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I thought Sony had cured my Leica disease...

ohnri

New member
For me, I doubt any camera at that price point that fails to provide a good 4K video option will ever be tempting enough to buy.

I expect to pre-order the new A7Rii but if Samsung announces a pro quality wide lens soon I will pass. My NX1 has such good AF and will go 15 fps and is a better everyday camera for me.

The RX10 iv is an unexpected option though.

-Bill
 

Chris C

Member
......I feel the Q is Leica's future, but with interchangeable lenses. I think it would kill the M and should indeed be developed hard so that it does so.....

...... 'the Q hits the sweet spot, but most of us need to change lenses'.... the platform needs renewal IMHO and as EVFs improve, the optical finder and RF mechanism - what made the M stand out - will ultimately have to go........
Tom - I have used rangefinders for over 30 years and chose them for their scale and lens-design advantages; Plaubel Makina, Fuji 6x9, Mamiya7, digital M Leica. But I have always thought that rangefinder framing was the weakest part of these cameras; a post II World War solution in drastic need of improvement.

I think the Q is a wonderful camera deliberately handicapped with the But... But... But caveats you mention. But time will probably force Leica from it's protectionist strategies with the M camera and a non-rangefinder M-lens platform needs to be offered; I see that as being in Leica's, and 'our' interest. Possibly it could kill the M-rangefinder, maybe not. However not offering an M-lens alternative platform may well kill M rangefinders anyway.

For anyone with 'M-fit' lenses, the Q hints at what is possible if the protectionist shackles are taken off the current M-lens digital platform.

............. Chris
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
Tom - I have used rangefinders for over 30 years and chose them for their scale and lens-design advantages; Plaubel Makina, Fuji 6x9, Mamiya7, digital M Leica. But I have always thought that rangefinder framing was the weakest part of these cameras; a post II World War solution in drastic need of improvement.

I think the Q is a wonderful camera deliberately handicapped with the But... But... But caveats you mention. But time will probably force Leica from it's protectionist strategies with the M camera and a non-rangefinder M-lens platform needs to be offered; I see that as being in Leica's, and 'our' interest. Possibly it could kill the M-rangefinder, maybe not. However not offering an M-lens alternative platform may well kill M rangefinders anyway.

For anyone with 'M-fit' lenses, the Q hints at what is possible if the protectionist shackles are taken off the current M-lens digital platform.

............. Chris
That was my thinking as well and an interchangeable lens Q could have been a TRUE R solution, provide a FF AF solution, and could offer support for those with M lenses. I'd say that 2/3 of the people initially interested in the FE system did so exclusively for a reasonably priced backup for their M or for a "35mm digital back" for their abandoned platforms. Many came and left when they realized it was optimized for Sony lenses but SLR lenses worked excellently.

Leica completely missed the boat on that opportunity and alienated a lot of people invested in the R system - even if it was a good move to produce the S as well. I'm sure that many of those people that didn't sell their stock would have bought a body or two though the day of the announcement... if it provided a lens mount.
 

serhan

New member
I guess Leica didn't want to kill the M...

Here is unbaked raw image from Leica Q which can be seen in raw therapee (exif f/8):

 

turtle

New member
Hi Chris, I enjoy the RF framing system, but rarely shoot long lenses on any rangefinder due to the postage stamp frame lines issue (I can only enjoy 50mm on a 0.85 body). But seeing as I shoot 90% of my work with rangefinders at 35mm and wider, it has not been a real impediment. As silly as it may sound, when shooting my long term Afghanistan projects, I settled into carrying my Leica M ready to go (usually with 28 or 35mm attached) and a heavy Eos 1n with 85mm 1.2 L II set up in my Domke bag. I could not have shot the portraits in that series had I been trying to mess around with 75/90mm Leica M lens focusing!

I think we're all in agreement really: the Q shows what can be done and an interchangeable Q (which I have seen stated online by someone claiming to know, is in development and about 12-18 months behind the Q). I would also imagine that any snags with the Q will translate into improvements in the interchangeable model before release, resulting in a fairly well finished product. I wonder if Leica got a lot of help from Panasonic with the Q as this would explain why the electronic side of things seems to be impressing people. In the meantime, the Q will do nicely one suspects, as it deserves to.

If there isn't an interchangeable Q, I fear the M platform will run out of puff and Leica will be in trouble five years from now. I think they will need to take that leap of faith and figure out how to position the ongoing M platform in light of a Q.

Just one example of the problems with the M is that I thought to myself (as a MM1 owner) what would also owning a M240 or 246 entail? Then I thought how some of my gear needed significant adjustment when I got the MM1 and wondered what the chances were of everything being adjusted to work perfectly on both bodies... then thought how absurd it is that one has to even think about such things these days. I have no interest in back and forth with Leica and fiddling.

Lots of people said Sony was no threat to Leica because they are different customers, but I beg to differ. I am a customer of both and will always select the equipment that meets my needs best and could not care less about labels. My money has gone to Sony of late, because Leica has not innovated beyond the finicky and expensive M platform, which was far better suited to film than digital tolerances. I still want a M246 though. And the future new M!
 

Tim

Active member
I am quite a well experienced single lens camera user.
I've been using a GR, X100 and the Sigma Merrills for a few years.
For me one very important factor of a fixed lens camera is size.
If you are going to give up interchangeable lenses then I must have some size improvement.

Look at this line up to get and idea where the Leica sits. -
Compact Camera Meter

I suppose the IQ might be so stellar its worth it but over a M9 or M240 with 28?
I am warming to the camera but its price puts it in the not worth it for my images category.
Anyone know if the files are 12 or 14 bit or other?
 
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