Hello Eleanor :
Really am enjoying your river images - They are wonderful - Thank you for sharing !
Noting that some of the images are being shot between f/11 through to f/14, have you noticed diffraction issues ?
Have you shot one particular scene from f/5.6 to say f/11 and seen the progression of diffractions with the Zeiss lens ?
I shoot Hotel/Resorts and Architecture and the majority of times shoot at f/11 and diffractions is something I remain concerned with with such a high MP camera.
Any thoughts about these concerns ?
Jai Vora • jaivora.com • +91 982-136-00443 Member(s) liked this post
Nice work on your Portfolio, Jai.
Jai Vora • jaivora.com • +91 982-136-0044
Oh well, here we go. This is a camera that didn't interest me at all less than a week ago. Now it has replace the GH3 and the D700 as my main camera, and what a camera it is. So far, everything seems right, WB is great, skin-tones are great, colours in general are great and the shutter is almost as silent as on the Contax RX.
My worry has been my old lenses, if they could live up to the high resolution. So far, everything is fine. The photo below is taken with an 85mm f/1.8 AF that I bought nine years ago for less than $200. Aperture was f/4.
And just to be sure, a 100% crop:
The speed test:
D810 with Nikkor 300mm f/4 @ f/4
Ha Jorgen, great shots and good you enjoy the camera!
I actually did a quick test run with the 810 and some newer glass - 1.8/28 and 2.8/70-200 VRII this week and while I liked the performance of the 28, I was not so happy with the 70-200. Showed similar "soft" results as mine on the D800E at 100%. And I see similar "softness" from your 1.8/85 shot at 100% which is not surprising given the age of this lens.
Maybe this is nitpicking from me but exactly this softness at 100% was the reason why I sold my D800E 2 month ago. And I see now this was maybe the right decision for me.
But this is mostly at 100% and only with some lenses. So overall this is a great performer!
I was rather surprised that the old 85mm performed as well as it did, Peter. This means I can keep it for a while and spend money on a couple of WA lenses.
please do not get my previous comment wrong, as I said for this old lens it performs pretty well. And you normally do not look at 100%
For WA I would look at the "new" 1.8/28, the one I tested was really excellent. And I would add maybe also the new 1.8/20 for WA. Also the 4/16-35 VR might be a great lens in this range!
Overall I share your feelings of the 810 - very silent shutter, very improved ergonomics and OVF over the D800E plus very fast and accurate AF. I just feel acknowledged that some lenses are pretty soft on this 36MP monster, even new designs like the 2.8/70-200VR2. And as I used it with TC2.0 this softness did not get better of course. What was worse that you could not always predict when the lens was soft at the wide end, this changes and I am not sure on what it depended. Maybe one should use tele primes to get better results.
So it is quite a task to choose the right glass for this beast But I am sure you will master this and have fun!
D810 with Nikkor 300mm f/4 AF @ f/4, heavily cropped
Here's a 100% crop of a photo taken with the 20 years old 80-200 f/2.8 AF-S @ 200mm and f/4. This lens has always been one of my reasons to stay with Nikon. I think I'll buy another copy to be on the safe side
Here's the full frame:
As you know, I am a lens addict, and there are very few lenses that still cut it at 100% on the 36MP sensor. The short list is the Sigma 35 and 50 ART, the 85/1.4G, 105 DC (surprisingly), 200/2, ZF 85 & 135, and purportedly the OUTUS's (OUTAE?) will, but I don't own them. Honestly, that's about it. Every other lens I own shows it's weaknesses, usually in the outer 1/3 IC region. Surprisingly, almost any lens is good enough centrally even if it cannot match the sensor. The 24-120 is a good example; undeniably the worst lens in my bag, but it is on the camera for every casual photo event and often as my main travel lens -- and I get fantastic images even printed to 20 or 24 inches.
My point is, time to ratchet back your expectations a bit on glass. Personally, I believe it's the reason Canon has not entered the high MP DSLR race -- they know their lenses won't hold up any better than Nikon's do.
Going OT, but I think it also points to a significant change in the air -- cell phones are getting so much better, *most* amateur photographers are abandoning whatever camera and opting for the newest latest and greatest cell phone. I mean just look at the new iPhone's video capability -- freaking impressive on it's own, and it's just a phone! To serious hobbyists and pros, the DSLR platform remains the backbone, but that's a relatively small market that is already well-served.
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Congrats, you are already making the new cam sing
Thanks, Jack, but this camera has clearly taken singing lessons before it left the factory
I subscribe all (well most) of what you say!
Just the 1.4/85G is a special example for not being up to the 36MP sensor. I owned this lens and even sent it back to Nikon for adjustment because of weak results on the D800E. But the laconic answer was - this lens is within the tolerances - this may be the case but definitely not an appropriate answer for a €1700.- pro lens
One of the reasons I sold my Nikon kit!
I also agree with you on Canon and I am pretty sure to find the same issues in the 36MP Sony camp.
So what sense does it make then to keep a 36MP camera if most lenses are not up to the job. And if downscaling to say 24MP makes all MUCH better. Then I would prefer to stay with 24MP, which is in most cases anyway more than enough for all my photography
Yup, it is an awesome cam -- but in all honesty, the D800/E were (and still are) not all that far behind it. AF speed and Live View are the two main factors -- I personally never had issues with the 800/E AWB, always found it near perfect with skin except under extreme artificial light -- the 810 is a little better here however.
You had a bad copy of the 85/1.4G, not sure what else to tell you .
The reason to keep a 36MP high DR cam is T O N A L I T Y ! ! ! Please keep in mind there are a number of reasons other than max resolution to favor an imaging system === In fact, I would buy Nikon's next 54MP sensor *IF* tonality is perceptually improved over the 810, even though I know no lens will be up to it. Note here, that the reason I bought the 810 is precisely because color tonality was minimally, but enough to be visibly superior to the 800/E that I was able to justified the upgrade cost. For whatever reason, I do not see much difference in mono tonality, which is why I keep my 800E and leave it set up dedicated for mono capture. Makes for an awesome pair of cams, though in an ideal world I would own a pair of 810's; but I just don't shoot enough mono to justify, and frankly do not need the 810's marginally improved features for the type of mono I do...
if this is true then I am even more angry about Nikon! Why and how can it happen that the European Nikon representation gives such answers! Reminds me kind of on the issues with some of the D600's where Nikon also kept denying issues till finally they got in deep s.....
Finally these issues caused me to jump completely into mirror-less (at least for now) with Fuji (XT1) and Olympus (EM1). And of course one major reason was also the new 2.8/40-150 Zuiko lens with TC1.4 - mainly for wildlife. For the moment I no longer trusted Nikkor zooms and did not want to get into another adventure with the Nikkor 80-400 VR2
But enough here about bad things, I am aware that most manufacturers do have issues in their lineups. I obviously had the bad luck of owning some not so great copies of Nikkor lenses, although all of them were latest generation
Having said that I am still interested jumping back into FF with Nikon, maybe if they come out with that 54MP sensor (or whatelse), also I am more than convinced that I won't need this resolution for 98% of my shots. But improved performance WRT DR and tonality can always be an advantage!
WRT marginally improved advantages to the 810 compared to the 800/E - I see these advantages not just as marginal, IMHO these are major advantages. So major that I was almost close this week to buy a new D810 and some selected lenses for it. But I can wait .....
Still have one question to you: if I would go for the D810, would you recommend the 1.4/58 and the 1.8/85 as a good Nikkor lenses for this high resolution system?
Agree with Jack on the 85 1.4G. It's the only other lens I own which can really compete with my Zeiss 55 1.4 on sharpness.
Good news for me. No fire extinguisher needed. The 28mm f/2.0 AIS is surprisingly good wide open, sharpens up nicely at f/2.8-4 and is quite sharp all over at f/5.6.
D810 with Nikkor 28mm f/2.0 AIS @ f/5.6
On the whole I agree. In addition to the lenses you mentioned, I've been impressed (almost overwhelmed even) with the Nikon 20mm f/1.8. It's damned sharp and holds its own with the legendary Zeiss 21mm and Nikon 14-24mm. If you've tried it, I'd welcome hearing your opinion.
Also, what's your opinion of the Nikon 35mm f/1.4 vs. the Sigma 35mm Art? The Sigma certainly is priced right (relatively speaking) but I haven't tried it (yet).
Finally, the 55mm Otus is killer. Not my most popular focal length, but simply outstanding.
Last edited by Joe Colson; 8th December 2014 at 08:26.
Joe Colson Photography
Have not tried the N 20/1.8 -- I have a good copy of the 17-35/2.8 and it suffices for my wide angle needs, excellent central 2/3rds, though it's weak at the extreme corners (outer 8%). I also own a very good copy of the Nikon 24 PC-E, and it tends to be my critical wide angle of choice. (But stay tuned for an update here )
Nikon 35/1.4G was okay, and I think the ART was maybe a tad better. But for me the 35 focal is sort of no-man's land vanilla, a lens I tend to use stopped down more than wide open. So I tend to prefer 28 (and love my copy of the discontinued Nikon 28/1.4 asph) or 50 ART over 35 for most cases, and do not own any 35 prime at this time. When I travel, 35 is often a nice focal, but my 17-35 or 24-120 suffice nicely since I'm also generally at f8.
OUTUS 55. I prefer a slightly wider AoV than 55 (or Nikkor 58), and right now am LOVING the 50 ART. Of course it having good AF is also a plus, not to mention cost delta Also surprising is the 50/1.8G -- it is a great performer and so small and lightweight, I've pretty much dedicated it to my Df body. It lacks the full juice of the ART, but it's also half the weight and size -- and like 1/3rd the price of the ART and 1/10th the OUTUS?
"Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."3 Member(s) liked this post
I too decided to upgrade to the D810. Went the refurbished route and on the same day I received the D810 I also picked up a 400mm f2.8 AFI lens at a reasonable price. Talk about a one two punch. The D810 feels great and I enjoy the multitude of features such as quieter shutter, iso64, group AF, increased buffer etc. Tested group AF, face recognition and so on. No complaints so far. By the way plan to use the lens for ballet, surf, bird, supermoon, bikini photoshoots and so on. Here are a few first day shots of my super cute little neighbor as she was running around. Last image is 100% crop of the previous.
Last edited by The Smoking Camera; 9th December 2014 at 00:15.
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D810 with 28mm f/2.0 AiS @ f/4
Another from today at the pool with the 400mm AFI.
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I was thinking of giving the D810 a touch-up today, since black is sooooo last week. In the end, I changed my mind. Would look too much like a Pentax, don't you think?
D810 with 85mm f/1.8 AF @ f/2.8
I don't care what gear I have.
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ISO 64 is very convenient
D810 with 85mm f/1.8 AF @ f/9, 1/100s and ISO 64
Cool, Jorgen…. reminds me of a certain 007……
Last edited by Swissblad; 11th December 2014 at 05:35.
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Congrats Jorgen. Excellent shots.
Thanks, Rayyan. I'm trying to learn this camera
Sorry for the recurring theme, but nothing much is happening around here
D810 with 85mm f/1.8 AF @ f/4
My camera is probably worth more than my 17 years old Toyota, so I had a look around the neighbourhood to see what other people use for transportation. But the prices of Italian cars nowadays...
D810 with 105mm f/1.8 AiS @ f/2.8
I've installed a little table top studio in my office, to be able to make product shots etc. on short notice. I'm testing out lighting and how to get enough DOF with the D810 at the moment, and see that I could use a lens with tilt abilities. Would the old Micro Nikkor 85mm PC still be a valid option for this?
D810 with Sigma 50mm f/2.8 Macro @ f/22
I cannot determine whether the optical formula has been changed - but - the old 85mm PC lens had very good optics - see BR's review.
The alternative is to use stacks….
Here is a tether test using a D800, Nikkor 85mm PC-E…..
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The E features an electronic diaphragm - like the new 800mm etc - and nano coating - which you don't really need for macro.
There really is not a info on these lenses - see here on DPreview
Once again, some info by Bjorn - scroll down to the 85mm lenses.
If you can the old one for a good price, I would jump - these are amongst the sharpest lenses in the Nikkor line-up.
Took the D810 to a ballet rehearsal with the Nikon 70-200mm f4.
Camera is incredibly quiet compared to my other DSLRs.
Here's an image at iso 6400 with a bit of noise reduction using Adobe Lightroom.
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Jorgen, I use the 85 PC-E lens constantly for studio and table top work. Love it and have always thought it is one of Nikons better lenses. When the D800 was first introduced I had the chance to demo the camera for a long weekend and used the 85 PC-E lens quite a bit for my landscape work and found it to be without fault in this situation as well, notwithstanding using apertures that did not push the envelop of the tiny pixels on this camera to the extreme.
It is worth noting also when in macro mode diffraction issues due to DOF/Aperture and pixel size do not raise their ugly head in quite the same way. IOW's you can get away with more, well within limits.
Hope this helps.
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I've had both, used the initial manual one for years, then bought the newer version once it was introduced. The nano coating does help even with macro IMHO, resolution for pixel peepers is a tad better with the newer one but not jaw dropping difference, 1 f stop of aperture is eliminated with the newer version vs the older (f32 vs f45) but how practical f45 is on any digital camera is dubious at best let alone the D810, and finally the full automation of the newer lens is really a joy to use vs the older manual stop down. I can't emphasize this enough especially if you are shooting tethered and you should be for table top work.
The bottom line is this: I would have to be on an extremely tight budget to choose the older version over the new, especially in the application you are referring to here. My 2˘ worth, hope it helps.
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If ever there was a shot that exemplified Bresson's phrase: "the decisive moment", your post #140 of the two little swimmers exemplifies this!
Absolutely magical image!
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I had to return the used 800E I bought because it had defects. When I noticed the price drop of the 810 to $2996 I bit the bullet and got one.
This is one of my first attempts. The location is in Rocky Mountain National park. I went there to shoot Elk but nature did not cooperate and we saw not a one that day.
I was driving and noticed this dead juniper set up against the green lodgepole pine. I thought the juxtaposition between dead and alive was interesting.
Love to hear your comments and critiques
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Thank you, all of you, for good advice regarding the 85mm PC/E. I can see my wallet shrinking already I probably need the 24mm as much as the 85, so this might end up as a very expensive adventure.
As an alternative to shooting tethered, I'm probably buying a HDMI monitor that attaches to the hot shoe. The main purpose will be video, but I hope it will be possible to use it for still photos in live view as well. The Atomos Shogun is rather tempting:
Shogun | Atomos
The 85 PC-E is a very good lens and also gets to about 1/2 life size so is an almost macro. The 24 PC-E took me a few copies to find one I was happy with, and finally ended up buying one used from a member here that said it always performed well for him -- and it was indeed a great copy. Even with a great copy though, it's apparent the design is being pushed to its limits on a 36MP sensor -- but regardless it still makes great images I've tried a few different 45 PC-E's and was disappointed in their mediocre performance, which is unfortunate.
Is it something about the focal length of the 45 that is an issue as it appears that both Nikon and Canon both have underperforming 45 in the TS arena and both have 24mm that perform well.
“You don’t take a photograph, you make it.” — Ansel Adams
I agree Bryan -- and it is unusual, since the "normal" focal is usually the easiest to make really excellent optically.
I would agree Jorgen, except that 1) tilt only alters the plane of focus, though indeed shift requires significantly greater IC and this is tougher to design and keep usable; 2) neither lens performs particularly well "zeroed" as a straight lens either...