Just thinking of a volte face

[dchew]

Actually I like it a lot better. I never felt it was very easy to "squeeze" the shutter on a tech camera; the release position is just awkward for me. Once I got used to the left hand doing the work, it felt more natural.

Dave

 

[torger]

Can the Canon 24 really hold up to an IQ180? It seems intuitively more likely that a Rodie is going to do much, much better, admittedly at the cost of having to do LCCs...

I think it was gerald.d that posted a very nice comparison between Digaron-S 23mm and Canon 24 TS-E on an Alpa FPS. At f/8 the Digaron-S blows it away, still better at f/13 (or was it f/11) but then the Canon is quite close and diffraction is still not too bad. If one thinks it's good enough is personal. I think having great sharpness at f/8 is overkill, as f/11 is my preferred shooting aperture for MF, or else DoF becomes a bit too difficult to work with in most situations I think.

edit: here's the link: http://www.getdpi.com/forum/medium-...37857-cutting-chase-23hr-stc-24ts-e-hcam.html

Anyway 24mm is a lot wider than 40mm, probably not what you are after. For the 40 you'd look at HB V 40CFi it the proposed FPS system, I have no idea of how that lens will perform, but typically retrofocus SLR-type of lenses are considerably weaker than tech cam lenses. They are often also rather expensive...

 

[Ken_R]

The 40mm HR is the best lens I have ever used, in any format. It is not close. If the 23mm HR is as good or at least close to being as good then it should blow away any extreme wide angle ever made.

I have the 24 TS-E II and it works best at f11. Its good in the center at all f stops but in the borders and edges (on a 24x36mm sensor!) and when shifting, it only gets really good at f11. At f16 diffraction has set in.

The 40mm HR is stunning at all f stops and its only diffraction limited..

 

[dougpeterson]

The 40mm HR is the best lens I have ever used, in any format. It is not close. If the 23mm HR is as good or at least close to being as good then it should blow away any extreme wide angle ever made.

I have the 24 TS-E II and it works best at f11. Its good in the center at all f stops but in the borders and edges (on a 24x36mm sensor!) and when shifting, it only gets really good at f11. At f16 diffraction has set in.

The 40mm HR is stunning at all f stops and its only diffraction limited..

The 23HR is, if anything, better than the 40HR regarding sharpness and bite. But of course with a smaller image circle (see comparison of tech camera image circles here).

You will need to use a touch of distortion correction if you want perfect geometry, but given the incredibly wide FOV this is not unexpected.

 

[dougpeterson]

2) the cambo wrc400 seems nice in that it has 'natural' rise whereas the STC requires the camera to be turned 90 degrees if you want rise. I use rise a lot more than shift. Is the STC easy to use that way or does it feel strange ergonomically?

With two mounting blocks the Cambo STC will mount vertically or horizontally with the same ease.

As seen here:
https://vimeo.com/63916039

 

[Guy Mancuso]

The Rodie 28mm is extremely sharp and maybe the sharpest lens I used with my Tech cam was the SK 60 XL. Frankly if it was me starting back up I would not get the 23 as it has no movements really 2mm maybe. The 28mm you get about 7mm so you could stitch a little if needed . Than I would get the 40mm, 70mm and 120.

BTW I always shot Zero latency without any issues. I would just make it a habit to turn the back off after a bit. The IQ's power up pretty quick anyway so it was never a problem. I hate those one shot cables. Zero you just shoot than i would open the shutter 2 stops and nail a LCC. You get so fast at it after awhile you can really become very good at it and never feel like your missing a shot. I never did actually

 

[dougpeterson]

The Rodie 28mm is extremely sharp and maybe the sharpest lens I used with my Tech cam was the SK 60 XL. Frankly if it was me starting back up I would not get the 23 as it has no movements really 2mm maybe. The 28mm you get about 7mm so you could stitch a little if needed . Than I would get the 40mm, 70mm and 120.

With a Full Frame sensor (e.g. IQ260) the 23 has no meaningful shift (like you said, 2mm maybe).

But with an IQ140 you have 10-12mm of shift.

 

[Steve C]

Another vote for the RS 40HRW SB17! I use it with an IQ180, the tilt adapter, and an Alpa STC for landscape photography on a tripod. The combination produces better results than any other camera I have used in 40 years (including 4x5). The Alpa is wonderful in its simplicity, symmetry, speed, and precision. For my work, shifts less than about 15mm rarely require an LCC, but they are easy to do when necessary. The ability to shift the back without moving the lens leads to seamless stitching. Being able to mount the 17TS on either the lens side or back side, as well as rotate the back, camera and lens independently in 90 degree increments leads to wide range of combinations that cover all my needs. I use the camera with two small tripod plates and without grips. The RS 70HR SB17 seems to be equally outstanding. It will be interesting to see what you select and if it meets your high standards. Good luck.

 

[GrahamWelland]

Do you really need a wakeup for the IQ180? What's the gain? I thought that hack was for the P45+.

If you are diligent about turning off the IQ back between a sequence of shots then thei answer is no. However, for the very best results without fear of heat noise accumulation then yes. It's easy to forget to turn off the back and it can get warm - normally when you least want it to. I use the auto off feature anyway as a backup.

Like Dave, I have two Alpa releases to avoid constantly swapping them between lenses. Expensive. Actually, bloody expensive, but they work better than the KG releases and are worth it just for the lack of miss synch frustrations.

Rotating the STC for rise/fall is no bother especially if you have the appropriate sized tripod plates on the bottom/grip sides. Also, rotating the lens mount is simple since it square and you align it easily for best access to the shutter controls and visibility.

 

[gerald.d]

I think it was gerald.d that posted a very nice comparison between Digaron-S 23mm and Canon 24 TS-E on an Alpa FPS. At f/8 the Digaron-S blows it away, still better at f/13 (or was it f/11) but then the Canon is quite close and diffraction is still not too bad. If one thinks it's good enough is personal. I think having great sharpness at f/8 is overkill, as f/11 is my preferred shooting aperture for MF, or else DoF becomes a bit too difficult to work with in most situations I think.

edit: here's the link: http://www.getdpi.com/forum/medium-...37857-cutting-chase-23hr-stc-24ts-e-hcam.html

Anyway 24mm is a lot wider than 40mm, probably not what you are after. For the 40 you'd look at HB V 40CFi it the proposed FPS system, I have no idea of how that lens will perform, but typically retrofocus SLR-type of lenses are considerably weaker than tech cam lenses. They are often also rather expensive...

Here's the latter test -

Copyright Gerald Donovan 2013. All rights reserved.

And the discussion over at LuLa -

Canon 24TSE-II vs Rodenstock 23HR

Regards,

Gerald.

 

[tashley]

This place is humming with great information - what an amazing resource, thank you to all, very much.

I think I am going to follow this strategy so as to avoid spending money up front that I will later regret:
Buy an STC with no wake up, no grips, no shade, and a long barrel Rodie 40 which I can later convert if needed (trying to find out what that costs and how long it takes!) should I discover that the lower DOF on this lens than I am used to with the Sk35XL matters. I hear that the Rodie's need to be shot at F8 thru 11 whereas I was comfortable with the SK at F16 if needed.

So this setup should let me finally get the results from the IQ180 that I always wanted. Then, quite scarily, it will all be down to me. No excuses to hide behind and no more blaming the gear not the workman!

I am getting so fussy - turning into an 'old woman' - today I was looking at some shots I made on an M8 with 90mm Macro Elmar and for the first time I noticed a subtle colour shift in the sky. Where will it all end?

 

[GrahamWelland]

The grip on the stc is definitely superfluous for tripod work. I have it but I wouldn't bother next time.

You seem to have a workable plan Tim.

 

[Steve C]

You will be shocked when you find out the upgrade cost for the 40HR to the 40HR SB17 if it is anything like what I paid. You may want to bite the bullet up front. I find tilt to be very useful on this lens and use Live View to nail focus. My bet is that the RS will be just as good as the SK at f16, but you will prefer shooting it at f8-13, so all the more reason for tilt. Also, I use the Lee WA lens hood system on all my lenses with great satisfaction. Happy shopping.

 

[dchew]

I hear that the Rodie's need to be shot at F8 thru 11 whereas I was comfortable with the SK at F16 if needed.

Tim,
It's important to remember the context of these statements. As Steve mentioned, the Rodie won't be any worse than the SK at f/16. It is just that the Rodie noticeably better at f/8 - f/11 because, well, it's a wee-bit sharper.

Diffraction is an equal opportunity destroyer; it doesn't affect the Rodie any worse than the SK (assuming equal formats).

Dave

 

[dchew]

I am getting so fussy - turning into an 'old woman' - today I was looking at some shots I made on an M8 with 90mm Macro Elmar and for the first time I noticed a subtle colour shift in the sky. Where will it all end?

Tim,
Make a print, step away from the computer, turn on some good lights and enjoy!

Dave

 

[narikin]

...and a long barrel Rodie 40 which I can later convert if needed (trying to find out what that costs and how long it takes!)

I agree bite the bullet and buy an SB from the get go. You then are free to lock it to a 34mm adapter and carry on as if it were LB, or... put it on a 34mm TS adapter or... two 17mm TS adapters for 2 directions, or... use it with an FPS. (no LB lenses can be used on an FPS)

All that is possible with an SB, but not without. Yes you have to buy a 34mm adapter, but if you switch and then have to pay the not-so-cheap conversion costs plus the 34mm adapter, you'll be kicking yourself.

 

[tashley]

OK, good advice everyone, thank you. Actually I saved so much by discovering that there's no strict need for wake up, grips or shade that I might as well go for the SB and TS up front. I also suspect that if I later decide to sell, this will be the less illiquid end of the MF used market...

 

[f8orbust]

Definitely get the lens in the SB version from the get-go. Better to have and not need than need and not have. It's the 17mm T/S mount that it uses, not the 34mm. The only caveat I would have is that, for my taste, on a chip as large as the IQ180, the 40 just doesn't feel wide enough for landscape shooting. Stitching is always an option of course. IF S/K are really bringing out a new 35mm that will behave better with large microlensed sensors, then - as long as it's not years away - that may just be worth waiting for.

 

[dougpeterson]

Just throwing the Cambo RC400 out there one more time. Compared to the STC it is lighter, smaller, has more movement, is less expensive, has less expensive accessories, and you can get a TS version of the 40HR which doesn't require a separate TS adapter.

 

[philipchan]

I might be wrong but the 40 HR SB works with 17 t/s mount but not the 34 if focusing to infinity is needed.
Philip