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Where is the X1D ????

MGrayson

Subscriber and Workshop Member
I think we have to finally rename this thread to "Where is MY X1D?" :)

G
That IS the title in Internet Language:

Company X needs to do Y to survive => I want Company X to do Y
Pros do X, Amateurs do Y => I do X
Only Hipster Poseurs use X => I can't justify buying X
X users are all fanboys => I use Y
X is outmoded useless tech => I just bought Y
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
In my opinion, the real problem is not with skilled labor or infrastructure to produce these cameras. I doubt Hasselblad is working three shifts a day, seven days a week. That schedule could produce a lot of cameras in a pretty condensed period of time. Everyone here was mocking the "HANDMADE IN SWEDEN" inscription on the top of the X1D, saying it was an assembly of parts from around the world. Assembling and testing of a camera may require a degree of skill, but nothing that cannot be trained to a new employee in a fairly short amount of time. The real problem seems to be the money to buy the parts and the availability of parts, especially the sensor. The disruption caused by the earthquake in Japan makes obtaining sensors challenging at best. There may be a tiny part in the camera that cannot be obtained in quantity. Who knows? But, I think the difficulty obtaining the funds to actually acquire the sensors may be the stumbling point at this juncture. The firmware for the camera seems to be mature enough to release the camera, and if Hasselblad could, they would be releasing cameras as quickly as they could. It is getting from point A to C that is the stumbling block, and I really don't know what B is.
You could not be farther from what really happens . My experience includes new product introduction,new plant construction ,strategic sourcing,capacity strategies for large multinationals ..but I started doing this work for small divisions similar to HB. I also watched carefully the struggles that Leica went thru in ramping up production during the success of the M8.

It is a huge accomplishment that HB has been able to bring such a great product to market . It will be a huge accomplishment if they can deliver the product in quantity .

For the record ..no one has said HB is going under ...but two things have raised concerns (1) the X1D is late to market and (2) DJI has taken a majority position . It is folly to believe this is just about gaining access to working capital .
 

hcubell

Well-known member
For the record ..no one has said HB is going under ...but two things have raised concerns (1) the X1D is late to market and (2) DJI has taken a majority position . It is folly to believe this is just about gaining access to working capital .
I don't see what is so mysterious or disconcerting about what has apparently happened. There are three players here at the table. One is Hasselblad the company that needs significant capital to roll out the X1D project at a volume that is way beyond its historic capacity. The second is Ventizz, a private equity firm that invested in Hasselblad almost 6 years ago and is now beyond its investment cycle (i.e., 5 years). Given the history of missteps Ventizz had had to deal with and the length of its holding period, it has zero interest in doubling down and dealing with more exposure to commercial and financial risk by investing significantly more capital. The third is DJI, a minority investor that is a strategic player with a long term horizon, deep pockets, and the ability to see what Hasselblad's brand and expertise can do for its core business. They want in. Looks like a win win win.
 

D&A

Well-known member
x-country sking is too cumbersome, better take my 4WD tomorrow with 265 winter tires...:eek:
Why risk danger in attempting to drive in such conditions. It's just not worth it, especially as a valued member of the Getdpi community. Simply have the X1D forwarded by mail to one of the trusting souls here on Getdpi. I can assure you the camera will be thoroughly tested (shutter and all) in the coming weeks and months to ensure you a trouble free experience ready for your use, once you arrive in some distant foreign land to retrieve you camera. Any volunteers? :)

Dve (D&A)
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
I don't see what is so mysterious or disconcerting about what has apparently happened. There are three players here at the table. One is Hasselblad the company that needs significant capital to roll out the X1D project at a volume that is way beyond its historic capacity. The second is Ventizz, a private equity firm that invested in Hasselblad almost 6 years ago and is now beyond its investment cycle (i.e., 5 years). Given the history of missteps Ventizz had had to deal with and the length of its holding period, it has zero interest in doubling down and dealing with more exposure to commercial and financial risk by investing significantly more capital. The third is DJI, a minority investor that is a strategic player with a long term horizon, deep pockets, and the ability to see what Hasselblad's brand and expertise can do for its core business. They want in. Looks like a win win win.
Howard ....can t disagree ..except you quoted me out of context and left off the part about scaling the production capacity . The financing issue is straightforward ..... It simply surfaced the operational problems of a small company attempting a huge scaling process. When a new product is late to market it forces the working capital issue .

Now you can believe that the product delays are the result of needing the funds to pay for the sensors , or that Sony had them on a reduced allocation or maybe its because its really hard to introduce a new product like the X1D and work thru the production issues .

All you have to do is look at what happened at Leica with the M8 ..the demand outstripped the company s capacity to deal with both scaling production (which robs from current capacity ) and potential warranty type issues (which are always more likely when a product is rushed to market ).

Its great that DJI stepped up to keep HB afloat ...but its not great that they had to do so .

Product delay + new majority owners to provide working capital = greater risk . How we see this is a function of our experience and perspective.

I am definitely OK with a more positive view and hope to be wrong in my pessimism . I just don t appreciate being quoted out of context or as others have done ...restating my POV in a ridiculous fashion .

Couple of things that keep coming up :

DJI isn’t stupid and they aren t investing money in a loser ........of course not ! They most certainly bought into HB to position themselves for high resolution aerial solutions . Its a $1B company making an investment in a $30M ..who thinks its about having HB make a profit . By taking control they are protecting their original investment objectives . In light of the importance to DJI to move upscale ..it could be worth many times the investment to date . They will protect it over all other objectives .

DJI and the existing HB management ...may not perceive scaling production the same way . The fast way to accomplish this is to outsource as much as possible of the new processes . Far larger subcontractors (most in asia ) are much better positioned to accomplish this . The current HB management has put a lot of emphasis on Made in Sweden and its of critical importance to the existing work force(that must be relied upon to scale anything ). Some of have made light of this issue ..but the CEO will not think it insignificant or in the slightest way funny .

Whatever happens ..it will not be the HB we have known ..maybe thats good but its not what I thought after listening to the CEO talk about his turnaround efforts . The return to its legacy of producing the very finest cameras ..hand made in Sweden..seems like a long shot .
 

rriley

Member
Whatever happens ..it will not be the HB we have known ..maybe thats good but its not what I thought after listening to the CEO talk about his turnaround efforts . The return to its legacy of producing the very finest cameras ..hand made in Sweden..seems like a long shot .
And the more outside capital that comes in the more dilution of the original equity so Hasselblad's control is declining.
 
Why risk danger in attempting to drive in such conditions. It's just not worth it, especially as a valued member of the Getdpi community. Simply have the X1D forwarded by mail to one of the trusting souls here on Getdpi. I can assure you the camera will be thoroughly tested (shutter and all) in the coming weeks and months to ensure you a trouble free experience ready for your use, once you arrive in some distant foreign land to retrieve you camera. Any volunteers? :)

Dve (D&A)
keep on dreaming!! ;)
In one hour I am off to the big event (pick up):eek:
 

hcubell

Well-known member
Howard ....can t disagree ..except you quoted me out of context and left off the part about scaling the production capacity . The financing issue is straightforward ..... It simply surfaced the operational problems of a small company attempting a huge scaling process. When a new product is late to market it forces the working capital issue .

Now you can believe that the product delays are the result of needing the funds to pay for the sensors , or that Sony had them on a reduced allocation or maybe its because its really hard to introduce a new product like the X1D and work thru the production issues .

All you have to do is look at what happened at Leica with the M8 ..the demand outstripped the company s capacity to deal with both scaling production (which robs from current capacity ) and potential warranty type issues (which are always more likely when a product is rushed to market ).

Its great that DJI stepped up to keep HB afloat ...but its not great that they had to do so .

Product delay + new majority owners to provide working capital = greater risk . How we see this is a function of our experience and perspective.

I am definitely OK with a more positive view and hope to be wrong in my pessimism . I just don t appreciate being quoted out of context or as others have done ...restating my POV in a ridiculous fashion .

Couple of things that keep coming up :

DJI isn’t stupid and they aren t investing money in a loser ........of course not ! They most certainly bought into HB to position themselves for high resolution aerial solutions . Its a $1B company making an investment in a $30M ..who thinks its about having HB make a profit . By taking control they are protecting their original investment objectives . In light of the importance to DJI to move upscale ..it could be worth many times the investment to date . They will protect it over all other objectives .

DJI and the existing HB management ...may not perceive scaling production the same way . The fast way to accomplish this is to outsource as much as possible of the new processes . Far larger subcontractors (most in asia ) are much better positioned to accomplish this . The current HB management has put a lot of emphasis on Made in Sweden and its of critical importance to the existing work force(that must be relied upon to scale anything ). Some of have made light of this issue ..but the CEO will not think it insignificant or in the slightest way funny .

Whatever happens ..it will not be the HB we have known ..maybe thats good but its not what I thought after listening to the CEO talk about his turnaround efforts . The return to its legacy of producing the very finest cameras ..hand made in Sweden..seems like a long shot .
I did not mean to quote you out of context. Perhaps I misunderstood your formulation of the risks to Hasselblad: "Product delay + new majority owners to provide working capital = greater risk ." I don't see the fact of new majority ownership by a strategic partner with deep pockets that steps in and provides the requisite capital to finance the expansion of production, R&D and service capabilities as INCREASING the risk for Hasselblad's launch of the X1D relative to where Hasselblad was six months ago. Would it have been better had the requisite capital been lined up beforehand? Sure. If that's what you meant, I agree. On balance, though, I am way more confident about Hasselblad under the control of DJI now than under Ventizz six months ago.
I don't know what you or anyone else means when you say that HB will no longer be the HB we have known. Do you mean that it will be well capitalized and have the funding for R&D to develop new, innovative, and more reasonably priced products for the high end of the digital camera market? Sounds good to me. Do you mean that DJI and HB will work interactively and share technical know how? Sounds good. Do you mean that HB will abandon the high end digital camera market and start making point and shoot cameras with the Hasselblad logo? Not good, but I don't see that happening. As for Hasselblad's cameras being "hand made in Sweden," that's less clear. China has its strengths, and Sweden has its strengths. China is perfectly capable of producing beautifully manufactured products. OTOH, I think that the Swedes have exceptional capabilities in the design of products and user interfaces. The X1D is a perfect example.
 
Yeah, coming from a Leica the camera and lenses are bigger... lol. The main thing I noticed is that the colors you get from this sensor are gorgeous, vivid and seems to cover a wide spectrum. I first noticed it in my shot on the street with the street lights and cars,etc. and the ones in this review linked above were obviously much better than mine, and the colors just jump out. Very exciting.

One other note from his review. The lens is a little hard to get on and off, but I think this is because of the weather sealing. It's also because most of the lens barrel is the focus ring, so you have to get a good grip on the small part that isn't the part that turns. It doesn't take 2-3 minutes to change a lens though.
 

hcubell

Well-known member
An actual user review

https://kchaeblog.wordpress.com/2017/01/11/x1d-first-impressions/

- slow to focus
- lenses too big
- lenses difficult to change
- sensor gets dirty
- he loves it still :)
I had the same experience in changing lenses when I handled the X1D recently. The 45 was fairly easy to get on and off, but the 90 was very difficult to get off. The seal was very tight between the body and the lens. I could see that being a problem if I wanted to change lenses in adverse weather conditions. I want the system to be weather resistant, but I still need to be able to change lenses without too much effort.
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
regards the review: His photos look lovely.

Why people choose to whine about things that are obvious is beyond me, particularly the size and weight. Wasn't that obvious the first time you picked it up?

G
 

hcubell

Well-known member
regards the review: His photos look lovely.

Why people choose to whine about things that are obvious is beyond me, particularly the size and weight. Wasn't that obvious the first time you picked it up?

G
Isn't it possible he never demo'd it with the 90mm lens?
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
Demo'ing a camera for 20 minutes and dealing with the reality of owning a purchase after spending
next to no time with a camera are different. Especially when everyone is telling you at the demo how
"small" the camera is.

Walking all day with a camera will tell you your limits. I love large cameras with great big OVF but
for travel and being a bit less conspicuous I will carry the smallest camera I can find that will
give me decent IQ. Even then I will use a monopod 90% of the time.

The lens changing may not have been apparent at the demo as you are handed the camera ...
from someone wearing white cotton gloves ....

The Loxia lenses for the Sony with gaskets are very difficult to put on ... but doable.

I am sure that he will grow to love the camera over time. Most of us would.

Bob
 

hcubell

Well-known member
The lens changing may not have been apparent at the demo as you are handed the camera ...
from someone wearing white cotton gloves ....

The Loxia lenses for the Sony with gaskets are very difficult to put on ... but doable.

Bob
Same with the Batis lenses for the Sony A7RII. The 90mm XCD lens seemed a lot more difficult. As Josh Merwin noted, there is very little room on the lens barrel to grab and twist. Oh well, let's hope this is the biggest issue with the X1D. No doubt, everyone will be evaluating the X1D performance using their own baseline camera to set expectations. For example, someone thinking that the X1D's AF will be comparable to a DSLR or even a really good mirrorless will be very disappointed. OTOH, if your baseline is the AF performance of medium format cameras like the H series or the Phase XF, you may be perfectly satisfied.
 

stephengilbert

Active member
Two things: 1. Is it possible that lens changing will become easier over time, that the seals will "break in" a bit?

2. "I think I’ll try to learn how to clean on my own. That will save me during long travels where there will be no Hasselblad agents." A professional photographer who takes his cameras to a dealer to have the sensor cleaned? I can clean a sensor. :)
 
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