Can't decide Arca Swiss D4 or Cube,

[danlindberg]

Dan, could you perhaps post a picture of the camera plate attached to your TC? I'm wondering how small/large it is.

And is this Linhoff mount system really as rigid as they say? You put the camera with the plate onto the head, it says click, and there is no play whatsoever?

Chris

I've got this pic with Linhof plates...and yes, it says click and nothing moves - no play!

One more Linhoff head question: Are the bubble tubes really level? It seems to me that (the lack of) precision when gluing the bubble tubes/levels is a major problem with a lot of tripod accessories (In this respect, my Alpa Max isn't perfect either.)

Chris

Nope, not level on the Linhof.

My Alpa Max, SWA and optical viewfinder are all perfect. Seems like some companies take more care than others......

 

[Don Libby]

... I pick one and stick with it.

I've tried most thing to achieve the "ultimate level" and somehow each failed in someway or another. Electronic, digital, laser heck I almost tried nuclear (couldn't get the proper licensing). I looked at all the levels B&H offer and in the end decided that this was just a ploy to have me spend more money.

I thought I'd level the tripod before placing the camera on top then level the camera. Didn't make a heck of a lot of difference. I tried this on a level piece of course concrete; Tripod was level however as soon as I locked in the camera the camera showed it was off by just a hair. I thought about getting a surveying equipment thinking if it's good enough to set boundaries it should be good enough for me. Then I rethought the entire process.

Since going with the WRS I've seen a marked difference in how level my images are. Part of it is the tripod (it can double as a jack stand), part of it can be attributed to the Arca Cube (I stopped watching the levels). I only concern myself with the set of levels on the WRS. While I could use the IQ I haven't really felt the need. I also use my eyes.

What I've found for the most part is that a flat stitched image of 2 or more files consistently produce image that give me at least two sides that have 100% information while the other two have more than 95% and in the areas lacking I have less than 2 pixels of missing information. For me that's close enough to level.

Since relying on only one set of levels I've saved money and no longer have to answer pesky question of why I needed a nuclear use license.

Don

Written somewhat tongue in cheek to back up the wise suggestion given by Graham.

 

[MedShooter]

While I'm waiting for my D4 I have one last question.

If in the future I thought that a bellows system might be in the cards for me. Would this change you guys' recommendation? I think bellows (Nikon pb-4) are still well within the capacity load of the D4 but anything else to consider here?

 

[Bob]

No need to decide.
Both is the answer which seems to be the position I find myself in.
I bought the D4 with the classic screw clamp which I find at the end of the day is just what I need since I usually end up with a mix of arca and res plates.
Not to change the subject too much but i see that the new rrs lever clamps claim to be able to make up the difference in size. that is except for the slidefix size which I use on my Rm3di.
-bob

 

[Don Libby]

I really don't see any weight problems as I've used the D4 now with both the WRS and DF.

 

[Shashin]

You could just make your own head. Duel-speed knobs to move the camera forward/backward and up/down, a goniometer to tilt the camera, and a rotating based to swing it.

 

[MedShooter]

Just got my D4.
Mine is the screw release version which allows the use of arca compatible plates.
I haven't gotten my tripod yet to be able to test it out but the construction on this thing is amazing. It feels like it's built like a tank. Admittedly I've never used a high end head but I'm really liking it. The gears are smooth with just the right amount of resistance. I can see now that it is a bit more flexible to work with than the cube might be. The layout is nicely thought out and ergonomic. On top of all of this it looks beautiful lol.

 

[wildtypitch]

Hi, one large problem with the goniometer/cube as a head is that the tilt x-axis tilt is mounted on top of the tilt z-axis tilt mech.
So use of any x-axis tilt results in z-axis tilts that also involve varying degrees of x and y-axis tilts. As an architectural photographer this would be very annoying. Using it for close up would drive me crazy as independent axis tilts are vital. I mean what's the point in having geared axis movements of one of those axis isn't fixed.
The cube is a precision instrument but it's not really designed for precision photography. A landscape photographer kinda fits the bill. It's light and provides precise movements for someone shooting distance on open ground its a very expensive step up from a ballhead. An architectural photographer ends up with tripods in varying states of distress legs hanging off balustrades, wedged into corners etc. Your tripod isn't going to be level so the cube will be rather wild to control unless you are just aiming for a level camera. Table top then just not the right tool. Basically non independent tilts are only really precision is your aim is to have a level camera (forget about using the 90 degree tilt function as it basically makes on of the geared axis useless)
I wonder though does the d4 have independent tilt axis though, like a MF-410/405. Then it would be a contender for their architectural and table top throne. For me these are the workhorses of the industry with good engineering and practicality in mind at extremely good value. They're just not designed for backpackers.

 

[wildtypitch]

You could just make your own head. Duel-speed knobs to move the camera forward/backward and up/down, a goniometer to tilt the camera, and a rotating based to swing it.

Yeah I was looking at a couple of 3-axis goniometers for a couple of hundred bucks here in Beijing add an extra pan head. All they are missing is the 90 degree tilt. Then I realised that that tilt would make it redundant for my purposes.

 

[Paul2660]

Just got my D4.
Mine is the screw release version which allows the use of arca compatible plates.
I haven't gotten my tripod yet to be able to test it out but the construction on this thing is amazing. It feels like it's built like a tank. Admittedly I've never used a high end head but I'm really liking it. The gears are smooth with just the right amount of resistance. I can see now that it is a bit more flexible to work with than the cube might be. The layout is nicely thought out and ergonomic. On top of all of this it looks beautiful lol.

I have the D4 geared and like you said it's a great piece of gear. With a tech camera, being able to make the fine leveling adjustments, with just one hand is well worth it, unlike a ball head design.

Paul

 

[MILESF]

Lots of good comments here but one note of caution if I may. I have both the Cube and the D4 Geared. The D4 has twice been back to Arca because I find the knobs hard to turn to the extent that at the end of a long day my fingers are somewhat sore. The advice from Arca was that it is fine and would loosen up with use but it hasn't. I seen others that are much better than mine so it's just something that I would suggest a prospective buyer checks carefully. My use case is Landscape not Macro but for me the Cube is the one.

 

[Bob]

I have both the D4 and a cube.
would you like to buy my D4?
'nuff said.
-bob

 

[GrahamWelland]

Me too - I like both for different reasons. The CUBE is my go-to head on my main Gitzo giant. The D4 sits on top of a lighter RRS tripod. Other than the counter intuitive control layout of the D4 vs the Cube (or vice versa), I find it a very capable head. Since I've had the Cube for longer I always seem to want to dial up/down via the left side control but it's actually on the front.

Bob - I'd happily buy your D4 ...

 

[ErikKaffehr]

I have some writeup on the D4 here:
Arca Swiss D4

 

[jotloob]

Here a quick jpg of my the geared D4 with an RRS dovetail at the bottom and an RRS clamp on the top . That was Graham's idea . Very handy in deed but does not replace my cube for architecture .

 

[Paul2660]

I purchased my D4 with the screw clamp however after using the Arca lever lock style clamp I exchanged it for the lever lock.

I like the fact that the lever locks. RRS may lock also none of mt RRS lever clamps lock.

The Arca lever clamp easily adapts to all my various arca style plates. Arca, RRS and Kirk as it has a adjustment screw to increase or decrease tension on the clamp.

Paul

 

[jotloob]

Paul

I got the CUBE and D4 with the ARCA lever lock type and had no trouble using it .
But since I sometimes experience arthrosis in my fingers , I replaced the ARCA lever lock by the RRS clamp . That helped a lot and I feel very comfortable with that solution .
I converted the RRS clamp so it can take all types of QR-plates .

 

[GrahamWelland]

I have the Arca QR clamps on both the Cube and D4 and it definitely works well. The only problem in the field for me though is in very cold weather the safety release will easily crack your nail (maybe just something I suffer from I suppose).

 

[jotloob]

Hi, one large problem with the goniometer/cube as a head is that the tilt x-axis tilt is mounted on top of the tilt z-axis tilt mech.
So use of any x-axis tilt results in z-axis tilts that also involve varying degrees of x and y-axis tilts. As an architectural photographer this would be very annoying. Using it for close up would drive me crazy as independent axis tilts are vital. I mean what's the point in having geared axis movements of one of those axis isn't fixed.
The cube is a precision instrument but it's not really designed for precision photography. . . . . .

I do not quite understand what you mean .
Do you mean the z-axis is the swivel axis ?
The two goniometer stages are on top of a swivel platform and have an other swivel platform on their top . That gives you all movements you need .

 

[kdphotography]

I have some writeup on the D4 here:
Arca Swiss D4

A "write-up" is fine, but that automatic download of a video file (without warning) from your link made me nervous. A link claiming to be a "write-up" to me is something in text to read. If the link is a downloadable file, that should be disclosed. I'd like to at least have the option to decide if I want to download a video or not! (Using some pretty models might have made me feel better....)

ken