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22mpx systems

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
There are many members here lately that are looking at getting into the MF world and i think it would be nice to start a 22mpx thread because obviously this is cheaper entry point into the MF world. From off the top of my head there are some nice systems here the ZD , Phase 21 and 25 plus the P 30 back and of course Aptus 65 and than the Hassy backs.


Would love to hear what folks have to say about each systems and there thoughts on it.
 
T

thsinar

Guest
... and from Sinar's 22 MPx class:

- the Sinarback eMotion 54 LV: untethered/tethered functions, 4 GB internal hard state memory, CF card slot, display with all setup functions, live video, internal battery, shooting rate of 0.9 second/frame, adapters for all common existing MF brands and LF view cameras (one back fits all), etc ...

- the Sinarback 54 MC: tethered function, active cooling + fan, adapters for all common MF brands and LF view cameras.

- the Sinarback 54 H: single and multishot (4- & 16-shot modes) tethered, adapters for all common MF brands and LF view cameras.

Best regards,
Thierry

From off the top of my head there are some nice systems here the ZD , Phase 21 and 25 plus the P 30 back and of course Aptus 65 and than the Hassy backs.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Thanks Tom but I would still like to hear about too but let's leave out the P30 for now since it will confuse the topic at hand. Thanks
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
... and from Sinar's 22 MPx class:

- the Sinarback eMotion 54 LV: untethered/tethered functions, 4 GB internal hard state memory, CF card slot, display with all setup functions, live video, internal battery, shooting rate of 0.9 second/frame, adapters for all common existing MF brands and LF view cameras (one back fits all), etc ...

- the Sinarback 54 MC: tethered function, active cooling + fan, adapters for all common MF brands and LF view cameras.

- the Sinarback 54 H: single and multishot (4- & 16-shot modes) tethered, adapters for all common MF brands and LF view cameras.

Best regards,
Thierry
Sorry Thierry been up since 4 am my brain is not functioning yet. My bad to miss on the Sinars and yes i want to hear all about them
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Exactly like to hear about some options we may have that we can get a back used or demo for under 15k
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Thanks but truth be told this is so confusing sometimes and trying to get my arms around it all.
 

Terry

New member
If you guys who have in many cases have shot film MF find it confusing, then I feel better. I'm not looking to move to MF (I'm a good many years behind in my development), I like to read the threads and learn. While I've learned a ton so far a lot is just pure Greek to me.
 

irakly

New member
Exactly like to hear about some options we may have that we can get a back used or demo for under 15k
i got a used P25 from adorama rentals for 11.5K. it seems to be a good deal considering rarity of C645 mount, but for other mounts that's where the price seems to be right now.
the biggest appeal of 22mp back was its ability to work with bellows and 1.1 crop. i'd rather have larger sensor with less megapixels than a smaller frame and microlenses like in P30/+. if i am not mistaken, there is the same story with aptus 65s versus 54s.
 

robmac

Well-known member
Re: micro lenses - just how many stop(s) of acceptable performance do they offer vs. the drawback of color shift?
 
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irakly

New member
Re: micro lenses - just how many stop(s) of acceptable performance do they offer vs. the drawback of color shift?
you know, in my opinion based on using digital backs since 2002, colours with kodak dcs proback 645c are noticeably better than with p20. so much better that i still keep it as a backup to the p25. ergonomically, no questions, p20 is far ahead, but when it comes to choosing between convenience and image quality, i choose suffering :)
to be honest, i had limited experience with p20, both times with rollei 6008. since rollei lenses are not in any way inferior to c645 (some of them are actually superior), i cannot blame duller colours on optics. maybe i just did not figure out optimal workflow for the p20, but with kodak everything was right from the very first image.
 

irakly

New member
Re: micro lenses - just how many stop(s) of acceptable performance do they offer vs. the drawback of color shift?
smaller pixels on p30, aptus 65s, etc. cause two problems. first, as you noted, microlenses used with them cause colour shifts with t/s optics. this is annoying, but manageable since the effect is reproducible. the second problem is more severe: smaller pixels deliver narrower dynamic range and photographic latitude. it makes dealing with specular highlights much more difficult. try shooting diamonds with p25 and p30 and see the difference :)
 

EH21

Member
you know, in my opinion based on using digital backs since 2002, colours with kodak dcs proback 645c are noticeably better than with p20. so much better that i still keep it as a backup to the p25. ergonomically, no questions, p20 is far ahead, but when it comes to choosing between convenience and image quality, i choose suffering :)
to be honest, i had limited experience with p20, both times with rollei 6008. since rollei lenses are not in any way inferior to c645 (some of them are actually superior), i cannot blame duller colours on optics. maybe i just did not figure out optimal workflow for the p20, but with kodak everything was right from the very first image.
I'm wondering if there was a color profile that kodak used for their back? Maybe I could try in C1DB for my P20? Same chip after all..... I use the p20 and Rollei 6008 AF and I was thinking the color was quite good, but then I don't have anything to compare it to other than my Canon 5D and leica DMR files.
 

irakly

New member
oh, another thing that i did not like about p20 was its incompatibility with lightroom 1.0. lightroom would open 157x157 pixel images, evidently previews embedded in raw files. things may have changed since then, though.
 

Steve Hendrix

Well-known member
smaller pixels on p30, aptus 65s, etc. cause two problems. first, as you noted, microlenses used with them cause colour shifts with t/s optics. this is annoying, but manageable since the effect is reproducible. the second problem is more severe: smaller pixels deliver narrower dynamic range and photographic latitude. it makes dealing with specular highlights much more difficult. try shooting diamonds with p25 and p30 and see the difference :)
The Aptus 65S does not have microlenses, only the P30+, P21+, and H3DII-31.

Steve Hendrix
www.ppratlanta.com/digital.php
 

irakly

New member
right, i am sorry. it has 7.2 micron pixels, large enough to get away without microlenses. 22-megapixel backs (not leaf), however, have 9-micron cells.
 
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