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Schneider 35XL? Price?

gazwas

Active member
If Cambo, Arca Swiss and ALPA all hand select their lens then the question is who gets to select first or they all jump in at the same time?
I think you are reading way too much into this and falling hook, line and sinker for all the Alpa marketing hype!

To think that someone from Alpa goes to the Schneider factory, tests and hand selects the best of the 35XL's, leaving the not so good for Cambo,Arca and Linhof, then adding the integrated lens shade and rebranding to 36mm Switar's is just ridiculous.

Looking at Alpa's website, the Switar page even states it used the same optical system as the 35XL and has no mention of it being any different other than a larger hood/filter ring than the regular lens. I see no mention of selecting the "best" lenses.

Should a user of an Alpa mounted 35XL feel inadequate to a user of a Switar?
 

jagsiva

Active member
If Cambo, Arca Swiss and ALPA all hand select their lens then the question is who gets to select first or they all jump in at the same time?
I don't think it's an issue of being invited first and you sort through a barrel of lenses to pick the ones you want.

Arca for example do all kinds of tests as they hand assemble each lens. The process is quite intensive as various bits are cooled down for assembly etc. Even the metals are chosen based on where there is intentional wear needed or not. I have a lens on order that has been recently released that is being prepped and I know there is some back and forth with the lens manufacturer to get it right.

Bottom line is that these guys know each lens that leaves with their name on it, who worked on it and what if any quirks are existent. They only do a handful a month after all.

BTW, I'm thinking of a post sometime ago on why it costs 1-2K for the mount, well this kind of precision requires time, money and some degree of OCD!
 
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PeterL

Member
A while back Paul Slotboom of the late Optechs told me that the story that Alpa hand selects lenses was a complete myth. It's standard Schneider or Rodenstock issue. They do put a new outer rim on several lenses, including the 35XL to it can take the more common 67mm filter thread, but that is it. I suspect it's the same story with the other brands. But if people would like to believe they are hand selected - be my guest.....

Cheers, -Peter
 

GrahamWelland

Subscriber & Workshop Member
Tested, calibrated and either accepted or rejected. Just like everyone else.

If it makes you feel better just assume that selection is done in alphabetical order I.e. Alpa, Arca, Cambo and Linhof ... :D
 

yongfei

New member
Now I am confused. So hand picked or no hand picked or blindly picked become hand picked?
This is from the STC review in LL:

"I am told that all lenses purchased from Alpa are individually adjusted and calibrated following Alpa's and the manufacturer's specifications. This adjusting and calibrating is done while the lens is rotating – so the adjustments is not based just on one point in the center of the lens. The reason for this is that during rotation Alpa can discover any decentering, which is not possible by using a simpler process, as is done by the lens manufacturers themselves.

Alpa has this done by both Schneider and Rodenstock, at Alpa's expense, and they have told me that to their knowledge no other reseller of those company's lenses takes this extra step.

Additionally, all supplied lenses have Alpa's unique shutter blade interlock and size 0 shutters, with an Alpa shutter release button for hand-held shooting. "
 

FSOT

New member
Thank You yongfei! This is the best explanation on this subject matter. Many thanks to your kindness.
 

jagsiva

Active member
This is from the STC review in LL:

"I am told that all lenses purchased from Alpa are individually adjusted and calibrated following Alpa's and the manufacturer's specifications. This adjusting and calibrating is done while the lens is rotating – so the adjustments is not based just on one point in the center of the lens. The reason for this is that during rotation Alpa can discover any decentering, which is not possible by using a simpler process, as is done by the lens manufacturers themselves.

Alpa has this done by both Schneider and Rodenstock, at Alpa's expense, and they have told me that to their knowledge no other reseller of those company's lenses takes this extra step.

Additionally, all supplied lenses have Alpa's unique shutter blade interlock and size 0 shutters, with an Alpa shutter release button for hand-held shooting. "
While I love Lula, Alpa is one topic I'v always taken with a pound of salt when reading about on that site. The recent review of the FPS with an unwarranted bash at the HCAM was simply ungentlemanly. The review was later modified, without any statement as to why or an apology.

Again, no offence to Alpa shooters here. Guys like Dan L. and Siebel are incredible artists and and I am always looking forward to their work. As with any of the 3 major tech cam vendors, it comes to personal preference, as most of us go down this route not just for the end-result, but the experience and tactile use of of quality equipment and a process that is as much a craft as anything else. I personally did not have a horse in this race until a few months ago when I bought the Arca.

I would recommend anyone dropping this kind of coin to get real close to dealer.
 
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torger

Active member
Personally I prefer standard mounting, evaluate the performance myself and if I discover any decentering etc I send the lens back and get it fixed. Possibly messier, but cheaper. As long as quality issues are reasonably rare and is fixed when sent back I'm fine. If I'd be a professional though I would prefer the extra check made by Alpa (and some others) since my time would cost money and I would like to trust that stuff works top notch out of the box.
 

stephengilbert

Active member
Isn't this far enough off topic yet?

And perhaps not everyone is looking for "more sophisticated cameras." No doubt ALPA's FPS is quite sophisticated, but that doesn't make me want one.
 

dougpeterson

Workshop Member
Sorry for the delayed response but I wanted to check with all relevant manufacturers to make sure my information was based on the parties themselves and not 3rd party reviews or surrogates like distributors.

ALL Arca Swiss and Cambo and Alpa lenses are tested and calibrated with the rotation method mentioned in the posts above. This process is in fact used to evaluate and correct for any decentering but Alpa is NOT unique in this regard.

Furthermore Arca and Cambo do in-house quality-control testing of every item they manufacturer. This is greatly facilitated by the fact that both Arca and Cambo do their own manufacturing in-house.

I have great respect for Alpa. They design great products and their manufacturing partner manufacturers them to a very high standard. My only problem is the idea floating around that Alpa is the only manufacturer who cares about or achieves precision. This is simply not true. I hope/assume this myth is simply overzealous pride by the owners, honest misunderstandings/mistranslation by reviewers/distributors or whatever.

Honestly I think of the old adage that if you repeat (and heavily brand) something often enough it becomes the truth.

The real truth is Cambo, Arca Swiss, and Alpa all make incredibly precise tech cameras. They all deserve great respect for carrying on the tradition of craftsmanship, refinement, and a diverse/vibrant ecosystem of products. In the case of Arca and Cambo they have been carrying this tradition on since the 1940s.
 

Don Libby

Well-known member
...The real truth is Cambo, Arca Swiss, and Alpa all make incredibly precise tech cameras. They all deserve great respect for carrying on the tradition of craftsmanship, refinement, and a diverse/vibrant ecosystem of products. In the case of Arca and Cambo they have been carrying this tradition on since the 1940s.
I've never subscribed to the notion that mines better than yours. As far as I can see each tech cam manufacture makes excellent systems and if I were looking to get into a tech cam I'd be very hard pressed to choose just one. Same thing goes for the lenses.

If it fits your hands then who cares about anything else?

This has gone slightly off course from the question of what is a used Schneider worth? I'm interested in the answer as well since I have one for sale in a Cambo mount.
 

gazwas

Active member
I'm sure people from Arca/Cambo/Linhof sometimes dip into this forum and when they here Alpa owners makes all these "why I shoot Alpa" claims about their ultimate precision, they must wince thinking "we've done that for years!".

Doug, you're like the masked magician unravelling all Alpas marketing department and expensive advertising agencies hard work...... Shame on you.:toocool:
 
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GrahamWelland

Subscriber & Workshop Member
I'm sure people from Arca/Cambo/Linhof sometimes dip into this forum and when they here Alpa owners makes all these "why I shoot Alpa" claims about their ultimate precision, they must wince thinking "we've done that for years!".

Doug, your like the masked magician unravelling all Alpas marketing department and expensive advertising agencies hard work...... Shame on you.:toocool:
I don't think that even the Alpa fanboys here (i.e. myself included) drink the Alpa kool aid. All of these camera systems are magnificent pieces of precision engineering and I don't believe that any of the manufacturers put any more or less care into their production.

I would note though that in the show us your tech cam section that there do seem to be a lot of Alpas on show. Maybe we just love our Alpas a little more :D
 

gazwas

Active member
Expensive advertising agencies? I guess I missed ALPA's Superbowl ads.
So they built that snazzy website themselves? Some bloke off the lens calibration line has a friend who's son built it for a school project?

Have you looked at Arca's website? ;)
 
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