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From Joseph Holmes: Sony A7R Shutter From Shake Too Great for Many Longer Lens Uses

Jack

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
Sony has reported vibration issues and light leaks, shooters say to ignore it, making images is what counts.

Leica has color casts on it's sensor and shooters say ignore it and go make images, it's easy to fix in post.

Nikon has a left AF sensor out of whack and shooters come out of there chairs complaining about how any responsible camera manufacturer could let such an egregious defect slip by them.

Just sayin, seems like a double-standard... If Joe Holmes says there is a shutter vibration issue in the A7r, I'm gonna believe it. It may not pertain to me the way I use the camera, but it's certainly good to know it's there.

I personally agree with the just shoot em crowd, but still suspect my positioning it this way won't be popular here today :D
 
Guy Mancuso

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Nikon right side was out of whack also. The Sony light issue is a freaking joke. Who the hell sits in a dark room pumps up the ISO to 6400 and takes a 30 second exposure. Jack you forget every Phase body from AFD 1,2,3, Df, Df+ has a shutter vibration issue and so do other focal plane shutters. Now 20k images i have shot and seen it once, I could give a **** to be honest . Just like any system there are problems and there are work arounds. Frankly Im a little sick of the Nikon folks stuffing this crap down our throats and honestly never shot the damn Sonys but made judgement calls on it. There I said it and with that I'm out of here. I had enough of this crap.
 
nostatic

nostatic

New member
Jack said:
Sony has reported vibration issues and light leaks, shooters say to ignore it, making images is what counts.

Leica has color casts on it's sensor and shooters say ignore it and go make images, it's easy to fix in post.

Nikon has a left AF sensor out of whack and shooters come out of there chairs complaining about how any responsible camera manufacturer could let such an egregious defect slip by them.

Just sayin, seems like a double-standard...

I personally agree with the just shoot em crowd, but still suspect my positioning it this way won't be popular here today :D
Click to expand...
If you go to most of the other discussion sites, Sony is getting hammered on it. The "ignore and shoot" crowd are in the minority. Leica has always gotten criticized, mostly due to price. Canikon gets beat up by the opposing fanbois fairly non-stop.

I don't see any double-standard. More like situation normal - some will take potshots from the keyboard and descend into theoretical nonsense while others will just take pictures and enjoy their hobby/work. You can pretty much just swap the brand names out - they all get both a free pass from the fans and an overzealous spanking from the critics simultaneously.
 
Jack

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
nostatic said:
You can pretty much just swap the brand names out - they all get both a free pass from the fans and an overzealous spanking from the critics simultaneously.
Click to expand...
Excellent -- this is EXACTLY what my point was.

I made it the way I made it, because I believe there are hiccups with EVERY system regardless of who makes it. It doesn't make any camera less attractive, but it's good to be aware of potential pitfalls. Example for me is the left AF point in Nikon D800 -- I only ever use the center point, so it was a non-issue for me; but for folks that shot people in vertical a lot, and rotated the cam left side up, it was a huge deal. Good to know about regardless. Sub point was the larger cam manufacturers have bigger targets on their backs, that's all.

When digital was young, a standard practice test was the 30 second dark frame to evaluate noise. Am I the only one that remembers that?

So yeah, any new camera is going to have a fault of some kind, and more importantly, with the raw numbers of users coupled with the flow of information on the net, we are going to find and hear about all of them.

That's really all my point was.
 
Guy Mancuso

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Not exactly how you said it but your explanation is a lot better. LOL

My comment maybe a little off the wall but this stuff gets so tiring to hear day in day out and all these systems are just short of a train wreck. Not much we as consumers can do but what I always have done was try to figure out the workarounds and I suggest that to all of us. Okay we know several folks found problems with the shutter vibration which is not uncommon as we have discussed but some people are way over the top(not hear but elsewhere to the point its a broken record and pretty lame i have to say). This is not how we approach photography is dwell on the problems but find solutions that work and I see more complaining than solutions. It gets annoying so pardon my comments . My ears are just full. LOL

I need to go buy another lens now. LOL

I did order the 24-70 and waiting for the brown truck now. Such a slut. I blame Tim and Jono for this one. I need someone to blame so either or both works for me. ROTFLMAO

I do give Tim credit though for really working the 24-70 and posting all of his findings here . That helped members including me and that has great. Thanks Tim


Pardon me today as Master Drake my big English Pointer is very sick. I have a bad feeling but going to the Vet tonight
 
Chuck Jones

Chuck Jones

Subscriber Member
Jack said:
Excellent -- this is EXACTLY what my point was.

I made it the way I made it, because I believe there are hiccups with EVERY system regardless of who makes it. It doesn't make any camera less attractive, but it's good to be aware of potential pitfalls. Example for me is the left AF point in Nikon D800 -- I only ever use the center point, so it was a non-issue for me; but for folks that shot people in vertical a lot, and rotated the cam left side up, it was a huge deal. Good to know about regardless. Sub point was the larger cam manufacturers have bigger targets on their backs, that's all.

When digital was young, a standard practice test was the 30 second dark frame to evaluate noise. Am I the only one that remembers that?

So yeah, any new camera is going to have a fault of some kind, and more importantly, with the raw numbers of users coupled with the flow of information on the net, we are going to find and hear about all of them.

That's really all my point was.
Click to expand...
I bet I have owned fifty camera bodies over my lifetime. Not one was perfect. Well, second thought, maybe my M6 was close to perfect, you didn't even need to have a battery for it to work.

If I live long enough, I am liable to own another fifty camera bodies. I highly doubt even one of those will be perfect. There is simply no such a thing. Just like one man's "feature" is another man's problem.

The old "lens cap on, fire a dark frame to look for noise" still applies. Sometimes on purpose, sometimes due to my forgetting to remove the damn lens cap, but always at least once with every new camera body :D

I think the issue today is the internet "megaphone effect." Every nit seems to get amplified to the point of a major issue. I see no problem reporting issues. People have a right to know, and that is what groups and forums are for, to inform, advise, share findings and present facts. But I couldn't agree more, how some of this stuff takes off is just wild.

A great example is the whole A7 light leak thing. I had a good laugh when I first read that, I thought it a joke. Then realized it was intended as a serious article. Too many years shooting view cameras for me, I guess. Some of my old large format bellows make that "light leak" absurd. My old Wista was so bad if you fired a strobe inside the bellows in a dark room, you could have an AstroLabe planetarium projection on the ceiling. That bellows had more light leaks than Bayer has aspirin.

Besides, light leaks are cool. Would anyone ever buy a Holga WITHOUT light leaks and lens womp? ;)
 
T

turtle

New member
If only my camera did not leak light, if only my lens were sharper, the bokeh better, the....

Sure, there are problems here and there (like the real issue with D600 shutters spraying oil over sensors, or A7R shutter vibration with long lenses for some people), but does this fashion for finding problems fit into the category of 'looking for excuses'? Maybe it just distracts people from the pressures of making good photos?
 
B

Ben Rubinstein

Active member
Just taking a time out while setting up and planning a bit Lord of the Rings stylesque type shoot for Tuesday. I need water frozen in movement in the image and am using a sound trigger on the flash to get that effect, camera shot in bulb. Not kidding, the shutter keeps triggering the sound trigger. Being a pro, instead of panicking I gaffered over the sound sensor and now the shutter isn't triggering it but the exploding balloon is. Did find it funny though that the shutter is setting off my sound trigger which usually takes a loud bang to fire :D
 
JoelM

JoelM

Well-known member
Well, I'm guessing that film cameras likely fail light tight testing at ISO 25,600 and for 30 seconds. I'm going down to the corner camera shop and pick up some Kodachrome 25,600 and I'll report my results tomorrow... or shortly after.

Joel
 
Guy Mancuso

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Lol

I am finding this light leak pretty funny myself. If there is a easy fix that takes a day than great. But 10 days in the shop than it ain't going to happen for me. I know one thing it will never affect me in the first place. If I'm in a dark room that needs ISO 6400 for 30 seconds than it better be sex related not camera. ROTFLMAO

Sorry it just had to be said.
 
V

vjbelle

Well-known member
So I tried the light leak test...... ISO 12500 for 30 seconds with my Lupine Flashlight (that can blind you) shining around the lens mount. Was there light leak???.... Yup!. Do I care... Nope!!... will never effect me. I tried to take an image with my 85mm Nikon lens at 100 ISO at 1/60 second tripod mounted with 2 second delay. Did I get a clear image.... Nope!! Do I care.... Yup!! One is very different than the other....YMMV!! I really do think that Sony should have advertised this as an image enhancement blur effect.

Victor
 
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