Here we go again...

[Malina DZ]

I don't think I would ever go to Best Buy for anything none the less a higher newly released camera or lens.

Had I a better choice in my area, I'd go there. These are the only ones left: http://store.sony.com/-cms-page.sony.store.listing
BTW, Best Buy carried the first Sony DSLR before Sony opened their store in Aventura, FL (the last one to close in SoFla).

...as you call it, "Loser" targeted hardware.

I didn't direct that Ad I linked to to claim a credit for a "Loser" title.

 

[Jim DE]

You need to relocate closer to NYC or take a couple hour flight there then if you want that hands on experience with newly released Sony products.. NYC is loaded with those type opportunities including the only remaining Sony Store.... I would not buy a SD card from Best Buy .. But that is another story about another product. I don't go to WalMart either... To me they are two same like each.

 

[Malina DZ]

Hands on experience with the latest Sony products is not worth the price of permanent relocation to NYC even if Sony sponsored it.


:toocool:

 

[Jim DE]

You can do that right now off the Hamptons ... Wouldn't want to in Jan-Feb though.... They even have a best buy over in Riverhead, NY

 

[Cindy Flood]

I do understand that. But, when it's able to work, it makes things so much easier.

I never said it made the lens unusable. I use my 90mm in AF and MF, and when in MF that enlarged view is soooo nice. Ah well, upward and onward.

BTW jamato8, I've got 82 birthdays under my feet, and have been shooting for 72 of them. So, I do understand how limited we used to be. Those days are long gone!!

Thanks to you both for your input.

I just wanted to make sure that you knew that if you turn off the automatic zoom, you can still zoom in by assigning magnify to the C1 button. I added a chrome button to my C1 so that I could feel it easier. It is just a matter of press-press...and I don't have that zoom when I don't want it.

 

[uhoh7]

For those loving the A7r2, more power to you Why even read technical threads if you already know you love the thing without reservation?

But referring to those who look very close at multiple aspects and discuss as chowderheads? Yikes. I often pass on threads which don't interest me, but I refrain from judging those who are having the conversation.

Is this camera perfect? Is it really worth over 3 thousand dollars? We have just come from the first generation of A7x, which at first seemed a dream for lens lovers, but in reality only now do we even have good primes below 35mm, because the sensors are so quirky. There are plenty of Sony issues worth discussing. I say TYG for the chowder heads, because without them we would not likely have the kolari mod, which has brought my own A7 off the shelf.

I like to see everyone psyched and loving their new cameras, but I think some are awfully sensitive, even intolerant of the contrary opinions of others. Being faced with an opposite opinion or impression, in the real world, can often lead to more knowledge. No one ever learned anything being "right".

Why not just enjoy your camera, and let those who are trying to figure it out have their discussions. We all have different priorities anyway. I know the glass I like, and I am not amused by bodies which don't agree LOL. Others will just find the glass because they love the body. I may disagree, but I don't feel the need to insult them, just the opposite, I wish them well.

 

[dandrewk]

I have no issues with dissenting opinions, and even welcome alternate viewpoints. We see a lot of that here, and it's a very good thing.

However, we also see a lot of nonsense - fabrications, innuendo, false rumors, mountains made out of molehills, etc. We'll get one post from one forum being used as an absolute "source" for (mis)information. We'll see the SAME rumors about obscure labs China reaching negative conclusions, and this gets passed along until it's made out to be an accepted fact.

I don't know what needs are filled when somebody does this. I guess some folks are bored, or perhaps feel threatened when a new technology comes along. Some just want attention. The good thing - they are easy to spot. The threads are titled provocatively to assure a lively response (click bait). The posts are outlandish and often overtly insulting. Sadly, instead of being properly ignored, the bait is taken and flame wars ensue.

It's not peculiar to photography - just about every forum on every topic gets its share of trolls. The best and only advice - DON'T take the bait. Ignore them - they eventually go away.

 

[rjp85]

Ignore the noise, rent the camera, examine RAW files in your software of choice, work the files according to your particular workflow, and buy the camera that gives you the image quality you're looking for.

Don't let Lloyd Chambers give you nightmares with his ongoing complaints. LOL (Just kidding, I kind of enjoy his website for certain information, but man is he picky!)

 

[Vivek]

But referring to those who look very close at multiple aspects and discuss as chowderheads? Yikes.

That is Guy over the moon with his A7rII. I am one of those chowderheads. :ROTFL:

 

[Rawfa]

I have a long term love and hate relationship with Sony. I've had the NEX5, NEX5N, NEX6, NEX7, TWO A7, A5100, A6000 and the A7S...all of them always came very close but always left some key feature keeping it from REALLY making it. And to be honest I really think that is Sony's game. Why put it all on the table when you can slowly phase evolution and milk your customers until you've "finally got it"? I mean they could have implemented the A6000's AF on their FF cameras but that wouldn't have been profitable. They KNOW they could have implemented their A7S high iso capabilities and their video features on their A7 series but why if you could charge double. Sony has a strategy of always making the user choose and between features and it REALLY makes me angry because one way or the other you will have to leave out some important features....
Now, after keeping the customers waiting for years they FINALLY come up with a camera that FINALLY may gather all the features and bring peace and love to the consumer's hearts
BUT this camera just happens to cost us$3200...which is ok, because with all the incredible hype that Sony has been creating this MUST be the holy grail of cameras...after all it's us$1000 more expensive than it's main Canon and Nikon competitors....after all, look at all the blogs, footage, reviews, etc. Come on, guys...you're really telling me that i's NOT natural to be frustrated to pay us$3200 to find out the camera does not live up to the hype?? I think it's absolutely natural. In the US it's pretty easy to rent the newest gear and find out which is the right one for you, but rental is NOT a world wide culture and for many people in different countries either you buy the camera based on reviews, forums, blogs, tests, etc or you simply don't buy it. And let me tell you it's pretty darn frustrating to pay that kind of money to find out that a camera simply won't deliver what their competitors have been delivering for YEARS. Not that it matters for most, but since I've moved to Brazil this situation is even more aggravated as there are ridiculous import taxes here....The A7RII will probably cost a minimum of US$4500 here! Seriously, even when compared to the top DSLR today us$3200 is a heck of LOT of money! For that kind of money, you SHOULD expect the best and Sony SHOULD deliver it...anything else it's just plain disrespect for their clients by Sony.

P.S - I'm a HUGE Sony mirrorless fan and I really REALLY WANT Sony to succeed...but just show a little respect for your customers.

 

[fmueller]

Ignore the noise, rent the camera, examine RAW files in your software of choice, work the files according to your particular workflow, and buy the camera that gives you the image quality you're looking for.

Don't let Lloyd Chambers give you nightmares with his ongoing complaints. LOL (Just kidding, I kind of enjoy his website for certain information, but man is he picky!)

Sigh... Lloyd Chambers sells a high price subscription and if he didn't have something to criticize, "discriminating readers" would have nothing to read and no reason to send him bitcoins or whatever he prefers nowadays for payment.

 

[Vivek]

Rafa, Perfection can NEVER be achieved. You have to appreciate Sony for upgrading from a plastic mount to a metal mount and finally supplying a camera with a decent shutter.

I salute all the supporters of A7rII. I may buy one.

After my A7r and its spectacular price crash, I made a resolution that I will never ever buy a Sony camera at its debut and NEVER at its european Sony mafia price.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

I have no issues with dissenting opinions, and even welcome alternate viewpoints. We see a lot of that here, and it's a very good thing.

However, we also see a lot of nonsense - fabrications, innuendo, false rumors, mountains made out of molehills, etc. We'll get one post from one forum being used as an absolute "source" for (mis)information. We'll see the SAME rumors about obscure labs China reaching negative conclusions, and this gets passed along until it's made out to be an accepted fact.

I don't know what needs are filled when somebody does this. I guess some folks are bored, or perhaps feel threatened when a new technology comes along. Some just want attention. The good thing - they are easy to spot. The threads are titled provocatively to assure a lively response (click bait). The posts are outlandish and often overtly insulting. Sadly, instead of being properly ignored, the bait is taken and flame wars ensue.

It's not peculiar to photography - just about every forum on every topic gets its share of trolls. The best and only advice - DON'T take the bait. Ignore them - they eventually go away.

What he said. Lol

 

[Jim DE]

All excellent points and some quite honestly I did not really consider. Thank you.

I paid $2785.97 usd ( using the Sony online store offered discounts) for my a7rII which puts it in the same price I paid for my a99 when released. Yeah it is high but comparing the a99 to the a7rII for my specific needs and wants is is much better than my a99. I hate paying $2k-$3k for digital camera bodies but unfortunately it appears that because of us it is what the market will bare. Sad but true.....

I have no issues with real problems being discussed with people that have money in the game. In fact I learn from it and plan workarounds for real issues that may effect so aspect of my photography. What bothers me is those who have no skin in the game and go to absurd extremes to find anything they can wave a red flag about ( like that stained glass artifacts if you push the darks 5 stops ... REALLY?) or those users who due to not knowing better complain about issues that are in fact user issues that if they would of read the manual would not of happened.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

That is Guy over the moon with his A7rII. I am one of those chowderheads. :ROTFL:

No it's diffrent . I love a good debate and figuring out the workarounds. I'm annoyed by extremely bad info being passed around even by reviewers, bloggers and subscription based. This release brought out the worst of them and Sony is a big against the Giants target. I get that and I even get the trolls baiting everyone. What I don't get is the ongoing minor things that turn into monstrous problem and endless debate, wars and bad feelings. I'm excited about this cam but I'm not blind either and I know what I have in my hands. I'm a work to solutions type person not a bitch a moment. Heck if I had a bitch a moment personality. I would be all over a lot of OEMS. I move on with a lot of debate. I say my peace and turn the channel. As one of the owners here you learn a lot. Also bottom line for me is getting folks excited about photography. End of day that's all I really care about.

Btw I love the minor complaint thread. It's good to know and you learn from it. But really it's all about the people posting to these threads. GetDPI does not have the people that cause problems. That's a credit to you guys. I have not sent out a warning to anyone in maybe two years about being a jerk here. That's unbelievable .that does not exist anywhere else

 

[Zlatko Batistich]

I paid $2785.97 usd ( using the Sony online store offered discounts) ...

I guess this is almost a moot point as Sony is closing their online store in 12 days, but where are these discounts?

 

[Jim DE]

Don't know if it is still available but when I pre ordered in early July and used their Sony store USA phone number to order they offered 15% of the camera purchase price towards buying accessories. I got the vertical grip and two extra batteries with my 15% value. Because these were available at the time of pre order they sent these right away and charged my card full value. Then on the 5th when they shipped my a7rII they charged my card the $2785 which was the 15% off value subtracted from the MSRP.

Remember you had to use the USA Sony stores phone number to get that offer not just clicking buy on the site. Also they gave me free next day FedEx shipping as well which with the two shipments was $70 I saved there too.

I mentioned this sale back in July here and on some other sites and verified it through the manager of the Sony Pro Service department that I deal with. Once he verified it we both pre ordered that way

 

[dandrewk]

Rawfa - the A7rII is $1k over the competition?

A7rII - $3200
Canon 5ds - $3900
Nikon d810 - $3300 (current factory sale $3000)

 

[dandrewk]

This blog post encapsulates what we've been talking about:

http://www.canonwatch.com/off-brand...st-over-hyped-over-priced-camera-of-the-year/

I know we would expect this sort of thing from some Canon fanboys, but this author makes no attempt to do any real research. Notice the vague references to "authoritative" user forum posts as a given fact? Notice how the author apparently hasn't even held an A7rII in his hand, and yet proclaims the new Sony -isn't- a pro camera, but a consumer camera with pro features (meaning what???)... at "pro prices".

The only thing missing is the click bait. Oh wait, there's that too!

 

[uhoh7]

Well here is a review sans sugar coating by a guy who does love (and own) the camera but can still see clearly:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/izumiflowers/20325321840/

Basically shows why the chowder heads are talking so much, informed or not. Hands down the best review I have yet read. Utterly ruthless, but he's keeping the camera LOL And he explains it.