to turn off the function via the camera menu - and would be a big deal to me, especially if there was a screen available with totally blacked out cropped sides for 4x5 ratio. I'm assuming there would also need to be some electronic metering compensation to make sure the black strips didn't result in overexposure.

I am not sure how this is implemented. Plus, I don't know if Leica has developed a focusing screen with crop line. I think the "grid" focusing screen is more like a rule of thirds arrangement, but I am guessing as I haven't seen details on the screen.

I updated the firmware on my S2 and looked at the metadata of a photo in LightRoom. I didn't see any field which indicates the type of focusing screen so I don't see any way to do what you are describing. However, it would be very easy to to make a preset in LR for the S2 which includes the crop you want and apply the preset on import.

 

[tjv]

Yes, you are right. One could just as easily create a preset to crop everything when imported. I just thought it sounded like an interesting feature. I'm pretty sure I read on the official Leica site that they make or will make screens with crop lines. For someone like myself, who would use 4x5 for all personal work but 3x2 for all commercial work, it would be a great feature. It would be even better if the S2 had in VF crop lines a la the D3X, but that's obviously not going to happen with a firmware upgrade.

Anyway, is it considered that most of the issues of the original firmware are corrected now?

I am not sure how this is implemented. Plus, I don't know if Leica has developed a focusing screen with crop line. I think the "grid" focusing screen is more like a rule of thirds arrangement, but I am guessing as I haven't seen details on the screen.

I updated the firmware on my S2 and looked at the metadata of a photo in LightRoom. I didn't see any field which indicates the type of focusing screen so I don't see any way to do what you are describing. However, it would be very easy to to make a preset in LR for the S2 which includes the crop you want and apply the preset on import.

 

[Mark Gowin]

The new firmware addresses most of the items on my wish list, but not all. For example, the S2 has dual memory card slots and you can set the camera to write to the cards in parallel. However, it only does this if you select DNG+jpg - it put the DNG on one card and the jpg on the other. Unfortunately, it still won't write the same DNG to both cards (e.g., for backup). I figured this would have been fixed in this firmware revision, but it isn't. I know Leica is aware of this deficiency. On the bright side, at least the camera firmware is user updateable - no need for a trip to the dealer.

 

[gogopix]

Is it just my impression, but many of Tim's frustrations seem to have gone away with other users and the S2 is slowly but surely showing its metal?

Users here like, and xpixels images are a real step above many - not resolution but and interesting charater of the IQ. I think traditional Leica fans will go for it. Whether their banks go along with their desires, well, time will tell.

Victor

 

[David K]

I'm no expert on the currency markets but I would have thought that the recent (and substantial) drop in value of the Euro vs $US should have afforded Leica an opportunity to drop their prices and stimulate sales. I do like those images that xpixels has been posting lately. Not sure I can put it into words but they are special.

 

[Jack]

Is it just my impression, but many of Tim's frustrations seem to have gone away with other users and the S2 is slowly but surely showing its metal?

FTR, Tim returned his S2 after some frustrations over not being able to get a sensor issue resolved.

Re the S2 itself, it is surely an awesome camera, and will likely be loved by many as soon as it is a more complete system -- which should be any day now with the release of the 35 and 120 lenses imminent.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

The 35mm lens is significantly bigger than the 70mm which seems unwieldily to me. Why that is not sure but 82 mm filter size is huge. These lenses are pretty dang big

 

[TimWright]

Got to play with an S2 in NH last weekend and it really is an amazing camera. The 35 is bigger than the 70 but definitely not unwieldy. The image quality of the lenses wide open is what really makes this system sing. Just need the 350 and a TS lens and I would consider buying in.

 

[gogopix]

But even the 35mm is only FOV of a 28mm. Really need a 28 rectilinear. And 350? why not a modular, with an AF and 2-3 front ends. As it is, most MF are usueless for wildlife. Unless you are Doug Herr! )

Victor

 

[Shelby Lewis]

snip....not resolution but and interesting charater of the IQ. I think traditional Leica fans will go for it.
Victor

Yeah... I'm struggling with this. The sony a900 had this going for it early on (still does). Just something "different". There is something about the look of the files that is compelling. Always have been... but there is also something about how it renders sharpness that looks very 35mm to my eyes. I haven't seen anything that combines both the beautiful leica look and the quality of sharpness of, say, the mamiya/hassy solutions

It's like it has this incredible "look" hiding behind some indescribable veil... but that just may be me.

BUT... only looking at websize images, and not being someone who's played with the cam personally, I'm not at liberty to be taken seriously. I'm still trying to get everything I can out of a 5dii!!!

I applaud Leica with the firmware updates and (finally) getting some more lenses out there. I can't wait to see the results with the new glass.

 

[TimWright]

Victor have a look over on the S2 forum on LUF and in a post by jplomely you can see a moose shot he took with the 180 wide open. I find that many of my wildlife shots are on my 70-200 Canon lens even though I have a 400 and 500. Last time I went for moose I got great shots on my M9 as they really were close.

 

[Mark Gowin]

But even the 35mm is only FOV of a 28mm. Really need a 28 rectilinear. And 350? why not a modular, with an AF and 2-3 front ends. As it is, most MF are usueless for wildlife. Unless you are Doug Herr! )

Victor

Leica is working on a 24mm S lens so the wide end will be covered.

Mark

 

[Mark Gowin]

...and not being someone who's played with the cam personally...

Shelby, if you want to try the S2 just let me know. I live only a couple hours away from you and would be happy to meet up sometime. The only lens I have at this time is 70mm. I'm still saving pennies and deciding what lens to get next.

Mark

 

[dfarkas]

Shelby, if you want to try the S2 just let me know. I live only a couple hours away from you and would be happy to meet up sometime. The only lens I have at this time is 70mm. I'm still saving pennies and deciding what lens to get next.

Mark

Or we could send him an S2 to test drive....

David

 

[Shelby Lewis]

Or we could send him an S2 to test drive....

David

:ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL:

Call Steve Hendrix and ask him what it's like dealing with me while I try and figure out a "budget" for my MF kit, lol! I think he's been talking with me for around 5 years now. I actually am beginning to like the S2 more and more, but man the price. OUCH!

If there is one system that is completely and totally out of my price range... it's the leica system. Anyway... I'm looking RZ anyway. Kinda the opposite of s2, don't you think.

Still I'd love to shoot it!!!

BTW... I'm not laughing AT you guys. I'm really flattered you'd offer. I'm mostly going to be shooting art portraits and faces the next few years with a few primes... so leica could have me covered very nicely. BUT... I'm also taking a family of five back to grad school to get a doctorate. My wife will be in school as well. Both my sons are on the autism spectrum... so we have med expenses. Spending $30K to get a single camera body and two lenses is about as remote a possibility as is colonizing the moon in the next 5 years. I wish that weren't reality!

 

[gogopix]

Leica is working on a 24mm S lens so the wide end will be covered.

Mark

Didn't know that...good news. The 35 would be more a "walkaround' for me (I use the 28 on the M9 and R9DMR) as I use for foreign travel and the WA is more important than the normal. I do use the 50/1.4 on M9 a lot though, and the 70mm seems right with 35/24, pretty good for me
(actually I used the 35mm on an old Leica R4s for 20 years, that I liked better than a 50mm in most circumstances. With the advent of stiching, I just turn, take two shots and get a 25-30MP M9 shot!)

Victor

 

[gogopix]

:ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL:

Call Steve Hendrix and ask him what it's like dealing with me while I try and figure out a "budget" for my MF kit, lol! I think he's been talking with me for around 5 years now. I actually am beginning to like the S2 more and more, but man the price. OUCH!

If there is one system that is completely and totally out of my price range... it's the leica system. Anyway... I'm looking RZ anyway. Kinda the opposite of s2, don't you think.

Still I'd love to shoot it!!!

BTW... I'm not laughing AT you guys. I'm really flattered you'd offer. I'm mostly going to be shooting art portraits and faces the next few years with a few primes... so leica could have me covered very nicely. BUT... I'm also taking a family of five back to grad school to get a doctorate. My wife will be in school as well. Both my sons are on the autism spectrum... so we have med expenses. Spending $30K to get a single camera body and two lenses is about as remote a possibility as is colonizing the moon in the next 5 years. I wish that weren't reality!

I know it may be against Leica's business model, but when a system is expensive, but the manufacturer thinks that it will hold its value, they offer attractive leases. I remember one year I leased a Mercedes 190 (C class today) for a buck a month cheaper than a Honda! It was all because MB residual values were better.

In spite of all the expensive stuff I have I have never spent even $20k in any one year. I parlayed up in increments for the Phase P65+ and have just lived with my purchases (to the point of being boringly faithful to the COntax )

I depends on your POV. If you think it is the rigfht system, and struggle for 3 years, then lose on another system you have not only lost the money on the higher depreciating system, but you also have not had 3 yrs of pleasure from the one you like (BUTTTT gotta REALLLLY like it)

In the long run is likely cheaper. Anyway that's the brainwashing I do to convince myself to wait, buy the best FOR ME, and then live with it for years. I have every camera and almost every lens I ever bought, and like almost all.

Same for cars and audio equipment (that is 25 yrs old, and still holding value - tube Audio Research stuff)

Shelby, I'm not trying to sell you on the S2, but to say that, if you keep it a long time, even an S2 could make sense at its price.

best regards
Victor

PS From what I've seen of your stuff, you will do it justice too!

PPS DIdnt see the bottom part about going back to school. SOmetimes equipment falls WAYYY down in priority realtive to real life. Been there many times. Gear in the end is just gear.