So, is it a keeper? (A7R II)

[Vivek]

Would anyone expect any FW update for the A7rII and if so what is expected?

That's the big one is if you came from the A7r than this is a huge upgrade for you because of all the little quirks are all fixed now plus we gained a lot of good features. Overall operationally it's a world of difference. Let's face facts we where beta testers on the A7r which is fine they followed it up with a solid upgrade. Now we got something useful in our hands.

Guy, Is the plastic mount changed from A7r to the R2?

 

[Guy Mancuso]

I'm expecting the lossy compression update. They did say they are working on it.

 

[Knorp]

Congratulations Bart!
This maybe of interest, especially the APO-R 280/4 shutter shock measurements on A7R and A7RII by Jim Kasson.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3885234

Thank you, Karl-Heinz ! And thanks for that link !

The grey curve is the a7RII with EFCS on. It looks pretty darned good.

Apparently, I operate in the default EFCS:ON mode ...

Kind regards.

 

[Knorp]

Would anyone expect any FW update for the A7rII and if so what is expected?

With already so many sticky A7R2 threads around: let's start another one for (near) future firmware enhancement requests ... :grin:

 

[Vivek]

With already so many sticky A7R2 threads around: let's start another one for (near) future firmware enhancement requests ... :grin:

I admit that it is kind of unusual to see the Sony forum lit up with stickies.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

This summarizes my impression of the camera. AF smokes the one in the older A7R or A6000 pretty much hands down (A7R II af murders A6000 as light levels start to fall). No "false positives", if the AF says lock, the image is in focus. With my A6000 I'm sometimes baffled why I get a significantly OOF shot regardless of camera locking. Even LA-EA3 + 70-400 SSM2 + Kenko Pro 300 1.4x TC focused ok (I think this should not even work at all) in rather dimly lit indoor light. TC goofs the IBIS though, due to camera not "seeing" the multiplied focal lengths.

Overall responsiveness is way better than in the sluggish old A7R. Shutter is awesome, sounds like silenced MP5 submachine gun in the movies. Shutter is fast too, no issues with TTL preflash and missing the moment/expression or getting slightly OOF shot due to ~0,3 sec shutter lag; had a a pile of that with A7R. AF-C with Eye-Af feels magic in decent light.

IBIS. What can I say, I get 1:1 vievable pixel sharp images with FE 55 at 1/4 shutter speed. And stabilized 12.5x magnification for manual focusing for Zeiss ZE APO 135/2 if just superb, even if it is just 3-Axis.

Did a huge amount of research beforehand so I knew what to expect and yet the camera has surprized me positively.

I love hearing about you doing your homework. How many times have I said that on this forum. Great stuff

 

[Guy Mancuso]

I admit that it is kind of unusual to see the Sony forum lit up with stickies.

Well part of that was me I admit but having those data threads on diffrent branded lenses will be very handy for folks.

 

[Jack]

* under perfect conditions and with good light you probably still get a better file from the D810, a tad less noise, better colour gradations, I suspect slightly better DR at low ISO.

Tim, I'd appreciate if you could elaborate more on this comment, specifically as re color gradations. IME, I have found that more pixels generally translates into smoother color and tonality, regardless of system. I am wondering if it is due to:

1) pixels being so small they are getting diffraction skew to their color or;

2) it has something to do with lens resolutions not being up to the pixel pitch itself, and thus color data is getting "blurred?"

On the second point, I am not specifically singling out Sony glass as I have serious doubts *most* (if not all) current lenses will have issues past the 40MP point, including my best and latest Nikon G lenses.

 

[Chris Giles]

At some point I'll do a proper overview on the A7rii but so far this is all the discussion about it has resulted in:

 

[biglouis]

As they are still in short supply in the UK and because I am off on holiday soon I'll leave purchasing the A7RII until September or October.

I'm in two minds about selling my A7S. The A7R will definitely go. Been a great camera but I am convinced about the ergonomics and IBIS alone to want to go up to the A7RII. But the A7S? Knowing that I have a camera that will really do high-iso, e.g. 10,000-20,000 is very powerful. I am perhaps reacting to having been tortured for several years with digital cameras that couldn't even get above iso800 (specifically my Leica M8) so I'm concerned about losing good high-iso capability.

Of course, if any of you can convince me the A7RII really will do good very high-iso then I'll consider selling the A7S as well. I don't like having cameras sitting on a shelf doing nothing.

Just my two cents.

LouisB

 

[Guy Mancuso]

So far I like it up to 6400. I have not run any real tests though YET

 

[jfirneno]

The camera is very responsive and the AF is so much better and accurate. I have a bunch to talk about here. I have tried every setting in AF and I got a ton of keepers.

Guy:
I'm very glad to hear the AF is behaving. Have you been able to test the equivalent of a runway shoot? I'm guessing that's a very important requirement for your cameras (and a pretty critical AF assignment).

 

[tashley]

Tim, I'd appreciate if you could elaborate more on this comment, specifically as re color gradations. IME, I have found that more pixels generally translates into smoother color and tonality, regardless of system. I am wondering if it is due to:

1) pixels being so small they are getting diffraction skew to their color or;

2) it has something to do with lens resolutions not being up to the pixel pitch itself, and thus color data is getting "blurred?"

On the second point, I am not specifically singling out Sony glass as I have serious doubts *most* (if not all) current lenses will have issues past the 40MP point, including my best and latest Nikon G lenses.

Hi Jack,

I'd find it very hard to know what the cause is, or even to quantify the issue beyond that it's what I see and that it is noticeable at a level *just* above angels on pinheads.

I eagerly await the more serious reviewers' opinions on it but I think it is a combination of...

* slightly less good noise performance when shot 'at best' (so D810 @ISO64 and A7RII @100)
* something to do with the compression
* some slight feeling that there's a pre-cooking of RAW going on

This morning I tried a sanity check of browsing through many, many D810 files and all my MkII files and overall the impression was sustained. There's something incredibly silky and real about a really great D810 file shot on really nice glass, and I have yet to see quite the same level of 'touch me I'm real' quality from the Sony.

I've tried C1 (default sharpening is too soft for me, though the files do look initially really nice until you sharpen them) as well as LR and lots of processing variations and maybe I just am not au fait with the files in post to the right degree yet but I can't quite get to where I'd like to be.

But let's assume (I hope wrongly) that I'm at the peak of what I can do to maximise file quality and that this is 'as good as it gets' - then I'd still keep the camera because on a 36" print, though I DO think I would just see the difference (orange peel in OOF transitions, slightly 'gritty' shadows) I'd have to look incredibly closely and I don't think that anyone who has ever bought a print from me would notice the difference.

I'm easily willing to trade that for IBIS and form factor and other benefits but as I said elsewhere, I'll keep the D810 for some work, because I'm a baby and I like a comfort blanket!

 

[Jack]

* some slight feeling that there's a pre-cooking of RAW going on

This morning I tried a sanity check of browsing through many, many D810 files and all my MkII files and overall the impression was sustained. There's something incredibly silky and real about a really great D810 file shot on really nice glass, and I have yet to see quite the same level of 'touch me I'm real' quality from the Sony.

Interesting. Could certainly be compression and relatively poor unpacking -- which hopefully could resolve itself with software updates? Your comment on "silky" D810 files is spot on -- I do love the files that cam produces, so much so I offed both my D800 and D800E as soon as I got the D810 precisely because of that. I am happy to await Nikon's offering in this sensor class as I am 100% comfortable with the size, VF, features and ergos of the full-size Nikon bodies. Thanks for your feedback!

 

[Guy Mancuso]

This is what has me jacked up . Is the higher ISO. I think the files are smoother because of the smaller pixels. Thats my theory and in MF that was the case also going to a smaller micron back. Same here

Shot this handheld with the Batis 85mm in CROP mode so what a 128mm

ISO 1000 1/500 at F3.5. Now my sharpening has gone up slightly in C1 over the A7r by 25 points . So this is 325/5/6 No clarity which i usually throw one but here is the key I could NEVER get this ISO like this on the A7r. There simply is no noise here. I have done nothing to this file at all except sharpening.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Here I gave it Guys special treatment
Clarity 12
Noise 54 standard is 50 on these three settings
Details 64
Color 58

Howard i shot this one with AFC continuous low and expanded flexible AF point

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Don't forget this is crop mode which is a 17mg raw file

 

[Guy Mancuso]

This kind of answer the question of the day with 2 outstanding lenses to go with it and the AF on them is lightning fast.

Batis 25

Batis 85

 

[Guy Mancuso]

See to me these look very smooth and do not look digital. Back to my sneaky comment the other day=filmlike

 

[hcubell]

Howard I would first start at APC with a low continuous shooting mode. You can try two settings that I think would work good with a single animal on the move. You can go focus area and use Wide which you have to get the AF point on the animal than just keep tracking them across the frame. In wide the downfall is if it don't start on the animal, so you may have to release and try again. The other setting is the expanded flexible spot which you can zero on the animals face and it will track them across the frame as well. Trick is nailing the animal on the start and keeping that half press on all the time . I have more faith in the low continuous than I do in the high mode. Native lenses obviously will be best. I think you where renting the 70-300 which sounds like a good lens for this .

Thanks, Guy. There are several choices for AF focus modes that may make sense. Wide, Zone, Expand Flexible Spot and Lock on AF Expand Flexible Spot. With Wide, do you do a half press on the main subject, and then let it follow the subject? Is this tracking AF, or do you have to use the Lock On AF Expand Flexible Spot?
I am renting the Sony A 70-400 Zoom with the adapter.