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Leaf Aptus-II 12 - 80 Mpx!!!
- Thread starter vieri
- Start date
David Klepacki
New member
We used to be a Sinar customer, including both the Hy6 and M camera systems. We asked them if they could custom adapt Aptus-10 backs for these systems. They said they would only do it for a bulk order of 35 backs minimum. Needless to say, we ended up selling off all of our Sinar equipment and switched to another vendor.
So, I believe that if enough people are willing to put the money up front, you could indeed adapt these new Aptus-12 backs to your Hy6/AFi as well. Also, there was about a 15% surcharge over the retail price of the backs in this case.
So, I believe that if enough people are willing to put the money up front, you could indeed adapt these new Aptus-12 backs to your Hy6/AFi as well. Also, there was about a 15% surcharge over the retail price of the backs in this case.
OK, I admit that I would not buy one-since I am just happy with what I have (75LV) and right now it does more than I need.
The price development in MF world is so extreme that I believe here as long as you are not super rich or a pro who really needs the latest and greatest and makes a lot of money with it - it just a lot of money. I could buy my 75LV for a price which others paid 50% more few month earlier and still the value of my MF gear is much lower just after 1-2 years.
The value of Leica M lenses is a dream compared to MF gear.
Back to the question how many people would buy a Hy6 version of that Leaf back:
Even if I were superrich I would only buy such a back form a company where I feel to understand what they plan in the future and where I could rely on their product strategy. Therefore as a Hy6 owner I would rely much more on Sinar than on Leaf, and this discussion here goes in the same direction.
Leaf has sold AFIs, but today it seems they do mainly think in direct future sales/profit. Maybe making a AFI version of that back wouldnt generate direct profit, but maybe those AFI owners would build up trust in Leaf and could be held as a future customer.
Anyways I am glad that both Leaf and Sinar have staid in the market.
The price development in MF world is so extreme that I believe here as long as you are not super rich or a pro who really needs the latest and greatest and makes a lot of money with it - it just a lot of money. I could buy my 75LV for a price which others paid 50% more few month earlier and still the value of my MF gear is much lower just after 1-2 years.
The value of Leica M lenses is a dream compared to MF gear.
Back to the question how many people would buy a Hy6 version of that Leaf back:
Even if I were superrich I would only buy such a back form a company where I feel to understand what they plan in the future and where I could rely on their product strategy. Therefore as a Hy6 owner I would rely much more on Sinar than on Leaf, and this discussion here goes in the same direction.
Leaf has sold AFIs, but today it seems they do mainly think in direct future sales/profit. Maybe making a AFI version of that back wouldnt generate direct profit, but maybe those AFI owners would build up trust in Leaf and could be held as a future customer.
Anyways I am glad that both Leaf and Sinar have staid in the market.
Graham Mitchell
New member
Despite some of the negativity towards the Hy6 here, apparently there is some hope after all 
http://bit.ly/chzNT2
http://bit.ly/chzNT2
BradleyGibson
New member
Yair, I think you must be familiar with my story... I think my track record for purchasing medium format systems speaks for itself.
But after too many experiences of missed deliveries, I can say that I no longer make commitments to this industry based on products that have not yet shipped.
That being said, and speaking only for myself, I would expect to pay what I'd pay for an Aptus-II 12R less the V mount, plus the time and materials for the "customization" work, if you wanted to call it that, to make it into an AFi-II 12.
(My hope would be that Phase has margin in the product itself, and wanting to see the A*-II 12 technology in the field and would seek coverage of costs--not additional margin--on the customization work.)
Alternatively, an upgrade fee (equal to a reasonable Aptus-II 10 to an Aptus-II 12 upgrade fee) + customization costs would also be acceptable--for this charge, I would send in my AFi-II 10 and get back an AFi-II 12.
If either approach sounds reasonable, I invite you to PM me to discuss a way forward.
-Brad
Last edited:
PeterA
Well-known member
Funny thread !
Here is some facts from an Hy6 owner. In fact I swapped Phase One P45+ and body with Bradley for his Hy6 and 75LVr about a month or so before Sinar were announce dead.
I recently sent the Hy6 back to Sinar via the new dealer here in Australia - well not so new anymore.
(oh and LISTEN UP YAIR- too bad Dave isn't your rep for Leaf..and good luck with the mess of spaghetti down here in Australia that pretends to be a dealer..hahah what a Joke)
anyway back to main story..sent the Hy6 back to Sinar to check it out. Seems that the Hy6 I got from Bradley was one of those early bodies which were not quite right and because of the mess with the F&H situation took a while for Sinar to get organised.
They didn't repair it - they sent me a knew body how is that for customer service from a dead camera and a dead company?
As for a Leaf back on the Hy6 - what a great idea!
but seriously i am sick and tired reading from all these dealers of other brands ..how their systems are open...:ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL:
but umm not open to Hy6 ..
yep the GFC was bad timing for the Hy6 release a real pity.
Still it suits me because it is a fantastic camera body with a fantastic set of lenses..Sinar isnt dead either - and I will be adding a film back - listen up all you stuck in pathetic 645 land - real MF starts at 6X6:ROTFL:
just use an Hy6 and check out its lovely UNCLUNCKY shutter ..so smooth ..just try some of that 'real' Schneider glass in Rollie mount or the 110/2 yeah of course you have to have one! or maybe check out its metering system..or its beauitiful WLF viewfinder..
such a great system - good thing I dont give a ratz about what the ..'herd' likes or thinks.
So you keep making backs for H1s and H2s Yair and the occassional 'fantastic' Mamiya bodies ( teh ones were you count to ten after you press the shutter release?? :ROTFL::ROTFL:you know because you KNOW that Phase One dealers are pushing Leaf real hard!!!- hahahahaha gimme a break..:deadhorse:
Seriously - it is ok for people to say "we aren't allowed to make a hy6 mount" because Phase One rules the world... - another thing to say "there aren't any users base" - that is a cheap shot buddy and if Phase One don't like the Hy6 - well sell the rights to someone prepared to actually give the system some life.
cheers all:salute:
Here is some facts from an Hy6 owner. In fact I swapped Phase One P45+ and body with Bradley for his Hy6 and 75LVr about a month or so before Sinar were announce dead.
I recently sent the Hy6 back to Sinar via the new dealer here in Australia - well not so new anymore.
(oh and LISTEN UP YAIR
- too bad Dave isn't your rep for Leaf..and good luck with the mess of spaghetti down here in Australia that pretends to be a dealer..hahah what a Joke)anyway back to main story..sent the Hy6 back to Sinar to check it out. Seems that the Hy6 I got from Bradley was one of those early bodies which were not quite right and because of the mess with the F&H situation took a while for Sinar to get organised.
They didn't repair it - they sent me a knew body how is that for customer service from a dead camera and a dead company?
As for a Leaf back on the Hy6 - what a great idea!
but seriously i am sick and tired reading from all these dealers of other brands ..how their systems are open...:ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL:
but umm not open to Hy6 ..
yep the GFC was bad timing for the Hy6 release a real pity.
Still it suits me because it is a fantastic camera body with a fantastic set of lenses..Sinar isnt dead either - and I will be adding a film back - listen up all you stuck in pathetic 645 land - real MF starts at 6X6:ROTFL:
just use an Hy6 and check out its lovely UNCLUNCKY shutter ..so smooth ..just try some of that 'real' Schneider glass in Rollie mount or the 110/2 yeah of course you have to have one! or maybe check out its metering system..or its beauitiful WLF viewfinder..
such a great system - good thing I dont give a ratz about what the ..'herd' likes or thinks.
So you keep making backs for H1s and H2s Yair and the occassional 'fantastic' Mamiya bodies ( teh ones were you count to ten after you press the shutter release?? :ROTFL::ROTFL:you know because you KNOW that Phase One dealers are pushing Leaf real hard!!!- hahahahaha gimme a break..:deadhorse:
Seriously - it is ok for people to say "we aren't allowed to make a hy6 mount" because Phase One rules the world... - another thing to say "there aren't any users base" - that is a cheap shot buddy and if Phase One don't like the Hy6 - well sell the rights to someone prepared to actually give the system some life.
cheers all:salute:
+1Funny thread !
Here is some facts from an Hy6 owner. In fact I swapped Phase One P45+ and body with Bradley for his Hy6 and 75LVr about a month or so before Sinar were announce dead.
I recently sent the Hy6 back to Sinar via the new dealer here in Australia - well not so new anymore.
(oh and LISTEN UP YAIR
anyway back to main story..sent the Hy6 back to Sinar to check it out. Seems that the Hy6 I got from Bradley was one of those early bodies which were not quite right and because of the mess with the F&H situation took a while for Sinar to get organised.
They didn't repair it - they sent me a knew body how is that for customer service from a dead camera and a dead company?
As for a Leaf back on the Hy6 - what a great idea!
but seriously i am sick and tired reading from all these dealers of other brands ..how their systems are open...:ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL:
but umm not open to Hy6 ..
yep the GFC was bad timing for the Hy6 release a real pity.
Still it suits me because it is a fantastic camera body with a fantastic set of lenses..Sinar isnt dead either - and I will be adding a film back - listen up all you stuck in pathetic 645 land - real MF starts at 6X6:ROTFL:
just use an Hy6 and check out its lovely UNCLUNCKY shutter ..so smooth ..just try some of that 'real' Schneider glass in Rollie mount or the 110/2 yeah of course you have to have one! or maybe check out its metering system..or its beauitiful WLF viewfinder..
such a great system - good thing I dont give a ratz about what the ..'herd' likes or thinks.
So you keep making backs for H1s and H2s Yair and the occassional 'fantastic' Mamiya bodies ( teh ones were you count to ten after you press the shutter release?? :ROTFL::ROTFL:you know because you KNOW that Phase One dealers are pushing Leaf real hard!!!- hahahahaha gimme a break..:deadhorse:
Seriously - it is ok for people to say "we aren't allowed to make a hy6 mount" because Phase One rules the world... - another thing to say "there aren't any users base" - that is a cheap shot buddy and if Phase One don't like the Hy6 - well sell the rights to someone prepared to actually give the system some life.
cheers all:salute:
Waist-Level View Fnder is the true photography, which lets you think more about the picture!
Hy6/AFi body with firmware > ver 3.10 is the thing!
My expectation for the future Hy6/AFi body development is:
1. set ISO directly at body directly;
2. make RGB sensor rock.
Peter, I would be interested to know exactly where you sent your kit (and any contact info you might have). Perhaps others would like to know as well.
Thanks.
yaya
Active member
Hey Peter I've met David last week in Cologne (last time I saw him was at least 3 years ago) he's a great guy,Funny thread !
Here is some facts from an Hy6 owner. In fact I swapped Phase One P45+ and body with Bradley for his Hy6 and 75LVr about a month or so before Sinar were announce dead.
I recently sent the Hy6 back to Sinar via the new dealer here in Australia - well not so new anymore.
(oh and LISTEN UP YAIR
anyway back to main story..sent the Hy6 back to Sinar to check it out. Seems that the Hy6 I got from Bradley was one of those early bodies which were not quite right and because of the mess with the F&H situation took a while for Sinar to get organised.
They didn't repair it - they sent me a knew body how is that for customer service from a dead camera and a dead company?
As for a Leaf back on the Hy6 - what a great idea!
but seriously i am sick and tired reading from all these dealers of other brands ..how their systems are open...:ROTFL::ROTFL::ROTFL:
but umm not open to Hy6 ..
yep the GFC was bad timing for the Hy6 release a real pity.
Still it suits me because it is a fantastic camera body with a fantastic set of lenses..Sinar isnt dead either - and I will be adding a film back - listen up all you stuck in pathetic 645 land - real MF starts at 6X6:ROTFL:
just use an Hy6 and check out its lovely UNCLUNCKY shutter ..so smooth ..just try some of that 'real' Schneider glass in Rollie mount or the 110/2 yeah of course you have to have one! or maybe check out its metering system..or its beauitiful WLF viewfinder..
such a great system - good thing I dont give a ratz about what the ..'herd' likes or thinks.
So you keep making backs for H1s and H2s Yair and the occassional 'fantastic' Mamiya bodies ( teh ones were you count to ten after you press the shutter release?? :ROTFL::ROTFL:you know because you KNOW that Phase One dealers are pushing Leaf real hard!!!- hahahahaha gimme a break..:deadhorse:
Seriously - it is ok for people to say "we aren't allowed to make a hy6 mount" because Phase One rules the world... - another thing to say "there aren't any users base" - that is a cheap shot buddy and if Phase One don't like the Hy6 - well sell the rights to someone prepared to actually give the system some life.
cheers all:salute:
I think you're quoting another person here...I never said there's no user base or that we're not allowed to make backs for Hy6...
It is no secret that most digital backs (from all brands) sold these days are in Mamiya/ Phase One mount...
Yair
Interesting story Peter. I have a similar one - I also purchased a s/h system before the melt down and subsequently talked to the new Australian agent - David Kay - about upgrading the firmware .He organised for it to go back to Sinar for this and adjustment and check over ... like Peter I got a NEW BODY back as mine was one of the original models that could not be upgraded. Apart from the shipping this was done for FREE!!! amazing service especially considering I didnt purchase it new from Sinar. I might add that on the strength of this great service I bought a new arTec and some lenses - David Kay provides truly amazing service ,has a wealth of knowledge and is a all round good bloke!!
One other thing I should have mentioned is that I live in semi remote area of west australia - Ive never met David we live 1000s of kms apart, all our dealings have been on the phone so basically I first rang him saying Ive got a s/h HY6 can you help me out? Seen in that light gives you a idea of how helpful he really is.
I do hope to meet David later this year - and will definitely be buying him a beer!!!
I do hope to meet David later this year - and will definitely be buying him a beer!!!
I'm a bit late, but thank you all, Graham,Peter, t_streng for the info on the Hy6. at closer look it seems to be a very interesting system. very practical/ergonomical thing to have a WLF in combination with this kind of grip. especially when I think of shooting from down low perspective. doing the snake thing on your belly is not a great pleasure in photography… at least not for me
don't know about the hassy HVM and metering option but it doesn't seem to be te same thing. in this case the Hy6 has the edge…BradleyGibson
New member
Peter's thoughts (although I probably would have put them a touch more delicatlely ) very much echo my own experiences, across the brands.
It really was a joy to work with the camera. My issue was with the Sinarback's workflow--using it and getting the pictures into Lightroom was simply much too cumbersome. (For example, it took me two months to go through and process all the work I did on a shoot in Iceland. Typically I would be able to get through that volume of work in 1-2 weeks.)
Leaf took it to the next level with the internal rotating sensor and the tilting screen. Grab your back and put it behind that gorgeous Schneider glass--I think you'll be glad you did.
Peter--I'm curious about the "old" body vs. the "new" bodies--are you noticing any differences as you shoot with it?
) very much echo my own experiences, across the brands.Ergonomically, I've never used a better camera. And that includes 35mm.
It really was a joy to work with the camera. My issue was with the Sinarback's workflow--using it and getting the pictures into Lightroom was simply much too cumbersome. (For example, it took me two months to go through and process all the work I did on a shoot in Iceland. Typically I would be able to get through that volume of work in 1-2 weeks.)
Leaf took it to the next level with the internal rotating sensor and the tilting screen. Grab your back and put it behind that gorgeous Schneider glass--I think you'll be glad you did.
Peter--I'm curious about the "old" body vs. the "new" bodies--are you noticing any differences as you shoot with it?
+2
Waist-level viewfinder is the true medium-format photography.
True film MF photography starts at 6X6
True digital MF photography starts at 48X36, not at 25X37!
I'm better suited with a killer dlsr than with a fixed eye-level MF camera
'Nuf saying
Eduardo
Waist-level viewfinder is the true medium-format photography.
True film MF photography starts at 6X6
True digital MF photography starts at 48X36, not at 25X37!
I'm better suited with a killer dlsr than with a fixed eye-level MF camera
'Nuf saying
Eduardo
+3
Waist level finder has always been the key ingredient for me - I find that by looking on the glass, I can compose and recompose quickly for about 10 different views, until I get the right one. For some reason, the view through a prism just doesn't do the same.
The Hy6 seems to have all the right pieces. Mine was an NOS (new old stock) body from DHW, and a demo Leaf back from somewhere else. Surprisingly, the two went together with narry a problem: DHW upgraded the firmware to the latest, and actually fitted the handle for a Leaf battery, so that the camera would only use one type of battery. What could be better?
The camera works very well, and goes nicely with all the 6000 PQ glass accumulated over 20 years of Rollei shooting. Its not the lightest, nor the smallest, nor the fastest. But boy is it flexible, and responsive. More keepers than ever.
The nice thing IMO is the combination of having a WLF and still metering and AF (even though I still have only limited trust in the AF of the Hy6) and the rotating back (which I love).I'm a bit late, but thank you all, Graham,Peter, t_streng for the info on the Hy6. at closer look it seems to be a very interesting system. very practical/ergonomical thing to have a WLF in combination with this kind of grip. especially when I think of shooting from down low perspective. doing the snake thing on your belly is not a great pleasure in photography… at least not for me
Then you can allways also change the viewfinder to the really nice 45 degrees viewfinder when you want (I use WLF much more often).
The lenses are superb even though some of them quite heavy and big.
Still I admit sometimes a smaller system would have its advantages being less heavy and obstrusive. I wouldnt want to have to use my Hy6 as my only camera system-in this case Iwould rather go something like the S2 or Phamiya or maybe the new Pentax.