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Ricoh GXR - M Lens camera unit almost there ...

Godfrey

Well-known member
3 shot raw buffer? Not seen that since the original 1Ds...
Yes it's one of the negatives of the GXR. They could improve that by coming out with an updated body as it is part of the body's IO system, not a part of the camera unit.

I'd love to see a GXR+ body with larger raw buffer and improved IO responsiveness. But I have to say this is only rarely an issue.
 
Godfrey - I'm curious how you are using your GXR - are you using a viewfinder? If so, optical or the VF2? I think I saw you mention the VF2 in another thread - if you've used it, how do you find it?

I'm really interested in the GXR with this M-module but need a VF - I just can't get into composing on an LCD.

Thanks,

Joe
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Godfrey - I'm curious how you are using your GXR - are you using a viewfinder? If so, optical or the VF2? I think I saw you mention the VF2 in another thread - if you've used it, how do you find it?

I'm really interested in the GXR with this M-module but need a VF - I just can't get into composing on an LCD.
Optical viewfinders work very nicely. With the other A12 camera units (50 and 28 mm EFL, respectively 33.5 and 18 mm optical focal length) ...

GXR + A12 50mm + Leitz 5.0cm Brightline finder:


GXR + A12 28mm + Ricoh VF-1 28mm optical finder


I have additional finders for both 75mm and 40mm EFL field of view, for use with the Skopar 50mm and Ultron 28mm lenses on the M-lens camera unit.

The way that I've found using them that works best for me is to set the camera to Spot-AF with the AF area centered, turn on Full Press Snap, and then set the Snap distance to an appropriate approximate for your expected aperture and subject zone. Point with the center spot, half-press shutter to lock focus, frame and press the release the rest of the way. If you're going to make a series of shots at the same focus setting, I tap the FN1 button, which I have configured to toggle between MF and AF. Then the setting is held until I either turn the lens focusing ring or tap the button again. (Obviously, this won't apply with the M-lens module and manual lenses.)

Since the camera is thin and handy in size, the hot shoe mount is nicely placed to get your eye into the right position behind it.

I also have the EVF and I use it mostly when I need more critically accurate framing or want access to the on-screen control displays while I'm shooting. But I prefer shooting with the accessory OVFs or the LCD most of the time with the A12 28 and 50 camera units. I suspect I'll use the EVF more of the time with the A12 Camera Mount unit and the longer lenses, of course, as the manual focusing aids will make for precise critical focus.

(A side note:
The MF Assist magnification with the two fixed-lens A12 units isn't terribly great ... they've improved that quite a bit with both full screen and focus peaking display processing in the A12 Camera Mount unit ... and the servo focus on these two fixed lens camera units lacks responsiveness in manual operation. That's why I tend to use Spot AF more of the time with them ... the GXR's AF system is extremely accurate, while not super fast, and is as precise as my eye if I target the sensitive area properly.)

The EVF exactly replicates the LCD display and shows precisely what the lens is seeing. It turns the GXR into a diminutive eye-level TTL camera with tremendous precision, with a full, bright 100% coverage focusing field.

Optical viewfinders are more "approximate" in nature and lead to a different kind of thinking about the process of framing a photograph, one which understands and works with a mental approximation of what the lens is actually imaging on the sensor. Since most of my work happens with only a couple of different focal length lenses, and generally speaking I tend to use just one for very long periods of time without swapping lenses willy-nilly, I find this approximation does an excellent job of helping me point the lens in the right direction while I pre-visualize what a particular lens will see. I often find it best to turn off the LCD once I have my basic exposure and focus settings dialed in as the practice of constantly "chimping" for every exposure slows me down and distracts me from observing the subject at hand.

And there are those times when the LCD proves to be the best way to compose and expose a photograph. It's a big, bright view that is visible at even fairly large offset from the center line so I can hold the camera low, or high, relative to my eye and frame quite precisely. Or stick it on a tripod and work with it like I would a 6x9cm field camera in days past, with on-display levels, live histogram, and even framing/compositional guides. The camera proves to be very versatile.

What I really like about this modular system concept is that it's stretching the notions of what a digital camera can be. I find it best to consider that the body and camera units each supply me a completely different camera. The A12 Camera Mount unit will supply me with a Leica M-bayonet compatible, interchangeable lens camera (a "GXR-M" configuration). If I want a zoom point and shoot, I can pick either S10 or P10 and get in-body image stabilization, and medium or long zoom range. Presuming that the A12 Camera Mount pushes the success of the concept even further, I could see them producing an uprated version of the GXR body unit ... something with a bigger raw buffer, more responsiveness, faster IO, maybe even a in-built optical or electronic viewfinder in the future. Or a future revised Camera Mount with a higher Mpixel count, etc etc.

With a fully modular system like this, the future options are very broad.
 
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Irenaeus

Member
HELP! My GXR/28 has pink eye!

And there were 34 other files that Lightroom says were damaged and couldn't be imported. Have any of you run across the like before? Have I pointed too close to the sun? The battery was close to empty, could it have been something like that? Is there a quick fix or must it go back to Ricoh? Is there anywhere else that'd be better to send it to?

Objective inquiring minds want to know.

(Which is to say, I'm on the second day of my vacation and would appreciate any help you all could offer....):banghead:
 
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woodmancy

Subscriber Member
Re: HELP! My GXR/28 has pink eye!

And there were 34 other files that Lightroom says were damaged and couldn't be imported. Have any of you run across the like before? Have I pointed too close to the sun? The battery was close to empty, could it have been something like that? Is there a quick fix or must it go back to Ricoh? Is there anywhere else that'd be better to send it to?

Objective inquiring minds want to know.

(Which is to say, I'm on the second day of my vacation and would appreciate any help you all could offer....):banghead:
Most likely the battery. I would charge it and try again - if still bad, reformat the card in the camera. If that doesn't work try a different newly formatted card. Remember, act like a research physicist, don't try two different possible fixes at the same time.

Good luck

Keith
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Re: HELP! My GXR/28 has pink eye!

And there were 34 other files that Lightroom says were damaged and couldn't be imported. Have any of you run across the like before? Have I pointed too close to the sun? The battery was close to empty, could it have been something like that? Is there a quick fix or must it go back to Ricoh? Is there anywhere else that'd be better to send it to?

Objective inquiring minds want to know.

(Which is to say, I'm on the second day of my vacation and would appreciate any help you all could offer....)
Yes, this should be located into a new thread dedicated to it.

But certainly an out of energy battery can cause IO errors which corrupts files. It could also be a bad card, a bad reader, a poor connection between camera and computer, a faulty cable, or a problem in the camera itself. Any one of those issues could cause file corruption.

Do images look whole and proper when you display them on the camera's LCD after making an exposure? If they do, then the likelihood is battery exhaustion, cable, reader, card, etc in decreasing order of probability. Test one at a time.
 

Irenaeus

Member
Re: Ricoh GXR with pinkeye

Thanks, Keith, it's very encouraging to think that at worst I'm probably only looking at replacing a battery or card and not a whole A12 unit!

I take your point about research physicists but my intention for the trip was to not erase any SD cards until I'd backed them up twice, and I may not be able to manage to do that for this card very quickly. I have put in a fresh battery, though, along with a fresh, newly-formatted-in-the-camera-card, and haven't seen the problem recur.

I'll charge that original battery up again tomorrow, though, and dedicate a third card to test shots and then erase that to use for real* which at least will pay lip service to your "one variable at a time" wise counsel.

(*Unless, ,as sometimes happily happens, my quick "test" shots turnn out better than anything more consciously intentional!)

Thanks again for your rapid response!
 
Godfrey - thanks for the very helpful response. So when you use an optical viewfinder, you compose in the viewfinder and you focus on the LCD - is there an auditory focus confirmation on the GXR (not that I'm fond of using this)?

Cheers,

Joe
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Godfrey - thanks for the very helpful response. So when you use an optical viewfinder, you compose in the viewfinder and you focus on the LCD - is there an auditory focus confirmation on the GXR (not that I'm fond of using this)?
Probably better to think of it in the opposite order with the A12 autofocus camera units ... I use AF (or Snap focus) to focus the lens, which is reflected on the LCD and in the illuminated focus confirmation signal on the body (to the bottom/left of the hotshot). It's easy to see out of the corner of the eye when you're using an optical finder and operates nicely even when you're toggled the LCD off for use with an optical finder. After that, I frame with the optical viewfinder ... It sounds like two operations, but the way i have the camera set up, I normally just put the OVF to my eye, center the AF area on what I have in mind, half press the shutter release until I hear or see it lock focus, then reframe and press the release the rest of the way in one motion.

Working manual focus is a bit different. Because you can only see the focusing action on the LCD, you're best to stick with using the LCD for framing to as you will inevitably move the camera a couple of inches from where you were holding it to focus in the process of getting your eye behind the OVF. At large apertures, this can cause your primary interest to move out of best critical focus. When I'm doing manual focus for street and other fast moving situations, I normally zone focus ... there's a very nicely thought out indication of the focus zone with the A12 28 and 50 mm EFL camera units ... or use Snap focus.

With the A12 Camera Mount unit and all manual lenses, you'll be using the DoF scale on the lens to set up zone focus, and when you want precision manual focus and framing you'll want to use the LCD or EVF. A "no information" OVF is much more useful in the context of zone focus or the full TTL imaging system with manually operated lenses.

The GXR body also supports several options in sound signaling confirmation ... All operations (including focus), Level only, or Shutter only. I usually left it on Level only, and you can control the level indication (on the LCD/EVF) to be sound and indicator, sound only, indicator only, or off as well.

When fitted, EVF can either do exactly what the LCD does including being the place where you review exposures, or you can "split screen" so that review always images on the LCD and exposure/settings are always in the EVF.

A nice touch is that when you're using an optical finder, if you toggle the LCD off no controls that require a readout on the LCD can be shifted without illuminating the LCD for feedback. For what I use most ... the EV compensation control ... pressing the + and - buttons on the four way bring up the histogram and +/- EV scale on top of the normal view. Once you press the OK, the LCD shuts off again and you can return to the optical viewfinder. The really nice part of this is that I can't accidentally bump the aperture setting or ISO setting while the LCD is off ... I normally use Aperture mode, with fixed or Auto ISO, set an aperture for my intended zone and leave it there most of the time, so this works out perfectly.

As you can tell from what I've been saying, by and large I don't consider the GXR to be even remotely a "beginner's" camera. It is quite sophisticated and Ricoh has done an outstanding job of coordinating a LOT of features and options that contribute to serious photography in very sensible ways. It's not the highest megapixel camera on the market, not the fastest operating, has a relatively small raw buffer, etc etc, and of course for some the 16x24 mm sensor format is a limitation. But used with its limitations in mind, it has everything you need to do high quality photography and produces outstanding results.

I can't wait to get my hands on the A12 Camera Mount. Just got a confirmation email from Popflash last evening to tell me they expect mine to be available about the second week of September. I'm jazzed!
 
Godfrey - thanks again for the detailed explanation.

Having the visual confirmation on top of the body is nice - I would prefer this over an audible indication.

I'm comfortable using zone focus but was more concerned about situations when I am shooting with narrow dof - where as you describe the best approach is probably to compose and focus on LCD. Unfortunately it is this scenario (narrow dof) where I like holding the camera to my eye for stability and keeping the subject in focus.

Seems like the EVF is the way to go for MF lenses - at least for my preferred style of shooting.

Looking forward to seeing some photos with your new M-mount!

Cheers,
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
You're welcome, Joe.

... I'm comfortable using zone focus but was more concerned about situations when I am shooting with narrow dof - where as you describe the best approach is probably to compose and focus on LCD. Unfortunately it is this scenario (narrow dof) where I like holding the camera to my eye for stability and keeping the subject in focus.

Seems like the EVF is the way to go for MF lenses - at least for my preferred style of shooting.
I'm in full agreement on this: when you want to work with longer focal lengths or wider apertures, with an eye-level viewfinder, the EVF is the best tool for the job. The neat part about the GXR is that the LCD, the EVF and optical viewfinders are all peer tools with their niche of best applicability, to use as your particular desires and needs find best advantage.

I've been surprised by how easy and useful it can be to use the LCD for what I at another time thought would be much better handled by an eye-level viewfinder. It's made me discard some of my earlier preconceptions about LCD finders ... with 3", high resolution LCDs of this quality, a lot of the earlier complaints based on resolution, ability to see the subject clearly, etc are no longer applicable. And the fact that it takes a somewhat different technique to hold the camera still doesn't mean that it can't be done, is hard to do, or isn't just as effective.

The use of an LCD in bright lit circumstances is one of the few areas where an eye level viewfinder of some type is almost always a better pick, also the use with very long lenses, but generally speaking the modern LCD viewfinder is much more versatile and useful than this old fuddy-duddy at first imagined. :)
 

woodmancy

Subscriber Member
One of the DPR folks had a hands on with the GXR and wrote up his quick impressions:

http://ricoh-gr-diary.blogspot.com/2011/08/gxr-mount-a12-first-impressions.html

Also, two Japanese sites discuss it in more depth now:

http://www.grblog.jp/2011/08/gxr-mount-unit-1st-hands-on.php
http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/review/newproduct/20110808_465663.html

It's looking very nice. Just a few more weeks to fly by ... :)
Thanks for the info, Godfrey. I think I just died and went to heaven :bugeyes::bugeyes::bugeyes:

I wonder how the red dot people will respond to this?

Keith
 

Braeside

New member
Answering my own question above :roll eyes:

Park Camera are accepting pre orders (no UK price yet).

Question for you GXR aficionados, should I buy the GXR camera and an A12 50 or 28 now to play with until the M module is available?

I'm leaning towards the A12 50mm for its macro capabilities.

I plan to use my existing Voigtlander, Zeiss and Leica M lenses on the GXR M when I can get hold of it. I currently have an M8u and plan to keep it as well.
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Answering my own question above :roll eyes:

Park Camera are accepting pre orders (no UK price yet).

Question for you GXR aficionados, should I buy the GXR camera and an A12 50 or 28 now to play with until the M module is available?

I'm leaning towards the A12 50mm for its macro capabilities.

I plan to use my existing Voigtlander, Zeiss and Leica M lenses on the GXR M when I can get hold of it. I currently have an M8u and plan to keep it as well.
Sorry I couldn't help you find a UK vendor. ;-)

Sure, why not get a body and camera unit to learn with while you wait for the A12 Camera Mount to become available? Both the A12 camera units do a great job, and Keith has posted some excellent with with even the inexpensive P10 ultra-zoom camera unit. The GXR with either the P10 or S10 becomes a very handy zoom point and shoot type of camera.

I have both of the A12 camera units. They've made an awful lot of excellent photos for me.
 

woodmancy

Subscriber Member
I believe that Ricoh has priced the GXR/P10 package for an attractive entry level option. Last time I looked the price was lower than a Canon G11. The raw files from this lens work well for post processing and it makes a great travel camera.

Keith
 

Braeside

New member
Sorry I couldn't help you find a UK vendor. ;-)

Sure, why not get a body and camera unit to learn with while you wait for the A12 Camera Mount to become available? Both the A12 camera units do a great job, and Keith has posted some excellent with with even the inexpensive P10 ultra-zoom camera unit. The GXR with either the P10 or S10 becomes a very handy zoom point and shoot type of camera.

I have both of the A12 camera units. They've made an awful lot of excellent photos for me.
I might do that Godfrey, thanks. It would be so annoying to have the camera body and no sensor/lens while I wait for the M module.

I plan to dispose of the wee Lumix TZ10 point and shoot, a camera that I used along with my M8 when I was on holiday. It is pretty good especially for macro type shots and has GPS tagging. I missed an EVF though.
I do have the iPhone for GPS tagging so I guess I can part with the TZ10.

I'm sure I will have a lot more questions...
 

Braeside

New member
I believe that Ricoh has priced the GXR/P10 package for an attractive entry level option. Last time I looked the price was lower than a Canon G11. The raw files from this lens work well for post processing and it makes a great travel camera.

Keith
Thanks Keith, I just noticed that my favourite RAW program - Aperture - doesn't support the Ricoh:mad:

I do have Capture 1 so I suppose...
 
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