The GetDPI Photography Forum

Great to see you here. Join our insightful photographic forum today and start tapping into a huge wealth of photographic knowledge. Completing our simple registration process will allow you to gain access to exclusive content, add your own topics and posts, share your work and connect with other members through your own private inbox! And don’t forget to say hi!

Why did you choose your back?

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I do have a question though on Sinar with all the backs the 54 and 75 are they the same kind of sensor. i know there Dalsa but are there micro lenses on one of the like the Phase or Hassy system like the H331 and P30 plus. Also is there a reflex viewer available or is it only Waist level. One other question besides the Rollie lens mount can you bolt say a Hassy V lens via a adapter or something of that nature.
 
T

thsinar

Guest
I see, so we both have latin blood in our veins!

:)

Thierry

Thierry my words sometimes are a little stronger than my meaning. Most folks know this and please don't take any offense at all, not my intention whatsoever. Just a Italian from New Jersey and i grew up on the street for a good chunk of my life. You need to speak tough sometimes to survive but I am really a pussycat. LOL
 

David K

Workshop Member
Guy,
Can't speak to the sensor issue but with regard to the viewer and adapters the answer is yes, there's both 45 and 90 degree prism finders (only the 45 degree works with the revolving back) and adapter plates are available for Hasselblad, in fact I have one, still unopened, as I am thinking that I might prefer to have one for my Mamiya RZ kit. I also have an adapter plate which I have used with my Contax 645. Very simple to change these plates... three screws if I recall correctly and only a matter of minutes to do it. Wouldn't recommend doing this on the beach with blowing sand, but otherwise a piece of cake.
 
T

thsinar

Guest
Guy,

1. the eMotion 54 LV and the eMotion 75 as well as the eMotion 75 LV do all use Dalsa sensors.

None of our backs did or do use a sensor with micro-lenses (yet, and don't see any indication for the future, juste to be sure not to be proven wrong one day! :)).

2. The Sinar Hy6 has 2 view finders:

- a 45° prism finder, which is the modified finder from the Rolleiflex 6008 (modified to fit mechanically and to allow the revolution of the back with the Sinar revolving adapter).

- a 90° mirror finder, which is new and available end of July, begin of August, according to my latest information.

3. There is no adapter currently to mount a Hassy V lens on the Sinar Hy6.


Best regards,
Thierry

I do have a question though on Sinar with all the backs the 54 and 75 are they the same kind of sensor. i know there Dalsa but are there micro lenses on one of the like the Phase or Hassy system like the H331 and P30 plus. Also is there a reflex viewer available or is it only Waist level. One other question besides the Rollie lens mount can you bolt say a Hassy V lens via a adapter or something of that nature.
 
T

thsinar

Guest
David,

My understanding was that Guy was asking about adapters for the V system lenses.

Guy: did I misunderstood'

Thierry

Guy,
Can't speak to the sensor issue but with regard to the viewer and adapters the answer is yes, there's both 45 and 90 degree prism finders (only the 45 degree works with the revolving back) and adapter plates are available for Hasselblad, in fact I have one, still unopened, as I am thinking that I might prefer to have one for my Mamiya RZ kit. I also have an adapter plate which I have used with my Contax 645. Very simple to change these plates... three screws if I recall correctly and only a matter of minutes to do it. Wouldn't recommend doing this on the beach with blowing sand, but otherwise a piece of cake.
 
T

thsinar

Guest
Yes, Billy, both the 45° modified for the Hy6 and the new 90° will allow the revolving of the back without having to take it away.

Thierry

Thierry, 90º finder will allow revolving of back, yes?
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I was asking about lenses yes but info on backs was good on the adapter plates also. No Mamiya mounts though I would assume, correct. Plus Hassy would have to be the H2 I would assume
 

David K

Workshop Member
Sorry for posting my misunderstanding about the ability to revolve the back with both finders. Thierry, you must get weary of correcting so much misinformation. Glad you were here to set things right. In the future I think I'll just let you respond to these questions :)
 
T

thsinar

Guest
Of course there is also a Mamiya adapter for our backs, including for the eMotion series:

- Mamiya RZ 67 Adapter Kit
- Mamiya 645 AFD Adapter Kit
- Mamiya 645 Pro Adapter Kit

And yes, there is also a Hasselblad V system adapter, beside the H1/H2 adapters, for all Sinarbacks, included the eMotion series:

- Hasselblad V Adapter Kit
- Hasselblad H1/H2 Adapter Kit

As well as, there are adapters for all common MF platform/camera models:

- Contax 645 Adapter Kit
- Sinar m Adapter Kit
- Rollei 6008 Adapter Kit

And for the other Sinarbacks other than the eMotion series:

- Fuji GX 680 Adapter Kit
- Sinar p3 Adapter Kit
- Mamiya RB 67 Adapter Kit
- Graflock Adapter Kit
- Sinar 4x5 Adapter Kit

Best regards,
Thierry

I was asking about lenses yes but info on backs was good on the adapter plates also. No Mamiya mounts though I would assume, correct. Plus Hassy would have to be the H2 I would assume
 
T

thsinar

Guest
it's alright, David. I was myself not sure if I did misunderstand or not.

Thanks, and no need to let me make the "work" alone, all help is appreciated!

:)

Best regards,
Thierry

Sorry for posting my misunderstanding about the ability to revolve the back with both finders. Thierry, you must get weary of correcting so much misinformation. Glad you were here to set things right. In the future I think I'll just let you respond to these questions :)
 
N

Natasa Stojsic

Guest
Another way of looking at Hy6 Rollei/Sinar Lenses..... you can use all Lenses on ALPA Cameras if I'm not mistaken:thumbup: I don't think you can do that with Cambo, Horseman, Gottschalt etc. cameras.....
 
My decision to buy an eMotion 22 Jenoptik (now Sinar) almost 4 years ago was rather spontaneous. I did not have any digital cameras at the moment, I was shooting my Fuji rangefinders and LF 4x5 and 8x10 film for pleasure and was happy. Five years ago I bought an ALPA SWA with a 48mm. Helvetar lens as a travel camera and felt liberated, I was able to travel light to various locations locally and abroad. Than the X-rays destroyed my 120 film at on of the airports and a friend suggested me a DSLR as a modern solution. I tried some Canons and did not like the experience. ALPA had a page on the web-site with some digital backs and adapters recommended by them and Jenoptik eMotion was in the list. I ordered the eMotion through the Russian Sinar-Bron dealer and I happened to be the first e22 owner in Russia.

The learning curve was steep, I had some experience with some scanning software and no digital knowledge. Fortunately, there was the RG forum and I accumulated knowledge there. I had zero help from the dealer, the Jenoptik product was new for them and it took me 6 month to get the correct colors from Software. A photographer in Paris spent with me an hour and I understood the CapturePro.

Why I chose the Jenoptik back? It was in the V-mount, did not require a special cable to wake it up on an ALPA, had an internal memory and a SF card slot and I had a Hasselblad 503 to mount it. (in 2007 I upgraded the back to LV).
3 years ago a scanning shop we used closed down, and I decided to use my Alpa with eMotion 22 to copy paintings. I added too Digitars and bought a Rollei 90mm. Makro lens with the Rollei-Alpa adapter. When I damaged my Jenoptik back accidentally I had to send it to Sinar to repair and left without back for 2 month (Sinar returned the brand new Sinar eMotion 22 with the Sinar Logo for the price of Euro1400 , a pleasant surprise). A Friend offered me a Rolleiflex 6008AF with the db20 Phase One for a good price and I bought it after a week of shooting. At the moment I already had 2 Rollei lenses and the price of the combo was too good to miss. I did like the lenses and I was astound with the ease of use the Phase One offered. No problems with the white balance, the files were almost ready for print without corrections, sharpening already applied, files were contrasty and beautiful. It was a dream of an amateur come true. Contra: I did not like the square format, I was unable to mount the back on the ALPA, I did not like the crop factor. I did not like the transition from light grey to black.

I tried to live with the db20 and even bought the Rollei X-Act view camera with the Swing and Slide adapter to use my Rollei lenses with the movements. I was disappointed, the focusing with the 45 finder was difficult, the back had no live view, the real estate of the sensor too small. So I returned to my ALPA copying gear with my new eMotion 22. Sold my X-Act and db20.

When I was using two brands alongside I realised that the two companies had different philosophies: Phase one is a Set Lunch and Sinar is a la carte. But both are well cooked and delicious.

I still cannot honestly answer the question, would I have bought a Phase One version of Rolleiflex Hy6. The pre-cooked diner is easy.

Now I use two Sinar backs : an eMotion 54LV and a Sinarback 54H on 3 platforms, ALPA + Sinar-M+Rolleiflex Hy6. 22mpx. is enough for me (now?).

Sorry for the long post.
Yevgeny, Russia
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I need to add something here that i think is really really important in making these buy decisions and that is the software that each back company has and how it fits in your workflow. I think this is a major role in deciding what you are going to do. Little easy for me since I used C1 from the 1ds days but each back has it's own software and some can see other programs as well like ACR,Lightroom and Aperture. i would suggest to anyone thinking about this and downloading a demo and try each program out and see if it fits you and the back you are interested in. There are plenty folks here that would be happy to send some raw files that are not important to try your hand at processing what back you maybe interested in. But I am pretty sure demo downloads are available for you to try these different programs
 

RayM

Member
Thank you all again for continuing to add your insights and wisdom to the question I posed that started this thread. I have learned a great deal from you on what you paid attention to such that you made your decisions the way you did. I must also say that I have learned something very important from all of you and that it is a bit of a surprise to me: the importance of a trusting relationship with the person/company selling you the digital back.

While each of us may have our reasons for agreeing with this last statement, mine is especially important to me in that I live in a place in the middle of Wisconsin that has no dealers who work with the P21+ (which is, again, what I'm leaning to quite strongly) within a half-day drive from me, the closest is in Chicago. The photographic work I do does not particularly call for speed in image capture (most of it is what I'd call fine art nature photography), and I'm rarely on a tight deadline schedule for when something needs to be shot; my deadlines tend to be on the print side, my clients need x number of prints by such and such date. The equipment I have used to date has all been purchased from dealers via the internet with whom I have no personal relationship. BUT, from what I am reading from several of you on the MFDB issue, relationship with the dealer might just be issue #1.

Prior to this thread, I had myself in the frame of mind that (like Canon or Nikon DSLRs) all of these backs come off of an assembly line where they are put together with exacting specifications, processes, and tolerances, and that, therefore, if a back passes inspection in the factory, it's highly likely that the item will work as designed. Sometimes things can still go very wrong (like the M8 problems that have been mostly fixed), I think maybe I've lived a mostly charmed life in that I've had very few episodes with equipment (cameras and otherwise), and when I did, the experiences of getting the equipment serviced went pretty well. What I've learned here though is that this is most definetly maybe not the case, that sometimes backs can indeed be finicky, or the fit between the back and the camera body can be finicky, or whatever it is that can go less than optimally, and that therefore, a key criterion for the decision is the reliability and responsiveness of the company from whom I purchase the back to begin with...especially because I don't have a company to work with that's just down the road. So, a great lesson. Thank you.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Ray since you want to go Phase than i would suggest talking with Lance from CI and if Hassy, Aptus or Sinar than talk to Steve both great members here and great dealers that will help you along the way. From all I heard of Steve a really good guy, lance is my Phase dealer and I have a very positive experience so these are some good folks to at least chat with.
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
While we are on the subject of getting questions answered, I have one regarding the Hy6 for whoever can answer it definitively, then I will move on to why I chose my system: In doing all my research before buying my outfit, I gathered a reference to the included 80mm lens not accurately autofocusing on the Hy6 and that this was "known issue," though no comment about how or when it was planned on being corrected. Since I've never seen it mentioned by the manufacturer, can somebody that knows clarify first if it's true and if it is, is it a mechanical or firmware issue?
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
Why I chose the P45+:

1) UI -- the Phase UI was extremely easy for me to understand without referring to the manual, the Leaf next and Sinar less so...

2) Dealer support and confidence -- all my questions were answered promptly and professionally -- frankly I found this to be the case with everybody I was talking to, so all even up for me.

3) File detail -- this is why the larger backs were in my decision process: P45+, Leaf 75S and Sinar 75. (Note: The Hassy H3D 39 would have been under consideration too, but I decided early on I did NOT want to invest in a closed system which left it out for me.) I liked them all, but found the Phase to offer the most fine detail, while the Leaf offered a somewhat "smoother" and more pleasing file to my eye, and the Sinar somewhere in-between. Admittedly these differences I am describing are minute and likely different based on an individual's viewing preferences, so again this was MY impression.

4) Color. All were awesome, especially when compared to any of the DSLR offerings.

5) Software and workflow -- was it easy, intuitive and did it work with full functionality without secondary programs or additional hardware dongles required. Here the Phase back and C1 won hands down for me.

Off to the beach and breakfast now, will add more about my camera platform choice later.
 

BradleyGibson

New member
Hi, Thierry,

Can you tell me more about the "45° modified for the Hy6"? Is this the normal Hy6 45° finder we see in the recent photograph you posted of the Hy6 and all the lenses, or is this a 6008 finder modified to work on the Hy6?

If the latter, where can I find more information about this modification?

Thanks,
Brad

Yes, Billy, both the 45° modified for the Hy6 and the new 90° will allow the revolving of the back without having to take it away.

Thierry
 

RayM

Member
Guy, Thank you, yes, I'm already sending notes back and forth with Lance. Just sent one off to him moments ago, actually.

Jack, thanks too for your thoughts on this. I'm finding the "minute" differences to be the one's I'm having the most difficulty with to tell you the truth. I'm just not keen on making a wrong decision on this one! By the time I'm done with acquiring the back this will be a substantial chunk of change invested in all of this and I'd have to hurt myself if I screw this up.
 
Top