Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Okay line to see a 85 1.4 to round the Art series out. Someone had to say it. I'm actually trying to buy my Sigma 35 Art back.
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Thanks a lot Sony >:(
- Thread starter Rawfa
- Start date
mbroomfield
New member
Haha! Well I don't have a TV so I had to look that up ... thanks for the link! To be fair to SAR I think all the reports only listed SigCanikon. I'm not sure why.
I was tempted to order the Sony version now but I don't have any A lenses and the adapter is pricey for just 1 lens. I'm interested in it for astro .. I might get the Nikon and use adapters I have, but I'll wait for the reviews to come out I think.
As a Nikon shooter, I have a killer 85/1.4 in the G lens. What is really needed is a good AF converter for Nikon G to Sony EF. AF-S lenses focus very fast and I see no reason they wouldn't/shouldn't on the Sony with an appropriate adapter...
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Well the Sony 85 1.4 ZA is no slouch by any means at all. But like the rest of the Art series they make a lot of the OEM lenses take a back seat to them. A 85 ArT would most likely be in OTUS territory as designing long glass is far more easier to build very high quality to the wides.
I do agree a much nicer Nikon to Sony adapter needs to be made like the Metabones for Canon. Right now it's much smarter to buy Canon mount for Sonys because you get EXIF and more important in body aperture control. AF is slow but you get everything else
I do agree a much nicer Nikon to Sony adapter needs to be made like the Metabones for Canon. Right now it's much smarter to buy Canon mount for Sonys because you get EXIF and more important in body aperture control. AF is slow but you get everything else
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Also just for the record using Sony A glass via the LAE4 adapter AF is extremely fast and accurate. So in ART series most of us would buy the A mount. I have 2 A mount lenses now and 1 Canon mount lens in my TSE. Only native lens I have is the 16-35 which is very good.
Eoin
Member
You're like a broken record ... I can think of about 4 or 5 occasions in the past fortnight you've said that ... I'm trying to round out my primes and you're making me feel like I've taken the wrong path
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
This zoom is worthy of my repetition of praise. I just don't give it unless it's deserved. Personally I think it's the best 16-35 on the market. I never seen one handle the very wide this good.
My shots in the fun thread on the workshop with this lens are technically stunning.
My shots in the fun thread on the workshop with this lens are technically stunning.
Mike:
Don't worry I can never really get mad at SAR. It's too good a source for comedy. Have you ever read the comments? It's like a demolition derby. Besides sometimes accurate information shows up there.
But before I get anymore a-mount lenses (Sigma or otherwise) I will wait to see how the new FE-28 with 21mm adapter seems. I don't have high hopes for the adapter but 28mm is a good length for me. I'm also very interested in the FE 35 f1.4. I've seen some fairly interesting comments about it from the CP+ show and even though I like the FE 35 f2.8 I'm tempted..
Regards,
John
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Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
I'm more than tempted its either the new Zeiss 35 1.4 or get my dang Sigma 35 1.4 back.
I'm inclined to agree. I am currently post processing several images that include a chain railing. The iron links are enormous and are exposed to salt air, and thus have a thick coating of rust that have fascinating texture.
Using the 16-35 wide open at around 20mm, real close to the links, the level of sharpness and detail is astounding. Looking at it with a 27" Retina screen almost makes me dizzy. I've never seen anything like that outside of a macro lens.
thing is sony have been asleep at the wheel with A mount, if they raided the parts bin they could chuck out some bloody amazing cameras (a99s,R) a78 with no AA filter
all those with 5axis ibis
oh look ive just made D4s rival and d800e rival, and 7dm2 killer
but nope, lets have a another e mount body that isnt needed.
and lets not market a mount, and bury it on our own websites...
all those with 5axis ibis
oh look ive just made D4s rival and d800e rival, and 7dm2 killer
but nope, lets have a another e mount body that isnt needed.
and lets not market a mount, and bury it on our own websites...
Well, it's nice that one year after the introduction of the A7 it's now possible to seriously shoot landscapes wider than 35mm, albeit at f/4, and at nearly same cost as a body.
When you think of all the bizarre sony variant cameras, video and still, which sold few copies over the years, it's hard to figure the tight attitude to lenses. Every E apparently must also be video friendly.
The ISO performance of the A7"s" seems to preclude any fast zooms at all.
"Just use LAEA4" It does work fine but at that point I'd rather have a A99.
Oh well, Sony has shown everyone the real possibilities of EVIL FF, and implemented a decent series of MF aids to make other glass focusable, which is more than anyone else can claim.
I'm liking mine more than ever, now that I have a thinner CG and can use many small M wide lenses, including SEM 21
When you think of all the bizarre sony variant cameras, video and still, which sold few copies over the years, it's hard to figure the tight attitude to lenses. Every E apparently must also be video friendly.
The ISO performance of the A7"s" seems to preclude any fast zooms at all.
"Just use LAEA4" It does work fine but at that point I'd rather have a A99.
Oh well, Sony has shown everyone the real possibilities of EVIL FF, and implemented a decent series of MF aids to make other glass focusable, which is more than anyone else can claim.
I'm liking mine more than ever, now that I have a thinner CG and can use many small M wide lenses, including SEM 21
How is it so weird and confusing to first develop lenses that address the needs of the vast majority of intended users?
Having a fast, wide angle prime is needed by some, but still a small percentage of photographers. I bet a sizable portion of A7x users are satisfied with the kit lens, or at least the 24-70ZA. Why does everyone expect a massive assortment of obscure lenses one year after the camera was introduced?
Having a fast, wide angle prime is needed by some, but still a small percentage of photographers. I bet a sizable portion of A7x users are satisfied with the kit lens, or at least the 24-70ZA. Why does everyone expect a massive assortment of obscure lenses one year after the camera was introduced?
Most of this sort of discussion seems to always devolve to a camera war ... when the subject of this thread is actually optics.
So, the OP's point is a very valid one. IMHO ... Optics first and foremost!
I'm with Jack on all this. The FE mount lenses leave a lot to be desired IMO. The A7R I use serves as a convenient HR platform for a few favorite adapted lenses, while the slow aperture FE lenses are for AF convenience at best. Can't fault some of them technically, but to me they're better on paper and in forum discussions than in reality. IMO, were it not for the adaptability as a "back" for other optics (including the faster ZAs), the A7 series would have sputtered out quickly.
Nikon's DNA is optics. Most certainly so is Leica's. Same for Fuji's, as is Canon's. Sony's DNA is as an electronics company.
Up to now, Sony has produced the A7, A7-II, A7R, A7s mirror-less cameras ... four freaking FE mount cameras and a meager two slowish FE prime lenses in the same time period. That is electronics over photographic optics IMO.
The faster FE mount lenses coming are freakishly BIG ... which in my own experience on such a small body, is unbalanced and more fatiguing to use than a more balanced DSLR.
At first, I thought Sony/Zeiss DSLR would be a match made in heaven. It reminded me of Contax (Kyocera and Zeiss), but hopefully with a different outcome : -). So far that combo ain't working in the same manner that it did with Contax. Sony quickly abandoned the optical viewfinder for a electronic one as further evidence they are NOT an optically centric company.
At first they offered the A900 with an exceptional OVF (probably thanks to Minolta), and a very nice array of Zeiss AF optics ... some fast primes including the incomparable ZA-135/1.8. The three ZA and G f/2.8 zooms were every bit as good as the Canon/Nikon offerings, and in some ways better. (They never did bring out the staple ZA-35/1.4 which was quite disappointing).
The faster FE mount lenses coming are freakishly BIG ... which in my own experience on such a small body, is unbalanced and more fatiguing to use than a more balanced DSLR.
Sony are not selling many A99 SLTs because it is OLD and the only FF DSLR style camera they offer. Nikon/Canon is killing them there.
So, IF Sony A Mount FF loyal users have been abandoned, they will be sitting with a bunch of larger, faster ZA AF lenses they can only adapt to the the piss-ant A7 camera with an awkwardly clunky and fragile LA-EA-4 SLT adapter. A very undesirable Frankensteinish, Rube Goldberg contraption with Sony and Zeiss logos on it.
Thanks Sony:thumbdown:
- Marc
So, the OP's point is a very valid one. IMHO ... Optics first and foremost!
I'm with Jack on all this. The FE mount lenses leave a lot to be desired IMO. The A7R I use serves as a convenient HR platform for a few favorite adapted lenses, while the slow aperture FE lenses are for AF convenience at best. Can't fault some of them technically, but to me they're better on paper and in forum discussions than in reality. IMO, were it not for the adaptability as a "back" for other optics (including the faster ZAs), the A7 series would have sputtered out quickly.
Nikon's DNA is optics. Most certainly so is Leica's. Same for Fuji's, as is Canon's. Sony's DNA is as an electronics company.
Up to now, Sony has produced the A7, A7-II, A7R, A7s mirror-less cameras ... four freaking FE mount cameras and a meager two slowish FE prime lenses in the same time period. That is electronics over photographic optics IMO.
The faster FE mount lenses coming are freakishly BIG ... which in my own experience on such a small body, is unbalanced and more fatiguing to use than a more balanced DSLR.
At first, I thought Sony/Zeiss DSLR would be a match made in heaven. It reminded me of Contax (Kyocera and Zeiss), but hopefully with a different outcome : -). So far that combo ain't working in the same manner that it did with Contax. Sony quickly abandoned the optical viewfinder for a electronic one as further evidence they are NOT an optically centric company.
At first they offered the A900 with an exceptional OVF (probably thanks to Minolta), and a very nice array of Zeiss AF optics ... some fast primes including the incomparable ZA-135/1.8. The three ZA and G f/2.8 zooms were every bit as good as the Canon/Nikon offerings, and in some ways better. (They never did bring out the staple ZA-35/1.4 which was quite disappointing).
The faster FE mount lenses coming are freakishly BIG ... which in my own experience on such a small body, is unbalanced and more fatiguing to use than a more balanced DSLR.
Sony are not selling many A99 SLTs because it is OLD and the only FF DSLR style camera they offer. Nikon/Canon is killing them there.
So, IF Sony A Mount FF loyal users have been abandoned, they will be sitting with a bunch of larger, faster ZA AF lenses they can only adapt to the the piss-ant A7 camera with an awkwardly clunky and fragile LA-EA-4 SLT adapter. A very undesirable Frankensteinish, Rube Goldberg contraption with Sony and Zeiss logos on it.
Thanks Sony:thumbdown:
- Marc
Annna T
Active member
I can agree with what you say here, although coming from another background. I got an A7r because I was nostalgic of my Contax G2 film camera and a lover of mirrorless and EVF (I love my Olympus E-M5 ! ).
I'm surprised that there are still no small primes trilogy : I love the Sony Zeiss 55mm F1.8, but the announced 90mm macro is huge and a no no for me.
Remains to be seen how the 28mm F2 will perform, but I fear that it won't be as good as the 55mm. I'm still left wondering whether the register isn't too short to produce a small and distorsion less moderate wide angle prime opening at F2.8 but one that would be sharp from corner to corner. I'm expecting the first tests of the announced 28mm F2 with impatience.. It doesn't seem too big, but opening at F2 I fear some IQ compromise elsewhere may be in order.
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Well I have really no issues with size as even if they are the same as Nikon / canon lenses they are still serving a FF sensor there is no getting around that plus if the are 1.4 and more importantly which everyone seems to forget they are AF lenses which carry motors inside the lens. Now they may not feel so balanced on the A7r but if you like the new grip of the A7 II. Than they balance much better. Here is my bottom line even if they are exactly the same size I'm still working with a much smaller body at a cheaper cost and pulling the same IQ. On our workshop I carried a extra lens and a lee filter system in the same bag that I could not before shooting Nikon. I had 6 lenses everyday until I hurt my back than I took out the Canon 24 TSE one morning. If you want FE glass they have 3 very very good ones and several good ones but not stellar and don't fool yourself Nikon/ Canon have many just medicore glass too. But they do have outstanding ones as well but if you want a great kit the 16-35, 55 and 70-200 is a great kit but as soon as you want 1.4 glass your right smack back in DSLR size with AF glass! you just can't beat physics. The Loxia line is small but its manual focus and F2 . You also get a system that you can just about adapt anything to it. Leica users are just pissing and moaning because there cost savings over a 240 to a A7r just does not work on some of there wides. That's your problem don't blame Sony. I'm sick of reading about it. I'm really hating this God gift to the world attitude they should work because I want them too. Sony don't build for Leica glass and no one will.
I get to use some awesome glass from different companies that I never could before. When's the last time you used a Canon lens on a Nikon body, Leica body or something better than a canon body. Like never
I can do that now and if I had the money I would own a load more too.
I get to use some awesome glass from different companies that I never could before. When's the last time you used a Canon lens on a Nikon body, Leica body or something better than a canon body. Like never
I can do that now and if I had the money I would own a load more too.
V
Vivek
Guest
What an awesome pair of peptides that is! :thumbs:
Guy, I have, let's call it an intuition, that users will enjoy the FE 35/1.4 Distagon, with super fast SSM AF and what looks like a novel 12/8 design, unlike any CZ 'Distagons' (but really it is a brand name these days).
Nine blade aperture like the FE55, my guess is this is what the key design team have been beavering away at - the third and highest high end FE prime. How it goes against the ZM version and of course our other choices in Sigma, C/N/M/ZE will be excellent to see. It is the only one designed for Sony's forthcoming sensor tech and will have the most harmonious lens-body interaction. It has a very nice rings layout and design by the looks of it.
While waiting for the lens, here are the prices and weights of other contenders : Canon 35/1.4L: $1480 (580 grams); Nikon 35/1.4: $1800 (601 grams); Sigma ART 35/1.4: $900 (665 grams); Zeiss ZM 35/1.4: $2290 (380 grams); Zeiss ZE 35mm f1.4: $1843 (830 grams).
So the others are not giving away their product here. The FE price of 1300 Euros was floated a few weeks back. As Sony seldom price gouge, I am guessing $1300 in the US and 600 grams to carry, for a total 1070 grams on a7r/a7 and 1200 grams on a7II. Some people might even say: thanks a lot, Sony ;-)
Nine blade aperture like the FE55, my guess is this is what the key design team have been beavering away at - the third and highest high end FE prime. How it goes against the ZM version and of course our other choices in Sigma, C/N/M/ZE will be excellent to see. It is the only one designed for Sony's forthcoming sensor tech and will have the most harmonious lens-body interaction. It has a very nice rings layout and design by the looks of it.
While waiting for the lens, here are the prices and weights of other contenders : Canon 35/1.4L: $1480 (580 grams); Nikon 35/1.4: $1800 (601 grams); Sigma ART 35/1.4: $900 (665 grams); Zeiss ZM 35/1.4: $2290 (380 grams); Zeiss ZE 35mm f1.4: $1843 (830 grams).
So the others are not giving away their product here. The FE price of 1300 Euros was floated a few weeks back. As Sony seldom price gouge, I am guessing $1300 in the US and 600 grams to carry, for a total 1070 grams on a7r/a7 and 1200 grams on a7II. Some people might even say: thanks a lot, Sony ;-)
pegelli
Well-known member
I fully agree with Guy, you can't beat physics and good/bright FF lenses will always be big, no way around it. Philip's list shows that other brands are no different from that. Also I have used my ZA 135/1.8 with an LA-EA4 on my NEX6 and since with heavier lenses I always hold the lens rather than the camera I have no complaints about "unbalance" or anything. It's different from using it on an A850, but not better/worse. And if you don't like big and can handle MF then there's loads of options in unlimited variety of sizes, brightness and weight.
So I love all the options they provide with the different bodies and really see them as digital backs for anything you can throw at them. They might be an electronic company without too much optical heritage, but they provide a platform that opens too many options to choose from. So no complaints (nor piss and vinegar) from me.
So I love all the options they provide with the different bodies and really see them as digital backs for anything you can throw at them. They might be an electronic company without too much optical heritage, but they provide a platform that opens too many options to choose from. So no complaints (nor piss and vinegar) from me.
Guy Mancuso
Administrator, Instructor
Well said and the approach I view it as, its a digital back to bolt almost any lens that fits my fancy. We just can't do that in other brands. This is why I bought it or one good solid reason I did. I also wanted the focus peaking live view, zoom on the LCD and EVF. I never ever miss manual focus and with senior eyes it's a very important feature.
Really have to say after 25 workshops I have been on , I had zero complaints about my gear. It's always something or some nagging thing you have to workaround. I never felt any of that and actually for old fart pro really enjoyed shooting it and even better got some great images. Totally impressed by the 16-35 and even the Mitikon. Now most certainly I want the new body style of the A7II with a 50 mpx sensor and the better functions so when that comes I will be buying it, no question.
Really have to say after 25 workshops I have been on , I had zero complaints about my gear. It's always something or some nagging thing you have to workaround. I never felt any of that and actually for old fart pro really enjoyed shooting it and even better got some great images. Totally impressed by the 16-35 and even the Mitikon. Now most certainly I want the new body style of the A7II with a 50 mpx sensor and the better functions so when that comes I will be buying it, no question.