The Big Shootout of 2016: Phase/Leaf/Pentax/Canon/Sony

[dougpeterson]

We are most of the way through putting together a rather large set of tests. Most of the below have already been or will be done for most of the below cameras (though not every test for every camera; there is only so much time in the day!)

Tests
- Aperture Sweep
- ISO Sweep (normal contrast scene)
- ISO Sweep (high contrast scene)
- Long Exposure Test
- Over/Under Exposure Test

Cameras
- Phase One IQ3 100mp
- Phase One IQ3 80mp
- Phase One IQ3 60mp
- Phase One IQ3 50mp
- Credo 50mp
- Credo 40mp
- Sony A7 II
- Pentax 645Z
- Canon 5Ds R

[Italics indicate the tests we have not yet completed, but should in the next week]

All raw files (around 20gb) available for free from our website.

Big Raw File Test with Phase One IQ3, Leaf Credo, Canon/Sony/Pentax

 

[voidshatter]

Thank you very much for spending your time and effort to make these tests!

I just have some ideas as one who enjoys testing just like women enjoy shopping (which you could ignore as pointless nagging):

a) I would not include the Credo 50 as it is redundant as the IQ3 50MP.
b) I would replace the A7 II with A7R II, or simply forget about it.
c) I would try to get a Leica S 007.

Again, I think this time you are doing a very good job and we are looking forward to it!

 

[dougpeterson]

Thank you very much for spending your time and effort to make these tests!

I just have some ideas as one who enjoys testing just like women enjoy shopping (which you could ignore as pointless nagging):

a) I would not include the Credo 50 as it is redundant as the IQ3 50MP.
b) I would replace the A7 II with A7R II, or simply forget about it.
c) I would try to get a Leica S 007.

Again, I think this time you are doing a very good job and we are looking forward to it!

- Credo included for those that want to analyze color differences. Resolution/sharpness/detail/noise will all be effectively identical to the IQ3 50mp.
- We have the Sony for video and BTS stuff, so we included it since we didn't have to rent it to have it for the test. I agree a A7RII would be a good inclusion (I can also think of a dozen or more other cameras I'd love to include, but time and rental budget is not infinite )
- If anyone has a Leica S 007 in NYC and would like to bring it this week we'd be glad to include it.

 

[Quentin_Bargate]

- I agree a A7RII would be a good inclusion (I can also think of a dozen or more other cameras I'd love to include, but time and rental budget is not infinite )

I would have thought the inclusion of the A7RII is essential. It is a class defining camera that uses very similar sensor technology as used in the new Phase One IQ3 100mp. I think its good enough to replace most digital MF, but is that a step too far? These very useful tests might determine that question. Also, no Hasselblad?

 

[hcubell]

Doug, I'd support Quentin's recommendation on the a7RII. I currently use the a7RII and the Pentax 645Z. I have been an owner of the IQ180/DF, H4D50 and Leica S Type 006. The a7RII is a true ground breaker and would be conspicuous by its absence in your testing. Just my two cents.

Joe

I agree as well, Doug. Many potential buyers of a 100MP CMOS back already own a Sony A7RII and are thinking about what the 100MP solution delivers that the A7RII does not.
Thanks.

 

[dougpeterson]

I agree as well, Doug. Many potential buyers of a 100MP CMOS back already own a Sony A7RII and are thinking about what the 100MP solution delivers that the A7RII does not.
Thanks.

I think the A7RII would make a fine addition. We do not own one and I've already spent my budget on camera rentals getting the Pentax and Canon. But if anyone in NYC has an A7RII and would like to donate it for the test we'd be glad to provide you a free Phase One rental (and our gratitude) as payment to use it on Friday or this weekend.

If anyone would like to capture the scene with any other camera we'll have it set up until around Monday (though the fruit may go a bit sour!). Please contact us to arrange a time slot for you to have uninterrupted access to shoot it.

 

[Pradeep]

Wish I were closer. I'd gladly do that.

Joe

I agree, the A7RII is truly ground breaking. It is giving my Pentax a run for the money.

Doug, I have an A7RII and my daughter is literally a block away from you. The only problem is time. I can drop it off at your place along with a bunch of lenses for both the Sony and the Pentax if you like. I don't need a loaner or free rental in return.

I can't imagine any other dealer doing this for the good of the community. My sincere appreciation to you for setting it up. It means you really believe in what you sell. That is huge for any company. Phase is very fortunate to have you guys batting for them.

 

[dougpeterson]

I agree, the A7RII is truly ground breaking. It is giving my Pentax a run for the money.

Doug, I have an A7RII and my daughter is literally a block away from you. The only problem is time. I can drop it off at your place along with a bunch of lenses for both the Sony and the Pentax if you like. I don't need a loaner or free rental in return.

I can't imagine any other dealer doing this for the good of the community. My sincere appreciation to you for setting it up. It means you really believe in what you sell. That is huge for any company. Phase is very fortunate to have you guys batting for them.

PM'd.

 

[GrahamWelland]

If Pradeep and Doug can get it together to include the A7RII then I'll happily personally buy both of them an adult beverage of their choice!!

Thanks all.

 

[Pradeep]

PM'd.

I think we're good to go tomorrow Doug, see my reply.

This will be very interesting.:thumbs:

Hey Graham, you're on:chug:

 

[hcubell]

I think we're good to go tomorrow Doug, see my reply.

This will be very interesting.:thumbs:

Hey Graham, you're on:chug:

Thanks for supplying the A7RII. What lens are you sending with it?

 

[GrahamWelland]

If you shot the same rodies on a cambo Actus with A7RII the fight might be fairer.

 

[tjv]

I would have thought the Nikon D810 to be an essential test camera here. It's pretty much the bread and butter camera for a good many people now, probably more so that the Sony.

I also wonder how the newer IQ3 series backs compare to the older IQ1 / Credo backs, particularly the 60mpx versions, seeing as the electronics were changed in the IQ2 to allow for LE mode.

 

[Pradeep]

Thanks for supplying the A7RII. What lens are you sending with it?

Doug has asked for just the 55 1.8, but I am including the Batis 25 f2 with it, hope he will test both.

 

[Pradeep]

I would have thought the Nikon D810 to be an essential test camera here. It's pretty much the bread and butter camera for a good many people now, probably more so that the Sony.

I also wonder how the newer IQ3 series backs compare to the older IQ1 / Credo backs, particularly the 60mpx versions, seeing as the electronics were changed in the IQ2 to allow for LE mode.

I think it is not so much about testing popular cameras as it is about testing similar sensors. The 810 is 36MP for sure, but I guess he has to draw the line somewhere.

Thus, the Sony A7RII is 42MPx, and a sensor that is probably close if not similar to the new one in the IQ3 100. The Pentax 645 and the Canon 5DSR are 50Mpx sensors although completely different from each other in design. The Pentax is probably very close to the IQ3 50mp back.

In the end, it is probably foolhardy to test a newer product against an older one from the same company. If the differences are minimal it would be hard to sell the newer product. OTOH, it may be even harder to justify a very expensive product if a cheaper one is very similar.

So it is a great thought on the part of Doug to be doing this in the first place. I for one am very interested to see the results, even if it is only out of intellectual curiosity.

 

[hcubell]

I think it is not so much about testing popular cameras as it is about testing similar sensors. The 810 is 36MP for sure, but I guess he has to draw the line somewhere.

Thus, the Sony A7RII is 42MPx, and a sensor that is probably close if not similar to the new one in the IQ3 100. The Pentax 645 and the Canon 5DSR are 50Mpx sensors although completely different from each other in design. The Pentax is probably very close to the IQ3 50mp back.

In the end, it is probably foolhardy to test a newer product against an older one from the same company. If the differences are minimal it would be hard to sell the newer product. OTOH, it may be even harder to justify a very expensive product if a cheaper one is very similar.

So it is a great thought on the part of Doug to be doing this in the first place. I for one am very interested to see the results, even if it is only out of intellectual curiosity.

I look forward to the test results and appreciate Doug's efforts, but if the Phase backs are being tested with a tech camera and tech camera lenses, the playing field is quite tilted against the non-Phase cameras. Most users of these systems do NOT use tech cameras.

 

[Wayne Fox]

I look forward to the test results and appreciate Doug's efforts, but if the Phase backs are being tested with a tech camera and tech camera lenses, the playing field is quite tilted against the non-Phase cameras. Most users of these systems do NOT use tech cameras.

I think we’ve already seen enough tests on tech cameras, I assumed they were shooting the backs on the XF.

 

[Jorgen Udvang]

Is there any particular reason why the D810 is not a part of this? It must be the most used high megapixel 35mm DSLR the last couple of years, and is a camera that is relevant to tens of thousands if not hundreds of thousands of photographers. While it uses a Sony sensor, Nikon seems to get very different results from that sensor than Sony did.

 

[JeRuFo]

Is there any particular reason why the D810 is not a part of this? It must be the most used high megapixel 35mm DSLR the last couple of years, and is a camera that is relevant to tens of thousands if not hundreds of thousands of photographers. While it uses a Sony sensor, Nikon seems to get very different results from that sensor than Sony did.

While the D810 is no doubt a much loved camera, I don't see the point in including every camera. While it's true that Nikon and Sony get different results from the same sensors, the diferrences are more night and later that night. If you see the a7rII compared to the IQ3 100, it's not that hard to imagine how the D810 will fit in.

 

[voidshatter]

While the D810 is no doubt a much loved camera, I don't see the point in including every camera. While it's true that Nikon and Sony get different results from the same sensors, the diferrences are more night and later that night. If you see the a7rII compared to the IQ3 100, it's not that hard to imagine how the D810 will fit in.

... except that the A7R-II has poor dynamic range for long exposure: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3890417

But I agree that the D810 should perform similarly as the A7R-II generally.