"I guess you could designate that your session also back up to the micro SDXC card slot."
Is this possible? as that would be great and give you the 2x coverage I am looking for.
"I guess you could designate that your session also back up to the micro SDXC card slot."
Is this possible? as that would be great and give you the 2x coverage I am looking for.
Maybe I misspoke. I remember seeing on C1 Pro 7 a drop down menu to copy to another folder (when untethered and copying files by CF to computer), but not sure if you can do it from a tethered option.
Not sure of software available to "mirror" and not sure you want to go there. I think back-up to the micro card slot would significantly slow the process. I guess it would also be possible to manually back-up/copy files to the micro SDXC during breaks or while moving to the next location.... We may be over-reaching/over-thinking more than needed...
The tethered process very reliable, and if there are issues, it should be very apparent to you during the session/shooting.
Good point as the SD micro slot will be a lot slower even with the newest 128GB card. That card seems not to be shipping till mid April. Surface pro 2 is a flash hard drive at least the 256GB is, those seem to be pretty reliable.
Just a quick one from yesterday setting up in Valley of Fire State Park, NV
More to come but will say that everything worked better than expected even in bright sun.
I tried tethering with my MacBook Pro first to see if it was a workable solution and worth buying a tethering computer, and to be honest it didn't seem nearly as useful as I thought it would. I would pretty much bag it about ⅓ of the way into a shoot. I just don't have much trouble with the focusing, and even manage pretty well with LiveView focusing in the IQ180. I stitch everything so all I need to see from the viewfinder is if I"m covering vertically or if I happen to need to do a double row stitch. I have a sliding back, and I use the ground glass for that. So I decided against a macbook air.
But something closer to the weight of many tablets, around a pound or so, I might reconsider.
A few observations after trying out this setup:
MS Surface Pro 1/2 have the feel of a dense brick compared to an iPad Air/IPad Mini. However, 100% file review is far, far superior when tethered. Particularly focus mask.
Capture One in tethered mode should have an option to have the back save the image to the CF card AND the tethered tablet. I'm sure at some point my befuddled mind will end up screwing up in the field and images will get "misplaced" between the two storage environments. I don't shoot tethered 100% of the time so files get scattered between image stores.
A MacBook Air feels a lot lighter/slimmer than the Surface Pro but the clamshell isn't anywhere near as convenient to use in the field. USB tethering works fine though. I wish Apple would make a proper OSX tablet for mobile folks. There are clones out there but they're heavier and less versatile than the Surface Pro.
I'm dreaming of a Surface Pro/MacBook tablet with 8GB ram, 512GB SSD, 10hr battery life, USB3 and with the physical size and resolution of the iPad Mini. A man can dream ...
(The other option would be to make Capture Pilot more of a detailed review platform like Capture One in zoom/focus mask/review modes).
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The Surface Pro 2 weighs 2 pounds. You don't need the Type/Touch 2 keyboard at all for tethering, and I actually recommend leaving that at home when going out on location.
The difference here with the SP2 is that in a tablet form factor, it is much easier to use in the field than the clam shell configuration of a laptop, which also requires a heavier duty mounting option, which again also adds weight.
USB3 makes everything with tethering easier--no fiddling with firewire, adapters or repeaters. USB3 simply works.
The other big plus is the "touch-screen" of the SP2. In its simplest form, it emulates your IQ/Credo screen making it easier to see. With C1 Pro 7 DB, you are able to view high resolution raws and zoom in with a simple double-tap of the screen. I prefer to tap with the pen. Double tap again, and the view returns to normal. Click on focus mask or even live view. Using a bit of tilt with your lens? SP2 makes it easy.
Is the SP2 something that you absolutely need? Of course not. The IQ/Credo screens are the best available and work well. But tethering the SP2 has made using the IQ180 (especially on my Cambo) a much more enjoyable experience. I think the biggest thing is how stupid-easy USB3 makes tethering. If the SP2 added any difficulties/fiddling, it just wouldn't be worthwhile. I think of this as a much better and more capable option than the IQ2 series wifi capability. It's certainly cheaper!
I have eighteen pieces of artwork to do copy work on location today, and I've decided to bring the SP2 along. The SP2 even has me reconsidering using the Cambo for some portrait work.
No doubt in my mind that if Apple decided to release an "iPad Pro" they would probably make a prettier and more streamlined option ala Graham's specifications, but right now all I see is the SP2. It's worth snooping out to see if it would be worthwhile for you. I know that Capture Integration is acquiring a Surface Pro 2 tethering set-up for demonstration.
i have a really nice little 13" Sony laptop ( several years old, weighs less than a pound! (carbon fiber) and can run C1; no touchscreen or usb3 however-%^*%$!!!
Yeah, I think the tablet form factor of the surface pro is appealing, but I just can't see going there till something closer to 1 lb shows up. My pack is about as heavy as I like it, and I'm trying to figure out how to lighten it up more, so tethering doesn't appear to be in my future for a while.
I think Don just got his 128GB micro sdxc from Amazon. They had a special introductory price from Sandisk for $119. That special is long gone. Now it's $199 at B&H!
My S-Pro2 came in yesterday, and I was able to set it up and work with the 260. Here are some thoughts:
First and foremost, thanks to Ken for the posts he has made on this.
1. When you are tethered, the camera battery shows a charging symbol. Does this mean the S-Pro2 is charging the camera battery? If so won't this really eat up the S-Pro2 battery?
2. Phase One, I can't believe you can't figure out a way to store the images on the card and the computer. I have been told that this is because of a performance issue of the current architecture of the backs. Personally I don't buy that, instead I believe it's a bit of being short sighted in the design, in that PHase One did not talk to landscape shooters using a tech camera, instead they only worked with studio shooter, where keeping the images on a card and computer most likely makes less sense. At least until the back is powered off you can see the images on the back. I would gladly pay a bit of speed to have the ability to have images on the card. Like Graham points out, the fact that you have a days' worth of images spread out between the card and S-Pro is less than optimum. The images taken tethered have a different naming convention so it's not like the back files and tethered files would get confused.
3. Weight, as Ken stated, leave the keyboard in the truck, as without the keyboard the weight between the large iPad and S-Pro2 is very close. The S-Pro is not going to work in wet, or rainy days. I have not found a case that keeps the S-Pro2 dry like the lifeproof or otter box designs for the iPad.
4. Screen brightness, this drove me crazy until I figured out to turn auto brightness off.
5. It's a PC, don't just hit the power button to turn it off like on the iPad (Oops). You have to shut it down.
6. Sleep or shut down, between locations, right now I am shutting down.
7. Suggested power settings? balanced, high power or power saver? I am running at balanced right now. I do know on macbooks running the i5 with W7 under bootcamp unless you pick high power you will not get the maximum of the processor and apps like LR or CC won't run as well. In this case not sure if it's as important.
8. The arm that Ken is using to mount to the tripod, curious of the weight? Looks like it's an extra 1 or 1.5 lbs is that right? I would love to find a carbon fiber setup for this or plastic even as ABS plastic should support the S-pro2.
8. UPB3 and tethering, well all I can say is it works and works well. Actually pretty amazing. I have yet to try Live View on the S-Pro2.
9. Viewing the images on the S-PRo2 is definitely an easier task, they are raw files and are loaded with the default sharpening by C1. I can easily see the files without "glasses off" like I have to do when viewing the images on the IQ LCD. If only I was 20 years younger or so.
10. The images are placed in the Capture Folder, always wanted to use it. It's very simple to copy them from there to a micro SD card. I was actually pleasantly surprised at the write speed of the 64GB card I purchased. It was actually faster than copying via my USB 2 card reader to a sandisk ultra 2 card. Nice, easy, quick, damn, its windows explorer I love it.
11. Win8 ain't that bad at all, I took a quick 1 hour course on the interface and so far it works for me. All you need is the desktop and you have your win7 look and feel. What you do, don't reload win7 on the S-Pro2 as you will lose the support for the touch screen.
13. Outdoor viewing S-Pro2 in bright light is just a little (and I feel just a little) better than the iPad retina. It's still a mirror but it seems that you can move the screen around a bit better to find an angle that doesn't reflect as much. However the sunshade Ken built to me is a must have. BTW the S-Pro2 body makes attaching a screen a bit easier due to the width.
14. Wifi/iPad vs S-Pro2. I have a IQ260 and had really high hopes for Wifi and checking the images. This is pretty telling for sure.
iPad viewing is slow both to load the thumbnails, and when attempting to view at 100%. With the latest version of firmware on the IQ260 the adhoc now works again, however I still see the usual issues of lockups, freezes during viewing that requires a reboot of the iPad or back or both. Worse Capture Pilot does not work with the full resolution of the iPad so that when you look at the image at 100%, it's fuzzy and you can't always tell what's in good focus or not. You need to zoom down a bit and then you get a slightly better idea. You are viewing a jpg not the raw, but still Capture Pilot should be able to get a better fix on the image at 100%. I have been told by Phase One that this is not possible due to the design of the retina display and software. Not sure on that, as Angry Birds an most other apps out there seem to have figured this out. More important during all of this hunting and waiting you are burning up your back battery with the wifi being on. And it does drain the battery pretty quick.
To me the downsides of the S-Pro2 are:
The USB3 cable, does limit your movement and you have to be very AWARE OF WHERE IT IS. The Phase One cable is a bit too long and I have ordered a shorter one.
Weather/condtions as mentioned, I would like to find a case that lets you have a bit more protection. I know that adds weight, but but a iPad in the Lifeproof case and see how much it adds to the overall weight.
Power management is a bit funky still figuring this out. The screen auto brightness somehow tends to get turned back on with mine. Not sure about this and I am going to run my best buy to make sure my unit is not defective.
Screen brightness to me could still be a bit better for outdoor viewing, but you can work with it. The sunshade is going to be a must have for me.
As stated early, not being able to have the images on both the card and PC is a minus for me. If you get into a day where you shot tethered and not tethered, you will have images with 2 different naming formats and not sure how all that work together since I tend to store all my raws from one day in a single folder. They may get all mixed around with the different naming. However I guess I could just create 2 folders, tethered and non-tethered.
An issue with MacBook Air that no-one mentioned so far is its lack of a 'Retina' display. The screen just isn't up to what has become standard. It is also a clamshell, which is not so great on location, and not touchscreen, which as Ken says, is a major plus in practice.
For those reasons the SP1/2 is currently the better answer for us digital MF nerds. (which is hardly a large market, but it is good to be served by something)
Apple would no doubt make an excellent iPad Pro, probably better and lighter and longer battery life than Surface Pro, but refuse to do so, for whatever marketing reasons. That's the reality to deal with, and hence this thread, pointing out a great alternative.
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Real quick as I haven't yet had any coffee this morning...
Got home late yesterday and one of the first things I did was weigh the backpack I used to hike out to Fire Wave the other day. First off I'm using a new Think Tank Airport Accelerator (empty weighs slightly over 3 pounds). I packed my Cambo WRS/IQ160 and Rodenstock 40mm lens. I also packed the Cambo lens shade and Leica Distro, my Kinesis bag with various filters, a couple spare batteries, LCC card, the Surface Pro 2 (without keyboard) and bracket and a bag with cables. Right at the end I decided to remove my Cube from the tripod and pack that as well making the tripod a little lighter to carry in my hands. I also carry a dark cloth everywhere I go. All told this weighed 19.4 pounds.
Setup was easy when I got to where I wanted to shoot. Sun was bright however using the cloth I was able to make certain the Surface Pro was set the way I wanted/needed it to be and later just used it to keep the sun off my neck. I also found I could easily reposition the camera from directly in front of the SP2 to a couple degrees either left or right of it (I'm using the 1.5' cable).
Hiked over rocky sometime steep conditions and deep sand with little to no shade to speak of. Cradled my tripod and had water in my cargo pockets. All in extremely pleased. I's great to find that harebrained idea we had a couple years ago actually works!
More to come...
i'm with paul about the dual storage needs and heard the same thing about the Phase decisions regarding slower write speed, etc. seems like they could have offered the choice
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Just had another thought about the battery of the SP2. Mine shows that I had over 9 hrs of charge on it. No Wifi turned on so it wasn't searching for it which doesn't drain the battery.
Okay coffee is here.....
For those interested I have batterymeter 3.4 which works very wel and give a lot more info than win 8.1.
Don't try to download it as all the current downloaders I found will try to install a bunch of trash also.
Batterymeter will upgrade as soon as you install it to the current version. As it's an exe. I will have to put it in my dropbox.
email or PM me if you are interested.
I think your comments are spot-on, Paul.
I wish Phase One would at least give end-users the option----to decide when tethered to save only to the computer or both the computer and MFDB, with the understanding that saving to both means a hit to speed/performance in writing the files. I would think a Firmware update would make that possible....
I use a 1.5 and a 3 foot USB3 cord, and find that this is the optimal length to tether for me using the SP2 on the Arkon clamp. I carry both in my bag to back up each other. Both are very inexpensive compared to high quality firewire cables.
3 ft USB3: Amazon.com: Cable Matters 2 Pack, SuperSpeed USB 3.0 Type A to B Cable in Black 3 Feet: Electronics
1.5 foot USB 3: Amazon.com: NEW Technology 1.5 Ft USB 3.0 A-male to B-male Gold Plated Cable: Electronics
If anyone thinks it appropriate or wants my "SP2 tethering shopping list" I can make it available.
On my digital scale, the Arkon clamp weighs exactly 1 pound. Bracket and knobs are plastic; Arm and clamp are aluminum. I'd leave it up to someone like John Milich to come up with a custom carbon fiber option.
I use a USB3 thumbdrive to transfer files and use the micro sdxc card as a backup storage solution and leave it the slot. I really don't like the micro size as I find it difficult to remove and I know I'm going to lose it! I think a USB3 flash thumbdrive should be faster to transfer files than using the micro card slot; I wish it were a normal SD sized slot than that tiny micro size!
p.s. It's also a good idea to install anti-virus/malware software----I like Malwarebytes Anti-Malware. It plays well with Windows Defender. I otherwise keep my SP2 pretty bare for tethering, though Amazon Prime is kinda cool for free movies.
I also noticed that the surface pro 3 is coming soon. Not sure how soon, but seems to be in the same footprint as current surface pro 2, with a screen with much higher resolution, 2550 x 1600 or something close. To me that might begin to get hard on the eyes again on a screen this small. They also claim even better battery life over the 2
Current res is very nice.
Paul Caldwell brought up an excellent point with concerns for battery life when tethered to the Surface Pro. And this should be of particular note to Surface Pro 1 users, since the SP1 doesn't have the extended battery life of the SP2.
When tethered via USB3, the IQ series backs allow for optional "maintenance charging" of the MFDB batteries. Apparently this was an added feature by firmware update 5.10.1.
So here's the battery tip: When tethered to the Surface Pro, turn the IQ MFDB battery charging option to "no" otherwise the Surface Pro will provide a maintenance charge to the IQ MFDB and consequently place a heavier load on the SP 1/2 battery.
On the IQ MFDB, Select <Menu>. Go to <Power Management>. Go to <Battery Charging>. Select <Off>.
This should help preserve battery life on the Surface Pro when tethering your MFDB, since the IQ MFDB will be powered only by its own battery and not receive a maintenance charge.
Phase cable is long at least 10 feet. In the woods it's a bit more than I need and the extra length could become a tripping or pull the rig down hazard. I also learned that some of the a to b cables are just a bit too thick to fit in the phase port. I ordered the ones Kens link pointed to on amazon.
That was my only reason for not using the Phase cable.
Yes C1 could offer duplicate writes as an option, but personally I doubt I would use it. It is very easy to set up a program like Beyond Compare on the SP, to watch your Captures folder, and real time copy that to an SD card folder, if thats what you wish. Pop the SD card out at the end of shooting, and you have two copies. Wa-La.
The speed issue with dual storage is recognized, although to be honest I'm not sure that I agree. The back isn't doing anything after sending the image to the tethered tablet so time spent saving from internal image buffer to the CF card wouldn't matter unless you are shooting a burst of images - something that we wouldn't be doing with a technical camera.
Just make it an option. Recognize that it'll be slower but let us choose.
My main reason for using either the iPad and Capture Pilot or the Surface Pro 2 is for proofing focus. I only really need to see the images in C1 for the 100% view to dial in focus. Then the rest of the shots taken in that series, could be left off as the focus needs won't change. (tech camera wide landscape).
The reason I wanted to have the images also on a CF card in the camera is there will be times for sure I don't want to have a surface pro 2 tethered, either when I am standing in the middle of creek up to my thighs in water (here I still might try an ipad) or if it's lightly raining or has been raining and drops are still falling off the trees.
I guess my issue is I can't see being tethered 100% in the field, so I wanted to have one place all the images were just to make moving them to my PC and raid storage easier later.
Since the images shot while tethered will be in one place, (captures folder on the pro) and the rest on the card it will break up a days shoot. But I can work around this.
The only other issue I see is that you have two different naming conventions, ones in the capture folder and ones kept on the card.
Thanks for the info on beyond compare, I will have to check that out.
Agree it should be an option: please request it at Capture One Pro features request thread on their website.
I think Microsoft's Synctoy may also be an option similar to Beyond Compare. SyncToy is free.
I'm at the point like Nariken and have become comfortable with using only the Surface Pro's SSD to store my sessions for later migration to my workstation. It also hasn't been difficult to change my workflow to simply dump any untethered RAW files from my IQ180 CF card into the same session once on my PC Workstation system.
And again, allowing the end-user to make the decision on how they wish to save their files would be a nice option.
I feel it took no longer to set up the SP2 than it did to remove the back, insert the groundglass, remove that and replace the back. Once I had the SP2 tethered the rest was simple. I found I needed to move about 100' further from where I began and all I did was pick up the tripod and carefully move the entire thing over to where I wanted to shoot again. Since everything was already set up I save time and effort which is something I wouldn't have been able to do if I were still using the GG.
I wear tri-focals (the curse of getting old) and I'm not entirely convinced a sunshade would have been much better than what I had on hand. I do have a simple card that I can insert to give partial shade however since I also has a little wind I decided against using it.
The morning was very bright with the SP2 screen acting much like a mirror so I used my microfiber towel that I keep on hand as a general rule as a dark cloth setting the initial shot. After that it was easy. Take the shot wait for about 3-4 Mississippi's for the image to appear on the SP2 screen. Even in bright light the image was very easy to see and check for alignment and focus (so easy I thought I had done something wrong).
Weight can be a factor. My complete bag weighs very close to 20 pounds and I'm thankful for a good backpack. I could shed even more weight by removing the SP2 from the extra case and using it naked ( I didn't bring the keyboard as there's no use for it on the trail). I only carried 1-1.5' USB cable in hindsight I'd feel better with 2 (belt and suspender type of guy). I thought of trying live view but then decided I didn't need it at this location.
I agree with Paul's assessment of the weather effecting the SP2 and feel in that case I just wouldn't use it and return to the old school non-tethering method of shooting. I'm uncertain if I'd even get a weather proof case if one become available as it would add bulk if not additional weight.
External cards. I had a 64GB card inserted and never thought to use it for capture or backup. Instead I shot directly to the SSD. The 128GB card was delivered while I was away and I've since began using that, however at this point it's just sitting there.
Once I returned to the motel at the end of the day it was easy. I powered up the SP2 to look at the files (actually I did that at lunch before getting back to the motel) then transferred them to my preferred backup that I always have with me when I'm on the road (2TB G-Safe).
All in all this is so easy and good. Setting up was a snap. Being able to view the files on a much larger screen well worth the additional weight. I don't think I looked at the back's LCD but a couple time the time I was shooting. I've also used the SP2 to update the firmware on the back and in that instance I would of liked to have a longer USB cord. I ended up shooting a combination of standing as I regularly do as well as lowering the tripod to the point I could sit. I moved the camera from directly in front of the SP2 to several degrees either left or right of it and never felt the need to move the SP2 to another leg (again I was using a 1.5' USB cord).
All in all I give this very high marks....
I appreciate all the ideas shared on this forum and would like to add to the discussion of tethered shooting in the landscape. For the last six months, I have been using a Sony Tap11 Windows 8.1 tablet in a variety of outdoor environments. I simply put it in a ~2oz nylon tripod tray made by Trek Tech (buy on Amazon) at the end of the first section of my 3 series Gitzo, where it stays permanently attached. If it is sunny, I put a small dark cloth over the tablet in the tray and peak inside to see the image. If it is raining or snowing, then the tablet goes into a 2 gallon Ziplock bag, sealed except where the USB3 cable goes out. The touch screen works fine through the Ziplock. The biggest problem I still have is that the icons in Capture 1 are so small that I generally have to use the pen to access menu options and to exit the program. Also, I haven't figured out how to 2 finger scroll or get contextual menus in Windows without a keyboard. A couple of nice features available in Mac OS don't seem to be present in the Windows version of C1 v7.2. Come on Phase, help us here and Apple, give us a tablet with OS 10! Overall, I am very happy with the setup and the fact that it substantially outperforms both the IQ280 display and Wifi iPad at a much lower upgrade cost. I tend to use the tablet for about half of my setups and certainly any that require tilt or precise depth of focus.
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I've had enough requests that I thought I should make my IQ/Credo Tethering to Surface Pro 2 Shopping List available here.
1. Microsoft Surface Pro 2 with 256/512 SSD storage, 8GB RAM. (Microsoft store)
2. Classic Shell - Start menu and other Windows enhancements is a free program. Optional but I think it cleans up the messy Win 8 interface.
3. Sandisk (fastest) has a new micro SDXC 128GB card. This is good for "back-up storage" or even to boot other programs (slower) like MS Word, when you want to preserve storage on the main SSD.Amazon.com: SanDisk Ultra 128 GB microSDXC UHS-I Card with Adapter (SDSDQUA-128G-G46A): Computers & Accessories It was on special for $119 on Amazon, now it's $199 or more. Not really needed if you get the 512K SSD, but maybe if you have the smaller 256 SSD. It depends on how much you will be in the field. I use a 64GB as my backup in the slot. I also keep a folder of Phase IQ firmware and the Phase Uploader software stored here.
4. Sandisk Flash (thumb) drive USB3---to transfer files to your main workstation for processing. SanDisk 64GB Cruzer Extreme USB 3.0 Flash Drive SDCZ80-064G-A46
There is also a new 128GB thumbdrive available from Sandisk. SanDisk 128GB Extreme PRO USB 3.0 Flash Drive SDCZ88-128G-A46
5. 3 ft USB3: Amazon.com: Cable Matters 2 Pack, SuperSpeed USB 3.0 Type A to B Cable in Black 3 Feet: Electronics
1.5 foot USB 3: Amazon.com: NEW Technology 1.5 Ft USB 3.0 A-male to B-male Gold Plated Cable: Electronics
6. Film screen protector: Amazon.com: amFilm Premium Screen Protector Film Clear (Invisible) for Microsoft Surface Windows RT and Pro/Pro 2 10.6 inch Tablet (2-Pack)[in Retail Packaging]: Computers & Accessories
7. Manvex case: Amazon.com: Manvex Leather Case for the Microsoft Surface PRO Tablet **NOW COMPATIBLE with the SURFACE PRO 2 / ALSO WORKS with both Microsoft Keyboards!** | Built-in Stand with Multiple Viewing Angles with Stylus Holder - Black/Gray: Computers & Acce
8. Arkon C-clamp for tablet: Amazon.com: Arkon Heavy-Duty Aluminum C-Clamp Universal Tablet Mount (10-Inch) (TAB804): Computers & Accessories
9. Type 2 keyboard and the Arc Soft Mouse from the Microsoft Store.
These really are not needed for tethering but do make using the SP2 for other purposes easier.
10. Tripod Stone bag. A cheap alternative for holding the SP2 on the quick. I haven't bought or tried this option but maybe this is something others might find attractive. Vanguard SB-100 Stone Bag SB-100 B&H Photo Video
11. Malwarebytes Anti-Malware. Plays well with Windows Defender. Malwarebytes : Free Anti-Malware
If you happen to find better options or tethering pieces, please make sure to share your personal set-up and experiences.
The express card has a small power socket on its side.
The power cable doesn't come with the express card - you need to go to an electric store and get/make a cable with AC/DC transformer and AC plug.
Once the express card is powered, the the back works.
Outside you can try without the power, if the macbook battery is strong enough you can work off it, otherwise no tethering. Generally I didn't tether outside of a building because I am not a betting man.
You can also work off your car's battery, with a simple power converter, or one of those flash DC power packs can also work. I also had a 8*AA casing connected to a DC power plug but I never got to use it. For sure the latter is the cheapest, simplest and easiest solution. The casing costs $3 on eBay.
I've been doing the same thing with my Wacom Cintiq Companion since PPE. Surface never crossed my mind.
Had considered the modbook for a while (OSX would allow me to control Profoto Air heads through C1P) but couldn't justify dropping an additional 1k for little added functionality.
To anyone needing FW: modbook is your answer.
Mac Tablet - Tech Specs | Modbook Pro
Wacom Cintiq was not a consideration for me as the comparable Cintiq is a bit larger and about twice the weight of the Surface Pro 2. It does have some great specs, especially for graphics artists, but a four pound tablet means also using a heavier duty clamp as well. I believe the SP2 has a longer battery life, but overall it is the balance of performance and small form factor (relative light weight) that makes the Surface Pro 2 the better choice, imho.
The performance and ease of USB3 changes everything, and I don't think it's over reaching here to say USB3 tethering options are going to get better yet. Rumor on the the Surface Pro 3 is higher performance and lighter weight at only 1.5 lbs. Wayne may just get his 1 pound tablet sooner than he thinks---it just might not be from Apple, though.
Any chance you could link to one of these heavy duty clamps? Just picked up a Tether T :/
My search for clamps focused on the Surface Pro 2. The Arkon tablet clamp weighs one pound and works well for the SP2, but it won't work for larger tablets. At four+ pounds I'd be hesitant to use a small clamp, and am unsure of other offerings. Tether Tools is an option, but I liked Nine-volt's Digiplate Lite better. Heavier duty mounting options for sure, and both add more weight to your pack.
You could process or edit on the SP2 as well, but I think most here choose to use larger computer workstations for ease, comfort, efficiency and performance.
I read a bit more on the suggested spec's on the Surface pro 3. The screen resolution, will be in the 2550 x 1600, like on a 30" monitor. This to me will be eye strain problems again. That is a jump from the 1990 x ? on the S pro2. I don't know if they will offer more than one screen, I doubt it as so far that has not been the case and that just makes manufacturing and warranty/repair harder.
I like the 1.5lb weight as that gets closer to the iPad retina with the Apple cover. Note, if you add the Lifeproof Nuude case to the iPad (full size) then the weight becomes about the same or the Otter box.
Personally I like the current screen resolution as it's just about right for the size of the screen.
Thanks to Ken and all for the informative discussion. Today I tried it. Loaded the latest C1 version. Mounted the SP2 to the tray on the Foba stand. LCS in front, camera on right. Now I have a nice cockpit feel as I sit in front of all this.
Started to make images and I was happy. It worked! Much easier to deal with than a laptop, shooting desk, etc. I got out the shooting table and set up a real subject. Started making movements and taking lots of shots to adjust for those. So nice.
And then reality hit. The live view image would not refresh. Just sat there holding an old image. Only thing that brought it back to life was a cold boot of the camera, and that only made things OK for a few shots. For the next hour I struggled to make C1 work with this system and then gave up. Now C1 is not exactly stable, but it was not like this last time I ran it with my Dell laptop.
Things were great for the first half hour or so. I'm hooked. Tomorrow, I will get back into it and try to understand what the hypercritical part is. Could be the SP2 (8GB, though lots of battery left), or the back (need to check V1 or V2), or the new C1 version, or the LCS, or sunspots or..
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...And then reality hit. The live view image would not refresh.
I've had this problem too when the MFB battery was at less than 30% charge. Putting a fresh battery in the back seemed to fix it.
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Latest IQ Firmware is 5.11.36
There is also a new C1 Pro 7 update---but I'd wait to see after it's been fully tested/implemented before updating. I noticed that the notes on it refer to addressing Live View.
Live View is "okay" for me on the SP2, but I still rely more on Focus Mask. The SP2 has definitely got me trying Live View more, whereas before it just wasn't worthwhile at all. Now Live View is actually a workable option--far from perfect, but at least with the SP2 I can use it now.
Like Ken I use focus mask much more than live view however I've found it much better using it on the SP2 than just on the back.
The other thing is I've noticed using live view slows me down which is another reason I don't use it much.
For my work, the key attribute of a tethered computer is that it be like a GG screen. I want to quickly focus far, tilt or swing near, evaluate far... and so on. As you know, it's an iterative process requiring close examination of the image at multiple points. Easy on 8 x 10, a nightmare on digital.
The IQ screen is just too small to use with anything other than a bit of tilt. What thrilled me about the SP2, when it worked, is that it came closer to feeling like GG than any other tethering system I have tried.. I can get a decent zoom going in the main view, and then just drag the navigator box to far and near points while making quick adjustments. Live view is critical.
If I did landscapes I think focus mask would be enough. Or perhaps there are tricks that I could use to make it work in more applications? Getting off topic there. Perhaps we should open a new thread "Making effective use of live view with tethered systems".
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It's "on-point" to talk about tethering and using Live View with the SP2. I find what makes it unique is the ability to use the touch screen capability of the SP2 as a more usable extension of the smaller IQ screen.
I'm interested in hearing about other experiences in using the SP2, new or novel tethering bits/pieces/tools, and adapting to new workflows----including Live View!
The more I use SP2 tethered the more I learn and like. I had no real thought that being tethered (just something I never thought of doing before) basically transferred all the functions from the IQ's screen to the SP2 much larger screen. Focus mask, double tappig, and live view are just a small part of whats been opened up for me by tethering. Again I'm a landscape/wildlife/nature photographer not a studio, portrait, wedding, product guy so my experiences are slightly different from the likes of Ken, Cunim, and others.
I had a conversation with Ken yesterday about this. I've kept the IQ back set on black & white preview and use both screens to check the process of the file capture however the more I use the SP2 the less I glance at the back other than to double check battery status.
We need more discussions on live view and tethering here....
I'm still working on getting a handle on Live View for my purposes. The loupe tool in C1 Pro 7 sounds a good option for your work as well...
With the SP2 I just leave the clamp thingie on the Foba, pop in the SP and good to go. May sound a bit silly, but it feels liberating having everything bolted onto the one device that gets rolled into position without a whole bunch of stuff beside it. To tell the truth, I would probably not have gotten the SP2 just for that. I do plan to use it outdoors, mounted on a leg of a tripod.
Oh, by the way, the software stability problems appear to result from allowing the battery in the back to drop to the 20% range. Strange this, because I have a Tekeon battery feeding the back via the FW port, and power coming in on the USB3 port. Why should the battery drop at all? Will figure that out at some point.
That totally makes sense, Peter. Of course for in studio, there are those new big "all in one" type tablet touch screen computers (Dell 18" - 27"), and the gear slut in me starts pondering, "what if..." Not going there---staying with the SP2!
Not sure of the MFDB battery drain issue. Maybe someone else can chime in here... I guess you could also set the MFDB to receive a maintenance charge when being tethered, which would then draw from the SP2's battery, and if needed, leave the SP2 plugged in? Too many wires for me. Maybe the FW port is not receiving the supplemental charge because you're tethering off the USB3 port?