Hasselblad system - need your advice

[Dolce Moda]

Why would you want to do that in the first place?

If you want to use Zeiss lenses... buy a V body and be done with it.
Mamiya 645 bodies are crap anyhow.

A 500 series body can be bought for a couple hundred dollars. If you don't like it, you can sell it easily for what you paid for it.

 

[Valentin]

Why would you want to do that in the first place?

If you want to use Zeiss lenses... buy a V body and be done with it.
Mamiya 645 bodies are crap anyhow.

A 500 series body can be bought for a couple hundred dollars. If you don't like it, you can sell it easily for what you paid for it.

Is this your version of saying no?

 

[redrockcoulee]

Can you find a place that rents the two or three systems and rent for a weekend? Or buy a 645 and a 500 series and one lens each and keep the one that works best for YOU. Three decades ago I used the Mamiya 645 and the last couple of years I have used a 500 C/M. For what I was doing then the 645 would have been the better choice however now the Hasselblad is. For what you want would not one of the 645 systems be more suitable for your purpose than the V system?

As far as adapters go, I think most of them cost more than a used camera body. In addition to Mamiya there are Hasselblad, Pentax and Contax 645 as well as others. I was lucky in the first job as my employer purchased the Mamiya for our use and was able to use it for personal stuff all the time and in the Hasselblad case I started working at a place that had a system and was all digital use now so was able to play with it. As soon as I first used it I knew it was 'right' for me and my current interests. I would think if I had asked on this or any other forum what system of MF I should get I would have had all kinds of answers.

I sometimes think it would be nice to pick up some thing like the Pentax 645D, not so much for my style of shooting but so that I can get to use the Hasselblad again (wife took it and is away until Christmas). So I am now back to borrowing from my former employer and unfortunately my friend who still works there likes it now too.

 

[Valentin]

Can you find a place that rents the two or three systems and rent for a weekend? Or buy a 645 and a 500 series and one lens each and keep the one that works best for YOU...

To rent 3 (OK, 2.5 ) systems would be a few hundred dollars. Keeping in mind that a 645AFDII is about $700, I would prefer to spend the money there.

With that said, each system has features that are desirable to me (see bellow).

I will be shooting mostly on location, people, bright light, and I like to shoot wide open.

Mamiya 645
- you can shoot portrait mode
- high shutter speeds
- weight
- AF - not really important

Hasselblad
- Zeiss lenses
- weight
- high flash sync speed - not really important

Mamiya RZ
- you can shoot multiple formats
- you can shoot portrait mode
- high flash sync speed - not really important

I don't have any friends that still have MF systems


ETA: yes, you can shoot portrait mode with a Hassy and it's easier if you add the prism, but that would add a significant chunk to the price

 

[redrockcoulee]

Actually I was suggesting renting film versions. It would be more like one hundred for the two systems at weekend rates. Daily rates seem to be about 50 for the camera and one lens and most places have the weekend rate the same as a workday rate. Or rent each for one or two hours.

This past spring I rented a X-Pan while in Montreal and determined that for me it was a camera I would rather borrow not own. Money well spent cause I also got images that I would not have otherwise.

Monday I received a prism for the 500 C/M from KEH for $39.00 (no meter but then neither does the WLF). For just trying it out and seeing if the equipment is right for you another alternative is to purchase older models and then if you like it and wish to have newer ones you could either sell it, trade it or keep it as back ups.

Sounds to me like you want a 645 but also the Zeiss lenses. Contax !! I have never used one and never even seen the 645 models but isn't that what you want? The lenses for the V system are not overly fast.

 

[Valentin]

Actually I was suggesting renting film versions. It would be more like one hundred for the two systems at weekend rates....

True. Calumet, which is the one that is closest, wants a deposit equal to full replacement. We are talking about a few grand here.

It would be nice to accept my insurance policy which covers rentals.

I'm not sure what I want

You can make an argument for each scenario (except the AF): you can crop the square, you can add the prism ...

One big drawback for the 503 is the 1/800th limit. Even that can be argued: ND filters

I keep running these pros and cons in my head all day long. One minute I think I know which one I want and the next minute I'm back to square one .

Thanks again for your input.

 

[mtomalty]

Valentin,

If you've decide that your budget is $3000 then,really, there's no
room for medium format digital.
You mentioned that the reason for this move was to offer a style
Look that was different from what your 35mm competition offers.
With that in mind I'd seriously look to a Mamiya 7 and a lens or two-among
the sharpest systems ever and the form factor will be a little more
complementary to shooting available light in an event situation

Mark
www.marktomalty.com

 

[Valentin]

Valentin,

If you've decide that your budget is $3000 then,really, there's no
room for medium format digital.....


....and the form factor will be a little more
complementary to shooting available light in an event situation

Mark
www.marktomalty.com

Hi Mark,

I'm not 100% sure that I will use a digital back, but my intention is to do so later down the road. That is why I am looking for something that will take both film and digital.

Also, I will not be shooting weddings/events with this system. I really love my 35mm format for that and the quality of the files is great. This will used as an add-on to what I currently offer. I'm foreseeing to shooting mostly outdoors during the day.

 

[Valentin]

OK, dumb question: in my research, I ran across an adapter that will allow you to use the V lenses on a 645 Mamiya camera.

Does that mean that you gain the high speed flash sync?

 

[fotografz]

OK, dumb question: in my research, I ran across an adapter that will allow you to use the V lenses on a 645 Mamiya camera.

Does that mean that you gain the high speed flash sync?

There are adapters that allow use of all Zeiss V mount lenses ... from both the 500 series C, CF, CFi and CFE type Leaf shutter lenses ... AND the faster max aperture 200 Series Camera F and FE series focal plane shutter Zeiss lenses. The Leaf shutter lenses are used without the Central Leaf Shutter inside the lens, and become a normal lens when mounted on a Mamiya or Contax 645 camera. In either case, operation becomes strictly manual stop down metering and shooting. There is NO high speed sync.

-Marc

 

[Valentin]

There are adapters that allow use of all Zeiss V mount lenses ... from both the 500 series C, CF, CFi and CFE type Leaf shutter lenses ... AND the faster max aperture 200 Series Camera F and FE series focal plane shutter Zeiss lenses. The Leaf shutter lenses are used without the Central Leaf Shutter inside the lens, and become a normal lens when mounted on a Mamiya or Contax 645 camera. In either case, operation becomes strictly manual stop down metering and shooting. There is NO high speed sync.

-Marc

Thanks.

 

[Valentin]

Well, the renting route doesn't look too promising.

I went to Calumet and they have 503CW with film back (no digital), Mamiya 645 with digital back (no film) and no RZ67.

I was hoping to be able to rent the film version for a better comparison; the next best thing was the digital version. None it's possible ... kind of ironic reading the flyer in the elevator: All your renting needs...

It looks like it's not going to happen.

 

[symbolphoto]

I wasn't sure myself, which is why i didn't say anything, but i don't find it surprising that you can't find film backs to rent. I just don't see that being even a remote profit center for these rental shops.

The backs go for cheap on Ebay.. but that stinks that you can't test it out. Nobody in Philly area with film gear? I'd post on LL and in here with 'Philly' in the title Valentin, you may just find someone that has some stuff laying around.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Try KEH.com they sell a lot of used gear

 

[Valentin]

I wasn't sure myself, which is why i didn't say anything, but i don't find it surprising that you can't find film backs to rent. I just don't see that being even a remote profit center for these rental shops.

The backs go for cheap on Ebay.. but that stinks that you can't test it out. Nobody in Philly area with film gear? I'd post on LL and in here with 'Philly' in the title Valentin, you may just find someone that has some stuff laying around.

They have the 503 with film back and I will rent that one out and play with it. I really wanted to do a side by side comparison.

I'm trying to find somebody around with a 645 back that I can borrow since Calumet has the body/lens.

We have a "support" group of photographers and I sent an email out. We'll see how it pans out.

Since I WILL be buying a system, I try to keep all the unnecessary costs down. I rather spend the money on a system.

 

[Valentin]

Try KEH.com they sell a lot of used gear

Thanks Guy. I'm trying to rent one first to help me with my decision.

 

[Valentin]

OK. I guess I should post an update.

I was able to only rent the 503cw. They only rent the Mamiya 645 as a digital kit. I was able to hold it at the store, but I couldn't spend time with it and shoot.

On the 503 ... This is the first time I am shooting with Hasselblad. The WLF is giving me problems. It's not the inverted lateral view that is the problem ... it's staying level (side to side). When you combine the inverted view with leveling the subject, it gets confusing for my brain . The 45/90 prism is out of the question for hand-held photography: too much strain on my wrist.

I have to say that it is one sexy camera, but I'm afraid I'm not going to get used to the way the image looks through WLF. Since I will not be shooting this camera all the time, I don't know if I will get used to it.

On the 645 ... While I only held the camera at the store, it seemed to be a little heavier than the 503. The ELF works better with that camera since it has a grip. I know that you can add a grip to 503 but it will add even more to the weight and cost. When you add all this up, an H system might be a better solution than 503 w/grip.

While at the store, I also played a little bit with a H2. That camera is so much lighter than the Mamiya and 503 and I loved the big viewfinder.

Now, is there any difference between H2, H2F and H2D in regard to functionality/build?


Oh, that RZ67 .... I don't know which term would better describe it: huge, humongous, tank ... that is definitely not a "on location with no tripod" camera

Thanks for listening and for the advice. It's really helpful.

 

[BradleyGibson]

Don't give up on the WLF--it took me two months with the Hassy 501 as my exclusive shooter before it became instinctive. (In fact, now, with live view on point-and-shoots, I now automatically tilt the wrong way--fortunately not a problem I have to deal with very often...)

 

[fotografz]

"Now, is there any difference between H2, H2F and H2D in regard to functionality/build?"

H1 uses the older battery type unless it was upgraded. Discontinued product.

H2 is the upgraded version including a new battery. Can take most any maker's digital back and the Hassey H film backs. Can take Hassey CF backs, but not the integrated Hassey backs (can't use a H3D/39 back on a H2). Discontinued Product ... but some supplies of new H2s are still available.

H2D is an integrated camera type (H2D/22, H2D/31, H2D/39) which cannot take a different maker's digital back ... but can take a Hassey film back. Discontinued product.

H3D series is also integrated, and can still take a H film back. Discontinued product.

H3D-II ... also integrated, heat sink replaces fan cooling, larger LCD, improved sensor filter ... but cannot take a film back. Discontinued, but probably available new in limited quantities.

H2F is the current H2 version. Has most all of the current features of the later integrated H3/H3D-II cameras, and unlike the H1 and H2 it can be used with all of the later D lenses like the 28mm and 35-90 as well as the HTS/1.5, but unlike the H3D-IIs and H4Ds it can take a Hassey H film back. Can use a Hassey CF back. Cannot take other maker's digital backs, (at least not since I last checked).

-Marc

 

[Valentin]

"Now, is there any difference between H2, H2F and H2D in regard to functionality/build?"

H1 uses the older battery type unless it was upgraded. Discontinued product.

H2 is the upgraded version including a new battery. Can take most any maker's digital back and the Hassey H film backs. Can take Hassey CF backs, but not the integrated Hassey backs (can't use a H3D/39 back on a H2). Discontinued Product ... but some supplies of new H2s are still available.

H2D is an integrated camera type (H2D/22, H2D/31, H2D/39) which cannot take a different maker's digital back ... but can take a Hassey film back. Discontinued product.

H3D series is also integrated, and can still take a H film back. Discontinued product.

H3D-II ... also integrated, heat sink replaces fan cooling, larger LCD, improved sensor filter ... but cannot take a film back. Discontinued, but probably available new in limited quantities.

H2F is the current H2 version. Has most all of the current features of the later integrated H3/H3D-II cameras, and unlike the H1 and H2 it can be used with all of the later D lenses like the 28mm and 35-90 as well as the HTS/1.5, but unlike the H3D-IIs and H4Ds it can take a Hassey H film back. Can use a Hassey CF back. Cannot take other maker's digital backs, (at least not since I last checked).

-Marc

Thank you Marc. I really appreciate it.

So, if I got it right, it seems that I should look for either H2 or H2F

H2 - can take third party backs (digital) but no D lenses (to be honest I don't even know what that means at this point)
H2F - Hassy backs only but can take new type lenses.

Man, it gets more difficult, not any easier