Quality of out of focus image for 50mm lenses

[Woody Campbell]

So I've spent a couple of months shooting with the Nikon 50mm f1.4G. I'm not wild about the quality of its bokeh, the out of focus portion of images created with it. They tend to be "jittery" rather than "creamy". I've posted an example below - look at the upper left corner to see what I'm objecting to.

Is the 50mm f1.4 non-G better? How about the 50mm Sgma f1.4? The Zeiss isn't in the running because I need autofocus in the application that I use it for.

It would be very helpful if folks could post some examples.

thanks!

Here's the image taken with the 50mm f1.4G:

 

[Corlan F.]

Woody, dunno what kind of application you're referring to, but in any case the image posted above does not seem up to what the 50 1.4G is usually capable of. In fact i'm quite surprised with your results. Is the possibility of a less-than-stellar copy excluded?

It'll be interesting to see the input from some other 50 1.4G owners here...


note: don't have any dog in the fight, using the Zeiss 50/2.

 

[panda81]

Hi Woody,

From what I've seen, I think the Sigma 50mm f/1.4 has the best bokeh out of all the 50's on the Nikon F-mount. Of course, bokeh also has a lot to do with personal taste, and I really like the smooth, rich, and creamy versions, just like my desserts! Personally, I've shot with the Nikon 50/1.4D, 50/1.2, and Sigma 50/1.4, and the Sigma blows the other two out by far. I haven't paid as much attention to the Nikon 50/1.4G, but I've read many, many people's opinions that the bokeh from the Sigma version is much nicer than the Nikon. One shooter I respect made a lot of comparison shots between the Sigma and the Noct-Nikkor, and believe that the Sigma is basically the "poor-man's" Noct when it comes to bokeh. I also own the Noct-Nikkor, and I agree with him to a certain degree too.

Unfortunately I don't have a lot of samples uploaded on the web to really show off the Sigma bokeh, but here is one mediocre sample. I'll be glad to find and upload more, or even just take test shots around the house in the next few days if it will help you.

 

[ibcj]

Something doesn't look right with the sample photo. Have you taken tripod mounted shots of static subjects at various apertures ?

I've owned 3 copies of the 50 1.8 AFD, 2 copies of the 50 1.4 AFD, and 2 copies of the 50 1.4 AFS-G. The G version is definitely the best.
I've heard many good things about the Sigma and seen some great examples, but I've yet to own one.
My Zeiss ZF.2 50mm f2 should be here tomorrow. I seem to have something for the 50mm focal length.

 

[JimCollum]

I did some testing between the 2 (new Nikon G and the Sigma) when i was looking for a fast 50mm. I prefered the Sigma, have that, and don't regret it at all (it's a bigger lens. takes 77mm filters)

 

[Oren Grad]

Is the 50mm f1.4 non-G better?

No. I owned a 50/1.4 AF a good while back - used it on film with N8008s and N90 bodies - and it, too, was prone to frizz in OOF backgrounds with the lens wide open and the main subject nearby.

 

[Woody Campbell]

Two more bokeh shots with the 50mm f1.4 G. All (including the image I started the thread with) are at f2.

 

[Steen]

Those portraits look great, Woody :thumbup:


No model at hand, so I went out into the garden and snapped a couple of flowers and clothespins with my Nikon 1.4/50 G.
All of them completely wide open, i.e. at f/1.4

Here's one with a large distance to the background.

click for the full resolution file


Nikon D300 • Nikkor AF-S 1.4/50mm G • 1/3200 sec. at f/1.4 ISO 200 • Capture NX​

 

[Steen]

And one with less distance to the background.

click for the full resolution file


Nikon D300 • Nikkor AF-S 1.4/50mm G • 1/1600 sec. at f/1.4 ISO 200 • Capture NX​

 

[Steen]

As usual with fast primes shot wide open there is on high contrast edges some magenta fringing just in front of the focus plane and some greenish fringing just behind the focus plane.

click for the full resolution file


Nikon D300 • Nikkor AF-S 1.4/50mm G • 1/2500 sec. at f/1.4 ISO 200 • Capture NX​

 

[Steen]

Here's an actual pixels crop showing the color fringing. Sometimes it is far worse than this.

Nikon D300 • Nikkor AF-S 1.4/50mm G • 1/2500 sec. at f/1.4 ISO 200 • Capture NX​

 

[Woody Campbell]

Steen - this is terrific - I think that you've identified the issue. The shot with the farther background is creamy; the shot with the near background is edgy - much the same as mine. I've gone over a bunch of images in LR and can more or less confirm this conclusion. I'm using this lens for available light parties and events, mostly indoors in poor light (everyone and everything is in motion so that's why I need autofocus). In these cases the background is usually fairly close.

Panda81 - with the Sigma do you notice a difference on bokeh depending on how far away the background is?

The Sigma is larger and heavier - a negative for me. Is it true that it focuses a bit faster (a major positive)?

 

[Brian S]

Modern S-Mount 50/1.4 has some of the nicest Bokeh of any Nikkor 50 that I've seen.

Both wide-open on the S3-2000.

 

[panda81]

Panda81 - with the Sigma do you notice a difference on bokeh depending on how far away the background is?

Oops, sorry I missed this reply.

Hm, I'm not sure I understand your question. Bokeh will always be different if your subject-background distance changes, no matter which lens, right? I guess the best way to test how the bokeh changes is it you make the comparison between:

lens 1 - closer distance
lens 1 - farther distance
lens 2 - closer distance
lens 2 - farther distance
etc.

I don't think I really have enough shooting experience to know that off the top of my head. However, I will say that I can't think of a situation where I've thought to myself, "the Sigma handled this bokeh very poorly, I think this other 50mm lens would have done better."

 

[David K]

I'm a died in the wool Nikon guy for many years now but IMHO, Canon has the edge at this focal length with it's new 50mm f/1.2

 

[glenerrolrd]

I have been researching the fast 50mm lenses for Nikon. I have the Noctilux (both) so I know what I am looking for. David is right the Canon 50mm 1.2 is a different league that the Nikon 50 s . my daughter uses one with her 5dII . They really optimized the bokeh .

If you want to see amazing bokeh look for examples from the Nikkor Noct 58mm 1.2 incredibly expensive but the background has no sharp edges . Diglloyd has an older test between the canon and the nikon showing the bokeh of the 1.2 lenses.

Or simpler just compare the nikkor 85 1.4 .

 

[panda81]

i agree the noct nikkor bokeh is pretty much unparalleled. however, the biggest turnoff when using that lens is that most dslr viewfinders really aren't too good for manual focusing. i use the d700, and even though d700 viewfinder is relatively better than most other dslrs, i still end up concentrating on getting precise focus more than composing and exposing the photo.

 

[Steen]

Steen - this is terrific - I think that you've identified the issue. The shot with the farther background is creamy; the shot with the near background is edgy - much the same as mine. (...)

Great, Woody.
Still, let's not forget that the Subject Distance has an even greater impact on the Depth Of Field (DOF) and thus the bokeh.
The closer to your subject, the more narrow DOF and the more smoothly blurred background (and foreground).
See dofmaster.com
Go close, then closer, then even closer, as some photographer is said to have said
Or how about waiting for the coming Nikon AF-S 1.4/85 G VR ... :angel:

That said, from what I've seen on the internet I think you will get the smoothest bokeh among the 1.4/50mm lenses with the Sigma.
There once was a thread on the FM forum comparing four fast 50mm lenses, the Sigma being one of them.
The Sigma came out with by far the smoothest bokeh. Unfortunately I don't seem to be able to find that thread again.
Personally I prefer a bit more contrast or 'character' or 'drama' or 'glow' in the bokeh, but that's just me. And of course you can always achieve that by stopping down a bit.
Actually what finally made me go with the Nikon was some user reports about frontfocus or backfocus problems with the Sigma lens.
Some years ago I had that kind of problems with another brand and I didn't want to go through all that hassle again.
But the Sigma 1.4/50mm definitely has its enthusiastic fan club.

Some time in February this year I posted this close-up-wide-open shot with the Nikon 1.4/50 G in another thread.
Note how narrow the DOF is at this short Subject Distance, and how blurred everything is right behind (and in front of) the focus plane.

Nikon D300 • Nikkor AF-S 1.4/50mm G • 1/320 sec. at f/1.4 ISO 200 • Capture NX​

 

[Lars]

The 50/1.4D is... not good in defocus rendering.

IMO the Sigma pretty much blows anything away except maybe the Canon 85/1.2L when it comes to rear defocus rendering. I know the Leica guys disagree with me but they're wrong.

The Sigma is also an extremely sharp lens. Just don't expect your AF to focus properly at 1.4 - you have to be more precise than that to nail the extremely shallow DOF (shallower than other 1.4 lenses due to the way the out of focus softness approaches the focus plane in this lens).

What I really like about the Sigma is its duality - creamy smooth almost soft wide open, razor sharp at f/2.

Sample: Sigma 50/1.4 @1.4, Nikon D700.

 

[otumay]

You make your point very well, Lars. Thanks for sharing.
Osman