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Sinar Workflow

David K

Workshop Member
Thought I'd try to elicit some suggestions from those shooting with Sinar backs. It's not my intention to make this exclusive to Sinar users, just trying to clarify some things in my own mind and workflow. For starters, here's a screenshot of the Brumbaer software that I find myself using to convert the Sinar RAW's to DNG's. I honestly don't have a clue what the numbers shown in the cropped portion mean. These represent the default settings present when I installed it and I've left them alone. Anybody out there have occasion to change them... if so, how and why, please. Also, wonder if those of you using this program (or eXposure, for that matter) are saving your RAW files (.BR) in addition to your DNG's.
 

David Klepacki

New member
David, did you ever get an image where the Brumbaer software did not properly convert your image, but the Sinar eXposure software did?

I save all of my original files, more than one copy too,
 

harmsr

Workshop Member
David,

I don't know the software at all, but the D55 represents your lighting (daylight 5500) and I assume that you can pull down other options for cooler or warmer lighting and color casts. The detail numbers are what represents the color matrix for this lighting. Exactly how it is used to do the conversion is well beyond me.

Best,

Ray
 

Graham Mitchell

New member
David,

I don't know the software at all, but the D55 represents your lighting (daylight 5500) and I assume that you can pull down other options for cooler or warmer lighting and color casts. The detail numbers are what represents the color matrix for this lighting. Exactly how it is used to do the conversion is well beyond me.
I don't know how it works either but this much is correct. If you click on the pull down menu you can select the closest lighting conditions.
 

David K

Workshop Member
David, did you ever get an image where the Brumbaer software did not properly convert your image, but the Sinar eXposure software did?

I save all of my original files, more than one copy too,
Interesting that you should ask that question :) Recently I took (yet another) shot of my backyard ferns. The late afternoon sun just lit up some yellow leaves like gold and I thought it might be worth trying to capture. Processed with Brumbaer I got some kind of funky green corruption along the stem of one of the leaves. Reprocessed in Exposure to see if it was a software issue and the image had no such corruption. First and only time I've seen this with Brumbaer which IMHO is fantastic software (in terms of ease of use and results) for converting the Sinar files. This one experience is, in part, what prompted this post. I thought perhaps one of my settings was off. I think the software has the capability to do color cast correction but haven't had occasion to need that yet.
 

David Klepacki

New member
I have heard that the Brumbaer software has very aggressive highlight recovery...so aggressive that it is possible to experience something like you are describing.

Funky corruption of the image typically happens when the raw converter computes a negative or NAN value for an interpolated pixel, and is my first guess as to what happened to you. A second possibility is to see if the color temperature was so off as to push your pixel data beyond the allowable values. You can try selecting other color matrix options in the preferences to see if that changes anything.
 

David K

Workshop Member
Good thoughts David... but I have not been saving my original files, rather considering the DNG's to be my RAW's. Maybe I need to rethink this, but I'm not anxious to incur even more storage requirements than I already have.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Good idea to start this thread David , I think this will help a lot of folks understand it better.
 

David K

Workshop Member
Good idea to start this thread David , I think this will help a lot of folks understand it better.
Guy, I hope so as this program has been universally praised. Unfortunately the author is no longer supporting it and, as it's not a Sinar product, they don't either. The good news is that Exposure seems to do a fine job with the conversions.
 
T

thsinar

Guest
Dear David and others,

I will try to explain as simply as possible (in fact it is bl..dy simple), what are the different features in the Brumbaer Converter based on the SW windows.
But first I would like to ask you David, which version of Brumbaer you are using?

1. Colour Matrices

the window on the left side called "Color Matrices" is effectively the colour calibration which the converter uses. There are "default" calibrations stored which can be accessed and selected from the pull-down list (e.g. D55, corresponds to daylight 5500°). It is usually a good starting point to use this D55 to get a good calibration. I would however suggest to creat your own colour calibration, and I have got the best results by doing it under a cloudy sky.

As said, beside the default colour calibration matrices one can create one's own colour calibration matrices by means of a Macbeth colour chart. To do this click the ""Calib" button and follow the indications on screen, step by step. At the end you will have to save this calibration. The "Load" button is simply to choose/select those created colour calibrations.

The second part of this "Color Matrices" allows basically to do simultaneously a second colour calibration, on top of the first one, and which is calculated into the file IN ADDITION to the first one on the top: it is supposed to give an even better result, but nobody uses it. Just leave it on "Ignore" and DON'T use it.

2. Back specific Reference files

Each back has its own reference files. When you use your back the first time it will load those reference files (from the internal memory of the eMotion) and place them into a specific folder from the Brumbaer converter ("Home" ---> "Library" ---> "Application Support" ----> "eMotionDng"). One can therefore use as many different backs as possible and the application will take automatically the right reference file which belongs to the back.

The serial number of the back(s) used can be seen in this left window, on the far left side in tab and text reading from down to up, e.g. David's back has serial number 1320.

3. White Reference

The little rectangular window below the color matrices window is for the use of "White Shading" files. By default the converter will use the reference file delivered with each back. In case of colour casts due to shifts, tilts/swings, or due to lens or sensor fall-off, one can create a specific files called "white shading" and which corrects this colour casts and lens/sensor fall-offs.
One can create, save and apply those "white shadings" and the converter has the unique ability to apply them in a batch process, automatically and on as many images you want/need.

4. Drop-in Window

The window in the top middle is used to drop (drag and drop) the raw files and start the conversion into DNG. As soon as file are dropped in, a bar below starts to become active (green), showing the progress. The window on the right side lists all the files to be converted and how many are left to be converted.

5. Below the Drop-in window

- Button to select the folder where the DNGs and RAWs (.IA and .BR files) files should be stored.

- one can then choose or no to save also the RAWs (.IA and .BR files) ---> check(un-check the box.

- "Keep structure" is what it says: will keep the structure of the files as they are.

- "Overwrite": in case of converting again the files, allows to overwrite (and delete) the older DNGs or to keep those previous DNGs and apply a new name to the new ones.

- "Logfile": I am not sure of the meaning of this one, but use it always un-clicked.

- "Whitefile creation"

Here can be applied a "Denoise": this has nothing to do with noise reduction in the image data. It is to denoise the white shading file. The white shading files are shot with a plexi-glass in front of the lens, thus need about 2 f-stops more light. Since one cannot change the aperture for the creation of this white shading, one has to exposure longer. Often this leads to an exposure time in the vicinity of a few seconds. This might add noise to the white shading, and if not eliminated (Denoise), this noise will be applied to the image date while the white shading correction is done: therefore this "Denoise" possibility of the "white shading" file(s).

- "Vignetting"

One has the possibility to correct lens vignetting by checking the box. Not all images show vignetting, mainly short focal length lenses.

- "Image conversion"

The "Destitch" feature is used when one has a centerfold issue in the file: this can happen with CCD sensors, giving usually a distinct line/separation, mostly in the middle of the image. It is too long to explain this in detail here, but basically it is due to the way the light signal/information is read out from the sensor. ALL digital backs can show this effect, under certain light conditions. By checking this box the converter will automatically correct this effect.

- "Preview"

nothing special to explain here.

Best regards,
Thierry
 
T

thsinar

Guest
Most probably the second reason is the one: choice of the wrong colour calibration.

Thierry

I have heard that the Brumbaer software has very aggressive highlight recovery...so aggressive that it is possible to experience something like you are describing.

Funky corruption of the image typically happens when the raw converter computes a negative or NAN value for an interpolated pixel, and is my first guess as to what happened to you. A second possibility is to see if the color temperature was so off as to push your pixel data beyond the allowable values. You can try selecting other color matrix options in the preferences to see if that changes anything.
 
T

thsinar

Guest
Stefan Hess is supporting his Brumbaer DNG Converter until the end of 2008.

After that it will still be usable, with the current existing backs, as it is, and as long Sinar is not changing anything in the file's structure.

So there is no "unfortunately", since those with eMotion backs can use it at Vitam Eternam. And it is a freeware which is so simple and easy of use, that it is very unlikely one needs support.

But yes, Sinar eXposure is doing as well a wonderful DNG conversion.

Best regards,
Thierry

Guy, I hope so as this program has been universally praised. Unfortunately the author is no longer supporting it and, as it's not a Sinar product, they don't either. The good news is that Exposure seems to do a fine job with the conversions.
 

David K

Workshop Member
Thierry,
Many, many thanks for this thorough explanation, perhaps now I will be able to use this software to it's full potential instead of simply using the defaults. To answer your question I am using Version 1.45 of the software.
 
T

thsinar

Guest
You're welcome, David.

The better, I'm using an older 1.44 beta 3!

Cheers,
Thierry

Thierry,
Many, many thanks for this thorough explanation, perhaps now I will be able to use this software to it's full potential instead of simply using the defaults. To answer your question I am using Version 1.45 of the software.
 
R

rainer-v

Guest
i strongly suggest to use at least one white kalibration if using brumbaer. results are 100% better than without. if you use just one for all lenses best is to make with a medium focal length as 80 or 100mm at f16 the "standard" white reference file.

try to apply color calibrations several times, the interpretation of the color ref. file might not be the same each time, they can differ a lot. make e.g. three calibrations ( all with the same color checker file ) and select the one you like more. this results from roundings of the algorythm and can be seen in other softwares too.
 
T

thsinar

Guest
Hi Rainer!

Just for the information of all here: Rainer is THE specialist of the Brumbaer DNG Converter, since he has developed it together with Stefan.

Who better than him can give advices?

Thanks Rainer,
Thierry

i strongly suggest to use at least one white kalibration if using brumbaer. results are 100% better than without. if you use just one for all lenses best is to make with a medium focal length as 80 or 100mm at f16 the "standard" white reference file.

try to apply color calibrations several times, the interpretation of the color ref. file might not be the same each time, they can differ a lot. make e.g. three calibrations ( all with the same color checker file ) and select the one you like more. this results from roundings of the algorythm and can be seen in other softwares too.
 
Thank you for your excellent advice and sharing your experience.
Yevgeny

i strongly suggest to use at least one white kalibration if using brumbaer. results are 100% better than without. if you use just one for all lenses best is to make with a medium focal length as 80 or 100mm at f16 the "standard" white reference file.

try to apply color calibrations several times, the interpretation of the color ref. file might not be the same each time, they can differ a lot. make e.g. three calibrations ( all with the same color checker file ) and select the one you like more. this results from roundings of the algorythm and can be seen in other softwares too.
 

David K

Workshop Member
Hi Rainer and thank for chiming in. I do remember reading of your involvement with Stefan over on the LL forum and have seen several postings of your excellent architectural work which inspired me to visit your web site. Your work is remarkable. I will certainly try to follow your advice which is especially appreciated since this information is not readily available elsewhere (at least not that I could find).
 
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