An update on camera shake and tripods (Phase)

[tashley]

In my Icelandic thread I noted that I had lost a lot of shots to camera shake at shutter speeds of 1/80th and below, despite using a tripod and cable release. The rig was a Phamiya on a Gitzo aluminium GT2330 with Manfrotto 322RC2 ball head and a 150mm Mamiya lens.

Many people kindly suggested that I try to narrow down the problem and I have done so by replicating it with the same setup at 1/20th and 1/80th with the shutter firing immediately, with MUP and a one second delay and with MUP and a six second delay. As you might expect the problem is worst at 1/20th and no MUP but is still slightly visible even at an 80th and six second MUP delay.

So I switched tripod rig to my Manfrotto 055PROB tripod with 410 geared head, moving total weight up from 5.6lbs to 8.2lbs. (for Euro types that's a gain of just over a kilo). The geared head is MUCH nicer to use and has a much larger plate too.

I'm guessing that the tripod is the major factor but in any event even at 1/20th of a second the difference is immediate: provided MUP and at least a second's delay is used, the shake is gone.

Lordy how I wish I'd known that last week!

Thanks for your help all.

Tim

 

[Bernard]

Tim,

Manfrotto heads have an annoying tendency to develop some play. Try tightening the hex screws underneath.

 

[tashley]

Tim,

Manfrotto heads have an annoying tendency to develop some play. Try tightening the hex screws underneath.

Thanks Bernard, though I have to say that the head is as tight as anything - so much so that it can be hard to get the exact angles one wants which is why I prefer the geared head. I will eventually test the ball head on the manfrotto tripod and I expect thereby to demonstrate that the problem is the tripod not the head...

 

[Dale Allyn]

Good to know you've identified the problem. Thanks for the report.

 

[carstenw]

Hmm, I have an older Manfrotto 055C which I was thinking of replacing, but now I am all curious about this. Did you do any separate tests to see if the problem was the head or the tripod?

 

[tashley]

Hmm, I have an older Manfrotto 055C which I was thinking of replacing, but now I am all curious about this. Did you do any separate tests to see if the problem was the head or the tripod?

Not yet but I will. I am, however, pretty sure it's the tripod not the head: my Manfrotto ballhead is built like the Battleship Potempkin...

 

[carstenw]

Didn't the Potempkin sink?

 

[Geoff]

Under the weight of the extra "p" - Potemkin.

 

[carstenw]

Броненосец Потёмкин

 

[jlm]

did you note in LL P65 review, he mentioned shake issues, even with MLU. found he had to wait six seconds for the mirror slap to dampen out.

 

[tashley]

did you note in LL P65 review, he mentioned shake issues, even with MLU. found he had to wait six seconds for the mirror slap to dampen out.

Yup I saw that... but IMHO landscapes and light aren't static: there's still a moment to be seized and sometimes that moment evolves faster than six seconds so I'd rather have a more well damped tripod rig so I have wider latitude of choice...

 

[Jack]

Indeed: Nothing gives you sharper lenses than a good, sturdy tripod and a quality head. I recommend a minimum of 2 series Gitzo carbon fiber for all MF work, 3 series is better, and then I like to see it supporting at minimum a BH55 or similar capacity head. (Yes, the BH40 is too small IMO.)

The other thing we find with unsharp images on our workshops all the time are loose camera or lens plates -- use properly fitting anti-twist plates, definitely NOT the generic kind with cork or rubber bases, and screw them on tight!

Double issue with MF cameras: Many have native 3/8" tripod mounting holes with 1/4" reducer sleeves inside. You can tighten a 1/4" foot in that adapter and if the sleeve is loose, so is your foot -- so make sure your sleeve is tight too if your camera has one.

Cheers,

 

[Dale Allyn]

I don't like to use the self-timer in lieu of a cable release. This is partly do the lack of control over waiting out vibrations and wind movements, and partly due to timing of the shutter release for the composition of the image. For me, the timer is only my last ditch tool for when I've lost or broken my cable release. And having done so to the Mamiya, I would (and will) care a spare on any important photo trip.

 

[Bill Caulfeild-Browne]

Here are some of my thoughts from LL

http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=32931&pid=267688&st=0&#entry267688

Bill

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Three words and yes I am a snob. Gitzo carbon Fiber. There is nothing else better in my mind. Well maybe there is but Carbon fiber absorbs vibrations better than steel or aluminum will. Also get a head that will hold three times the weight you expect. Here is where overkill is a good thing

 

[Dale Allyn]

I, too, have found CF to be dampen vibration much better than aluminum (as have those testing such things). I still have a couple of aluminum tripods (one is a Gitzo Explorer) and they make nice light stands or scrim holders for tabletop stuff, etc.

 

[Woody Campbell]

Has anyone compared the Gitzo Basalt to the Gitzo carbon fiber in terms of vibration damping?

 

[fotografz]

It's amazing how much movement can come into play ... I learned this when shooting a bunch of images for a pin registered animation job. The slightest movement and the static background in the series of images jumped all over the place when layered and run through to check the subject action.

I reverted to a Locked down Gitzo G 1525 and Manfrotto ProBall 469, sand bagged the tripod with a 25 lb bag, and used a 3 foot long cable release ... while banning everyone from any movement in the room before we could get it all to settle down.

 

[KeithL]

I'm looking to buy a carbon fibre Gitzo Explorer. The reduced weight will be a bonus when trekking but I'm a little concerned that I'll always need to weigh the tripod down to get the stability of a heaver tripod. Any experience anyone?

 

[TRSmith]

DigiLloyd has an excellent for-pay article on sharpness on his site that includes tests of various tripod setups and their effect on sharpness. The results are pretty interesting since he found improvements within manufacturers lines (Gitzo) that seemed a bit counterintuitive. Number of leg sections and center column come into play. Granted, the tests were done with now "older" high-end DSLRs, but I think the results still apply. My guess is that if the larger sensor cameras are already "delicate" with regard to shake, there will be no substitute for very stable tripods. I think it's unlikely that a tripod designed for easy carry is also going to have the stability required.