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Thread: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

  1. #51
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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Hi Mat,

    Yes, I agree with you entirely. I just wanted to point out that in terms of this forum, which has international user participation, not everyone is lucky to have a Steve or a Doug to go in to bat for us; local / national dealers that sell anywhere near the quantities of equipment they do (I imagine,) or can help solve special use case problems with the efficiency they can (because they have the gear on hand).

    Phase makes a big deal about their dealer network and sells it as a plus to end users, but in my part of the world – and going by stories I've heard this is true for other parts of the world, too, as I'm sure it is in parts for Hasselblad's own dealer network – it's actually a disincentive to buy their products. Here, the Phase dealer is simply not responsive.

    My thinking echoes yours in that I know this type of gear is very specialised let alone finicky and expensive, and sometimes the better camera – considering they're essentially equal products when assessing output and overall feature sets – is the one that is sold by the company you know will answer the phone and be receptive to questions, both before and after sale. To do that for Phase, I'd have to phone the other side of the world. For Hasselblad, it's a local call for me.

    All of this is to say that because there are two respected Phase dealers well represented here, I think people do get a warped idea about how good brand A vs. B is in terms of pre and after sales support. That's really all I'm saying.

    (Sorry for the convoluted post!)

    Quote Originally Posted by mjr View Post
    I'm not sure it's being delusional tjv, people can only state their own experience, I actually think my Phase dealer is pretty useless, in contrast my Leica dealer here was unbelievably good, he was available 24/7 and went out of his way to get me sorted when I needed help, my Phase dealer takes days to answer emails which really annoys me. Having a global view on how good or bad dealers are isn't so important, only how your local dealer works for you. The good thing about my dealer is they are very open on pricing and extremely competitive, I saw a post earlier on a thread about current XF and lens pricing and I was amazed, I bought brand new for substantially less than the prices quoted.

    Bottom line is that the individuals experience with their own dealer will obviously dictate how positive or negative they are, but if you have a good dealer then how bad other dealers are is of little consequence. I wouldn't stop buying from a good dealer locally based on how bad the dealer is in another country for example.

    Mat
    Last edited by tjv; 22nd July 2016 at 03:32. Reason: My original post didn't make too much sense, so I've tried to clarify myself...

  2. #52
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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    I know that a few well known Hasselblad & tech camera users have been working closely with Hasselblad to improve both the software and hardware for that kind of use. Sean is one of them, so one can only hope they're listening and quitely working away on things. We need someone out there to be a test case for us!

    Quote Originally Posted by torger View Post
    In the forums there are relatively few Hasselblad owners, and even fewer that use it with tech cams. Hasselblad as a company has not been as interested in tech cams as Phase One. As a result, there's less information floating around about how Hasselblad + Phocus deals with tech cams.

  3. #53
    Senior Member Jamgolf's Avatar
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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Quote Originally Posted by f8orbust View Post
    ... another big positive for H/B - they publish, for all to see, their upgrade pricing... No cloak-and-dagger involved, just there in black and white.
    Anybody have a link for P1’s upgrade pricing policy ?
    I agree that similar ease of getting an upgrade price from P1 would probably be widely and highly appreciated.
    However, as much as I appreciate HB's policy of publishing their upgrade pricing, the offer plain sucks.
    $8.5K for IQx50/IQx60/IQx80/Credo60/Credo80 - that is not much of an offer.
    P1's offer would be approximately 1.7X to 3.5X of HB offer (depending on model).
    So, open pricing policy is very nice but better $$$ trade-in credit is what really matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    Some people on this forum are completely delusional about how good the Phase dealer network system is in practice for the vast majority of end users across the world. In my country, the Phase / Leaf dealer is crap and Hasselblad distributor much more on to it.
    Stating a fact is not being delusional - it's being factual. It's unfortunate that P1 dealer in your vicinity is not to your liking. P1 dealers in the US that I've dealt with are doing better than a very fair job. They are answering questions privately and on the forums, supporting existing and prospective customers, running tests and providing raw files, providing remote demo sessions, or travelling to different cities and offering in person demos. I am appreciative of what they do. At some level people worldwide, including yourself, are benefiting from their presence here and the services they are providing. Hasselblad (or its dealers) are providing no such public service.

    Let me add I'm not a P1 fan-boy. In fact other than a Capture One license, my recent IQ3 purchase is the first time I've bought anything P1. Even this IQ3 is in H mount. I've owned far more Hasselblad equipment than Phase... Superachromat 250, 40 CFE/IF, 100/3.5 etc. etc.

    Not everyone's experience is the same based on location, circumstances, etc.

    Cheers!
    Last edited by Jamgolf; 22nd July 2016 at 12:52.
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  4. #54
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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    I agree with you, delusional is too loaded and strong word. (I blame my word choice on lack of sleep.)

    In any case, I tried to better articulate my thoughts in a following post.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamgolf View Post
    I agree that similar ease of getting an upgrade price from P1 would probably be widely and highly appreciated.
    However, as much as I appreciate HB's policy of publishing their upgrade pricing, the offer plain sucks.
    $8.5K for IQx50/IQx60/IQx80/Credo60/Credo80 - that is not much of an offer.
    P1's offer would be approximately 1.7X to 3.5X of HB offer (depending on model).
    So, open pricing policy is very nice but better $$$ trade-in credit is what really matters.



    Stating a fact is not being delusional - it's being factual. It's unfortunate that P1 dealer in your vicinity is not to your liking. P1 dealers in the US that I've dealt with are doing better than a very fair job. They are answering questions privately and on the forums, supporting existing and prospective customers, running tests and providing raw files, providing remote demo sessions, or travelling to different cities and offering in person demos. I am appreciative of what they do. At some level people worldwide, including yourself, are benefiting from their presence here and the services they are providing. Hasselblad (or its dealers) are providing no such public service.

    Let me add I'm not a P1 fan-boy. In fact other than a Capture One license, my recent IQ3 purchase is the first time I've bought anything P1. Even this IQ3 is in H mount. I've owned far more Hasselblad equipment than Phase... Superachromat 250, 40 CFE/IF, 100/3.5 etc. etc.

    Not everyone's experience is the same based on location, circumstances, etc.

    Cheers!
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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    A straightforward video showing the use of a h6d-100 back on a tech cam with live view thru a iPad on location shooting would be a welcome start for me. I have the HTS and use it often but always wanted to go the tech cam route. I'm thinking older Hasselblad company thinking was tech cam sales hurt the HTS and additional lens sales, new management might see now that selling the camera to tech cam users will also produce some additional lens sales. I suggested to some at Hasselblad that they form an alliance with Linhof for example to provide a complete solution! I see Hasselblad now as having the potential to produce a single kit solution for most photographers ala H6D, HTS, TCam and X1D the versitatlity is endless am I the only one who see's this?

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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Electronic Shutter adds another argument in favor of IQ3-100 vs H6D-100c for technical camera use-case, atleast until Hasselblad implement this for H6D-100c.
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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamgolf View Post
    Electronic Shutter adds another argument in favor of IQ3-100 vs H6D-100c for technical camera use-case
    For those that don't follow every thread this is discussed here:
    Phase One Electronic Shutter - Full details and Q&A
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183

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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    For those that don't follow every thread this is discussed here:
    Phase One Electronic Shutter - Full details and Q&A
    Just updated to firmware CP3.01.11 and tried the ES option. Seems to work well. I'll do some more testing to figure out the scenarios where ES will be my primary mode and when the Copal shutter will still have to be used. But this is quite a positive development as techcam setup times can now be much improved since users wont have to fiddle with the sync cables anymore (most of the time).

    Good job team Phase One
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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    I'm actually struggling to see when I would use the copal shutter. If the early info is correct about the shutter not being constantly charged like it is in live view, and there are no associated heat or noise issues, then using ES seems to be a more fluid workflow in tandem with live view.

    You can go right from the ES screen to live view and back, and you don't have to flip the shutter open and closed in between LV and taking a photo.

    The dark frame sequence can be a small hassle, but even when one of those is required the process seems easier.

    Dave

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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Isn't there potential rolling shutter issues with moving subjects with ES? I was kind of ecstatic about the news until I realised I don't actually own an IQ3 100! Maybe in 5 years I'll be able to afford an upgrade my Credo and keep life in my old Linhof.

    Quote Originally Posted by dchew View Post
    I'm actually struggling to see when I would use the copal shutter. If the early info is correct about the shutter not being constantly charged like it is in live view, and there are no associated heat or noise issues, then using ES seems to be a more fluid workflow in tandem with live view.

    You can go right from the ES screen to live view and back, and you don't have to flip the shutter open and closed in between LV and taking a photo.

    The dark frame sequence can be a small hassle, but even when one of those is required the process seems easier.

    Dave
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    Senior Member dchew's Avatar
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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    Isn't there potential rolling shutter issues with moving subjects with ES? I was kind of ecstatic about the news until I realised I don't actually own an IQ3 100! Maybe in 5 years I'll be able to afford an upgrade my Credo and keep life in my old Linhof.
    Yes certainly rolling shutter is the main concern. I will have to test wind and water. Long water exposures shouldn't be an issue but shorter exposures might be.

    Dave
    davechewphotography.com
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    Cool Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Hello,
    I personally test the H6D-100c in photokina, my visit to Hasselblad studio was focused around the new H6 system, live view, display, video, and about the pixel quality as the new 100mpix pixels are smaller in size than the 50mpix one.
    I was astonished by the quality of the shot made at ISO 12800 without flash and underexposed to check the noise in shadows etc.

    https://www.facebook.com/domenico.ro...ype=2&theater#

    Here's a little video I've made live with Facebook while I was there...

    About the use with technical camera as I'm interested in, they said me the camera have all the connections needed and they made agreement and sharing od technology around the interface with ALPA that have the stand in front, now is possible to use H lens on ALPA tech camera and control them, also the back is powered from the ALPA camera and no need of external battery pack.

    Substantially, for technical use now the H6D-100 have the same use and support (if not better) than the concurrence, and with some restriction the HTS 1,5 can stand, avoiding the use of tech camera in many situations.

    I was very very pleased to see Hasselblad in so good shape and health (apparently), I see also P1 stand and tested the IQ1-100
    the phase stand was very low profile in comparison, they have no english docs about their product.

    Returning to Hasselblad, as I own an H5D-50c WiFi I didn't see a big step forward between, and I have decided to stay with 50CMOS that in all aspects for my needs is what I need, waiting the market stabilises, price drops as new products are arriving and improving in few Years.

    Best regards, Domenico.

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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    Isn't there potential rolling shutter issues with moving subjects with ES?
    Most landscape scenes should be fine including ones with leaves or grass moving in the wind. Shots of city streets with passing cars will not be (unless you want a long shutter speed like 10")
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Quote Originally Posted by dchew View Post
    Yes certainly rolling shutter is the main concern. I will have to test wind and water. Long water exposures shouldn't be an issue but shorter exposures might be.

    Dave
    No problems in light winds. The ability now to have a real shutter speed that I selected instead of 180th when 1/125 is asked for etc is priceless.

    You actually have more control over the ES on a tech camera which I find a bit surprising.

    Paul C

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    Senior Member dchew's Avatar
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    Re: H6d-100c or xf iq3100 for camera and tech cam use?

    Yeah and finally we can record the aperture!
    I've been thinking about all the little things this impacts when using a technical camera in the field:
    1. No more sync cable or cable release.
    2. I can take the photo immediately after live view. No moving the shutter bypass (or in my case forgetting to move the shutter bypass).
    3. 1/3 stop shutter increments.
    4. Accurate shutter times.
    5. Accurate shutter times longer than 1 sec. this was a big issue when stitching.
    6. Recording aperture in exif.
    7. Faster workflow.
    8. Dark frame control.
    9. No more concern about replacement copal 0 shutters.
    10. No more using iPhone timers for long shutter reminders.


    I'm sure there is more. Pile on!

    Dave

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