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Monitor recommendations?

I would love to hear about these issues as well. I am in the market for a new monitor and have been debating the merits of the new 31" NEC UHD display. I have been told by OWC that I can update my 2009 Mac Pro with a new video card, the Sapphire 7950 Mac Edition, to run that display.
The 7950 will run the display, but going by the raw numbers it seems roughly comparable to the M290X in the 5K iMac, which I found sluggish in use. To its credit, it has to drive a less demanding display, isn't as constrained by power usage, and you'll have a much beefier CPU(s) backing it.
 

jagsiva

Active member
I would love to hear about these issues as well. I am in the market for a new monitor and have been debating the merits of the new 31" NEC UHD display. I have been told by OWC that I can update my 2009 Mac Pro with a new video card, the Sapphire 7950 Mac Edition, to run that display.
I have been able to connect my old mac pro with 7950 to the Dell 4K Up3214Q and works like a charm. The card only supports to 30Hz at 4K resolution though.
 

jagsiva

Active member
Editing with 3x 4K monitors at 60Hz on Windows 8.1 Pro is not a problem at all. Running R9 295X2 and two R9 290X GPUs.

BTW, C1 appears to scale a lot better than Photoshop.
 
Running R9 295X2 and two R9 290X GPUs.
Oh my, that's roughly 900W of peak power you have under the hood just from the GPUs, I'm guessing your room doesn't need a space heater then? :eek:

If I were to build a PC with more than one graphics card today, it would almost certainly use Nvidia Maxwell-based cards, since they run significantly cooler than just about anything else. Even the Titan X uses less than half the power of the 295x2 at full load, and some 25% less at idle.
 

jagsiva

Active member
Oh my, that's roughly 900W of peak power you have under the hood just from the GPUs, I'm guessing your room doesn't need a space heater then? :eek:

If I were to build a PC with more than one graphics card today, it would almost certainly use Nvidia Maxwell-based cards, since they run significantly cooler than just about anything else. Even the Titan X uses less than half the power of the 295x2 at full load, and some 25% less at idle.
It was loud and hot even with just the two 290X cards. With the 295x2, it is just ridiculous, so system will be water cooled. Power supply is 1500W, so works fine.

Nvidia cards are nice too, but I felt there was better support for OpenCL/GL with the AMDs when I got the system.

Will post some pics.
 

hcubell

Well-known member
I have been able to connect my old mac pro with 7950 to the Dell 4K Up3214Q and works like a charm. The card only supports to 30Hz at 4K resolution though.
Thanks. For photographic applications, does the 30Hz refresh rate v. 60Hz matter? Anything else noticeable?
A friend has the 2013 Mac Pro with the Sharp 4K monitor and he told me that the one thing he dislikes is that the UI in Photoshop CC is very small. I thought there was some way of scaling up the UI.
 

jagsiva

Active member
Thanks. For photographic applications, does the 30Hz refresh rate v. 60Hz matter? Anything else noticeable?
A friend has the 2013 Mac Pro with the Sharp 4K monitor and he told me that the one thing he dislikes is that the UI in Photoshop CC is very small. I thought there was some way of scaling up the UI.
The comparison of 30 vs 60 is only in Windows, and I would say you get used to it quickly for photo editing. Small things like the mouse pointer moving are a little different.

As for scaling, the OS X offers some flexibility to getting working well. I generally like my fonts/icons small anyway, but I have found it very workable.
 

KeithL

Well-known member
Are folks here happy doing post processing and retouching on a 4K monitor?

What if any issues are there?
My concerns re 4K monitors and retouching/post processing are more to do with image size on screen than performance. Do I really want to work on files that fill the screen at 50%?

I'm not sure, but would appreciate feedback from others.
 
It was loud and hot even with just the two 290X cards. With the 295x2, it is just ridiculous, so system will be water cooled. Power supply is 1500W, so works fine.

Nvidia cards are nice too, but I felt there was better support for OpenCL/GL with the AMDs when I got the system.

Will post some pics.
I see, I guess that for certain complex compute applications AMD cards are still on top, but CUDA has better support for many graphics rendering applications that I would prefer.

One thing I want to point out is that you can't cheat physics, if your system generates 1000W+ of heat, those watts will end up in your room. All that better cooling systems do is improve the rate at which you can get heat away from individual chips and then out of the case, and watercooling aims to get heat to the radiators as fast as possible, so that the heat can be dispensed without increasing the case temperature.

Peltier and phase-change cooling even allow you to go sub-zero (or at least sub-ambient), but those methods require devices that have their own power supplies and so on, and you end up with a greater total power draw and noise anyway. But that's not what these systems are for, cooling is about keeping your components cool, not reducing their TDP, which is based only on the underlying technology and amount of load.
 

Pradeep

Member
Revisiting this old thread......

So, Ed, which one did you end up buying?

I am now looking for a replacement to my NECs as they are losing the calibration every few days and are not identical any more, have to calibrate repeatedly and even then one is slightly different - either cooler or warmer than the other. Don't know which is the right one either since my printer does not match up 100% with either of them.

The 4K Eizo is now available, but is prohibitive in price. I wonder if it is necessary to go for the 'automatic calibration' model. I am reluctant to buy NEC again as they require their own calibration devices and software.

However, it seems pointless not to go for 4K since that looks like the way forward.

Hmmmm...... dilemma indeed. Anybody has experience with the LG/Viewsonic/Dell/Sharp models?
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
I am now looking for a replacement to my NECs as they are losing the calibration every few days and are not identical any more, have to calibrate repeatedly and even then one is slightly different - either cooler or warmer than the other. Don't know which is the right one either since my printer does not match up 100% with either of them.

The 4K Eizo is now available, but is prohibitive in price. I wonder if it is necessary to go for the 'automatic calibration' model. I am reluctant to buy NEC again as they require their own calibration devices and software.

However, it seems pointless not to go for 4K since that looks like the way forward.

Hmmmm...... dilemma indeed. Anybody has experience with the LG/Viewsonic/Dell/Sharp models?

Funny that this thread is resurrected at this point ... as I just scrapped my monitor and video card and moved to a 5K Dell monitor. Best thing I have done in a couple of years computer wise.

So I imagined that I would get the NEW MAC PRO but pricing it like my 2010 Mac Pro with a 5K monitor was north of $12K ... and I am not unhappy with the speed or storage of my present machine...just gets pretty warm in my office during the summer. With 15TB of fast HDs it generates a bit of heat.

I discovered that you can run an EVGA Nvidia GTX Titan X card in the older Mac Pros ... it has the fastest CUDA specs available and has 12GB memory with dual display ports to run 4 or 5K at 60 HZ.

I added the Dell UP2715K monitor ... about $1900 street price and am stunned at how the extra speed and resolution help ... video and Photoshop never looked this good. It covers 100% Adobe RGB and is easily profiled with my i1 spectrophotometer - reminders at 4 weeks to re-profile but on my old Dell it rarely needed updating. Or maybe at times I am a bit lazy.

4K fonts in system are ok ... at 5K they are marginal but if you know your programs you can switch to 5K when in Photoshop or Premiere and back to 2550x1440 on the fly.

Some small wake from sleep issues with the USB 3 hub in the monitor but not enough to be a challenge ... and you can restart to bring it to life.

These guys can flash the card to make it Apple compatible if you desire ...

http://www.macvidcards.com/store/p44/Nvidia_GTX_Titan_X_12_GB.html

No specific Apple drivers ... even in El Capitan which I am running the GM release but Nvidia has a downloadable driver and CUDA update that is stellar.

Bob
 

Pradeep

Member
Funny that this thread is resurrected at this point ... as I just scrapped my monitor and video card and moved to a 5K Dell monitor. Best thing I have done in a couple of years computer wise.

So I imagined that I would get the NEW MAC PRO but pricing it like my 2010 Mac Pro with a 5K monitor was north of $12K ... and I am not unhappy with the speed or storage of my present machine...just gets pretty warm in my office during the summer. With 15TB of fast HDs it generates a bit of heat.

I discovered that you can run an EVGA Nvidia GTX Titan X card in the older Mac Pros ... it has the fastest CUDA specs available and has 12GB memory with dual display ports to run 4 or 5K at 60 HZ.

I added the Dell UP2715K monitor ... about $1900 street price and am stunned at how the extra speed and resolution help ... video and Photoshop never looked this good. It covers 100% Adobe RGB and is easily profiled with my i1 spectrophotometer - reminders at 4 weeks to re-profile but on my old Dell it rarely needed updating. Or maybe at times I am a bit lazy.

4K fonts in system are ok ... at 5K they are marginal but if you know your programs you can switch to 5K when in Photoshop or Premiere and back to 2550x1440 on the fly.

Some small wake from sleep issues with the USB 3 hub in the monitor but not enough to be a challenge ... and you can restart to bring it to life.

These guys can flash the card to make it Apple compatible if you desire ...

http://www.macvidcards.com/store/p44/Nvidia_GTX_Titan_X_12_GB.html

No specific Apple drivers ... even in El Capitan which I am running the GM release but Nvidia has a downloadable driver and CUDA update that is stellar.

Bob
Thanks Bob, very helpful.

I did take the plunge last year with the Trash Can so video cards and power is not (hopefully) going to be an issue.

Just looked at the Dell website, they do not have a 5K in 30 inch size and the 4K is not 4096X2160 like the Eizo, but not sure that will make a huge difference. Having gotten used to two NEC 30" screens on my desk, I want the same amount of real estate, though I see that higher resolution of the 5K would provide that and more. Perhaps in this case 27 inches is quite enough.

What is the uniformity of the panels? Even my NECs are slightly uneven here, but that's the IPS problem with large panels I suppose.

So with the Dell, the question may be the 32 inch 4K vs the 27 inch 5K which has more pixels. One thing I found in the past is that Dell service wrt returns is really good, much better than B&H here.
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
I saw one review that put it a bit higher than the iMac 5K display and seemed to think it not a major issue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEjeVjq5irk

Ads and not completely biased towards photography.

Mine profiles with the i1 Display Pro software to a very consistent look without visible variance of note ... but I am not scrutinizing white black and greyscale screens looking for major
issues. One review suggested that this 27 is not a stitched panel so no side to side differences ... just variance as you approach the outer limits of the screen.

If you are using two 30 inch screens then this will seem too small even at 5K. I replaced a 27 Dell high def screen so I am overwhelmed with the real estate and still have a desk that I am
completely at peace with ... mine dealk is part of a set of built in book shelves and my space dictates size of screen.

The Dell should be seamless with the trashcan as you have Apple bios native.

The Eizo supposedly uses a LG panel renamed with their profiling hardware which is purported to be convenient but not at the level of a stand alone spectrophotometer ... I was going to order the
24 when I decided to take a chance on the Dell. I think that other than a full time business it would be hard to pay for the 32 Eizo when there are others than can be profiled.

Another issue is that we are in the infancy of this level of display ... not that prices will plummet at this level but hopefully consistency and longevity will improve in a generation of two.

Bob
 

JohnBrew

Active member
Another vote for the NEC PA272W. Even my IT friend was taken with it. It's a 2560 resolution and you might need a new monitor card to get 2560 (I did). It's heavy and built to last and just excellent for working files.
I was urged to get a 4K monitor by another friend, but you can't use them for internet surfing very well + I have a 4K television and have seen very, very little 4K programming or movies. And the satellite and cable companies don't seem to care much about catching up.
Good luck with your choice.
 

Pradeep

Member
I saw one review that put it a bit higher than the iMac 5K display and seemed to think it not a major issue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEjeVjq5irk

Ads and not completely biased towards photography.

Mine profiles with the i1 Display Pro software to a very consistent look without visible variance of note ... but I am not scrutinizing white black and greyscale screens looking for major
issues. One review suggested that this 27 is not a stitched panel so no side to side differences ... just variance as you approach the outer limits of the screen.

If you are using two 30 inch screens then this will seem too small even at 5K. I replaced a 27 Dell high def screen so I am overwhelmed with the real estate and still have a desk that I am
completely at peace with ... mine dealk is part of a set of built in book shelves and my space dictates size of screen.

The Dell should be seamless with the trashcan as you have Apple bios native.

The Eizo supposedly uses a LG panel renamed with their profiling hardware which is purported to be convenient but not at the level of a stand alone spectrophotometer ... I was going to order the
24 when I decided to take a chance on the Dell. I think that other than a full time business it would be hard to pay for the 32 Eizo when there are others than can be profiled.

Another issue is that we are in the infancy of this level of display ... not that prices will plummet at this level but hopefully consistency and longevity will improve in a generation of two.

Bob

I think my Mac Pro will not be able to run two of these since they each require two 1.2 display port feeds.

The Eizo flexscan 31" for a little more money sounds better though it does not go to 4096 on the long side. However, from what I have been able to determine, it is also not capable of independent software calibration and you simply have to pick the various settings yourself manually. Don't know if that is such a good idea. If it can be calibrated, then that would be my choice I think.

- - - Updated - - -

John on the Mac Command + gives you any size font in Safari you want:

View attachment 94975

This is at 4K....

Bob
Wow, that display is stunning!
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
The Eizo flexscan 31" for a little more money sounds better though it does not go to 4096 on the long side. However, from what I have been able to determine, it is also not capable of independent software calibration and you simply have to pick the various settings yourself manually. Don't know if that is such a good idea. If it can be calibrated, then that would be my choice I think.
If this is the monitor ... http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1083238-REG/eizo_ev3237fx_bk_led_backlit_ips.html

It looks to be 8 bit color and no Adobe RGB ... add about $4000 to get 10 bit Adobe RGB and self profiling in the new
31 inch ... http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1102772-REG/eizo_cg318_4k_31_4k_4096x2160_ips_lcd.html

Bob
 
If this is the monitor ... Eizo EV3237FX-BK LED Backlit IPS LCD Monitor EV3237FX-BK B&H

It looks to be 8 bit color and no Adobe RGB ... add about $4000 to get 10 bit Adobe RGB and self profiling in the new
31 inch ... Eizo ColorEdge CG318-4K 31.1" Widescreen LED CG318-4K B&H

Bob
Right, to get 3~4x the resolution you need to pay as many times for 4K, while keeping things apples-to-apples in terms of panel quality. The PA272 is pretty much the perfect photo editing 1440p panel, if you go up to 4K you'll be either paying too much or getting lesser panel quality, even if it will be noticeable only to particularly critical eyes.

John on the Mac Command + gives you any size font in Safari you want:
CMD+ isn't reliable though, it will scale generated content on modern websites well enough, but older sites or those that are dependent on raster graphics or with poor coding will start breaking up.
The retina MacBook, I believe, has a function that's capable of scaling on a per-application/window basis, which I think should become a standard function for all systems.

Having used the 5K iMac myself... I can't say that I was particularly blown away by the display, as well as the need to zoom in 200% to get a bead on whether the image is sharp or in focus. Maybe I was expecting too much going in, but the reduction in performance kept me from paying attention to the image quality, when it takes a couple seconds just to zoom into a 645Z image in Lightroom, it kinda takes you out of the experience. The display concept is good - it's simply paired to an underpowered mobile chip and can't be connected to any other computer if you do want more power.
 
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