Free service in jeopardy?

[leicashot]

This is in response to Bob's response to my comment below, regarding all the talk on a certain member's 'FOR SALE' thread whereby members are objecting to extremely high asking prices on certain Leica products for sale.

- My question is how is this jeopardizing the 'free' service? Will charging for this service ensure that people don't voice their opinions about such topics? I am not condoning what members have been posting, but am puzzled by this comment, and wondering if it's an excuse to implement a charging system due to the current popularity of the SALE part of this forum.

Comments?


Quote:
Originally Posted by leicashot
why the mods have not intervened I don't know. I'm staying outta this one


because we do not look at every thread 24/7.
It is getting really old especially concerning Leica sales.
This behavior in general may be jeopardizing this free service.
-bob

 

[Bob]

7 day ban issued for questioning the action of a moderator.
who is next?
thanks
-bob

 

[richard.L]

you don't have to ban me.... bye ..

 

[Bob]

So that folks understand me.
This is a volunteer effort.
If it gets to be too much work moderating the buy and sell forum we will just shut it down.
If there are other way than that to keep it civil we may explore them too.
thanks for your kind understanding.
oke:
-bob

 

[Double Negative]

Then don't waste your time on the classifieds here.

La Vida Leica has a classifieds section too; the difference being the lack of price gouging as seen here.

 

[GroovyGeek]

Many forums have explicit "no price policing" rules. It is not the moderator's job to police the FS forum, nor should members take it upon themselves to be vigilantes for the benefit of all. If someone is asking a ridiculous price just let it be. Buyers need to do their own homework. The only time mods should intervene is if there is a) uncivil behavior or b) potential scam going on. One useful thing NikonCafe has done is shut off replies in the FS forum. This eliminates the spurious traffic such as "great lens free bump" or discussions on the merits of the hardware that do not belong on this board.

 

[stephengilbert]

I understand the rules (I think) and try to abide by them. But I don't understand the notion that there's something wrong (as opposed to against the rules) with saying that a price seems high, or that the item is available new for less than is asked. If I have a friend who's looking for a lens, I'd certainly warn him or her that a seller is asking too much or that the lens is available for less elsewhere. Yet there are people who think it's wrong to do the same thing on an internet forum, some of whose readers I consider to be friends.

I understand that the mods can't be expected to deal with this sort of issue, but don't understand the view of many members that we should view the internet as a jungle, and shouldn't offer advise or protect people who might otherwise be taken advantage of.

 

[stephengilbert]

And another thing: I agree that the "great price" bumps are problematic. If I can't say "stupid price," the seller's friends or others who may have an axe to grind shouldn't be telling everyone "what a great deal."

 

[Double Negative]

And another thing: I agree that the "great price" bumps are problematic. If I can't say "stupid price," the seller's friends or others who may have an axe to grind shouldn't be telling everyone "what a great deal."

Agreed. But this is symptomatic of the "ol' boys club" here.

Popular member A posts a FS thread. Members B, C and D jump in to say, "what a great guy, his gear is pristine."

It's one thing to let potential buyers know that the OP isn't just someone out of the blue with no history posting stuff for sale (i.e. they know them on another forum). But to "pump up" the ad, perhaps to boost a friend's sale or to make a price seem more "reasonable" is wrong. Especially with more senior members, that have an established record here as opposed to 1-post n00bs.

GetDPI is the most expensive place on the Internet for used Leica gear, bar none (except for maybe a few infamous 'bay sellers). I know what stuff is worth, and some of these asking prices are lunacy. And when I see someone post and repost a FS thread, jacking up the price $2k in the process, I call bullsh!t.

 

[David K]

If there are other way than that to keep it civil we may explore them too.
thanks for your kind understanding.
oke:
-bob

No sales above retail...at least here on DPI. Not questioning a seller's right to sell for what the market will bear...just where he does it. Jack and Guy (and the mods) have put a lot of effort into giving this forum a "family spirit" (for lack of a better description). And some of these sales are inconsistent with that spirit. Just my opinion...that nobody asked for

 

[Bob]

Retail where and in what currency and when? With or without local taxes and shipping?
For gear that is in demand a higher price may actually be justified. Collector stuff is another problem and some of Leica's stuff IS collector stuff right out of the chute.
It is a problem for me, frankly, as a moderator.
We operate on a set of rules and also try to add a bit of "do what is right" but that is real tough call sometimes.
-bob

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Agree. Jack and I are both on vacation and will have a sit down together on this stuff going forward but it's apparent all this comes from Leica sales and some of this stuff is getting out of hand. My advice stay out of the sales of these items if your not interested in buying them . Why get your dander up for no reason and honestly it's getting on everyone's nerves no matter which side of the fence you think about all of this. It keeps up I will shut it down in a heart beat until we come up with a better solution and this very well may turn into a pay solution for B&S which really goes against the spirit of this forum and our desire to have this section of the forum because this stuff eventually pours directly into the threads and posts in other parts of the site. This is what we don't want and my main reason to act accordingly and our mods. actions in these areas. There is much more than meets the eye in all of this and is not just sitting on the B&s area but affecting the site.

As part owner of this site trust me this will come to a final solution that is best for this site.

 

[Terry]

And another thing: I agree that the "great price" bumps are problematic. If I can't say "stupid price," the seller's friends or others who may have an axe to grind shouldn't be telling everyone "what a great deal."

I've been deleting those great price posts when I see them.

 

[patashnik]

Disable replies altogether.

 

[Terry]

Disable replies altogether.

A lot of good questions get asked that help all of the users on the buy sell forum. You can learn a lot.

Look there really aren't big problems right now except on Leica gear where clearly there is a demand/supply imbalance. The buy/sell forum has worked fine for several years now until more recently when the prices of the lenses has skyrocketed.

 

[Bob]

Perhaps we ought to ask folks who want to sell "new only tested" gear in the commercial vendor forum.
-bob

p.s.
just so you know, this is a real pita for moderators too.
Some folks follow the rules,
Some folks don't and get carded
Some folks don't give up and get banned

 

[glenerrolrd]

This isn t a moderator issue. Members should be discouraged from posting in a seller offer...unless they are asking the seller for details.

No comments about price ,the item or the seller should be made in the seller post. No observations whatsoever.

Members should be able to list at any price under any terms they want.

Posts that take on a life of there own should just be deleted.

That makes it pretty easy And puts the work back on the original poster.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Roger the last part is essential that the seller has control of their sale and more important their thread . It gets out of hand than they should REPORT it we will lock or delete it than repost it in a new thread. Bottom line take control of your sale. Also if your not buying than please folks leave your comments at the door. This is NOT the forum and I said this before it is classified ads and any discussion on a item outside of info on the item itself for purchase reasons than take it into the forum threads. There really should be minimal posts on the B&S area. It is a classified ad and should be strictly treated as such. Folks also need to understand no one is above the rules here either including myself. There here for a reason and if you get a note from me or the mods. There IS a reason for it and trust me no one is above being banned or any other disciplinary action, trust me none of us on the other side here want to play the bad guy but we will when you push it beyond what is best for this forum. We really are very nice people on this side of the fence but be warned you break the rules we follow through.

 

[Guy Mancuso]

I'm going back to vacation mode but truthfully I am very disturbed that this forum is being used for price gouging of Leica items and worse we are being recognized as the most expensive among other forums. Fair warning all eyes are on this now.

 

[Terry]

I'm going back to vacation mode but truthfully I am very disturbed that this forum is being used for price gouging of Leica items and worse we are being recognized as the most expensive among other forums. Fair warning all eyes are on this now.

You know what, if someone is going to buy a lens costing more than $5K and doesn't do their homework to understand pricing and understanding supply demand perhaps that is their own problem.

In addition, nobody knows what the final selling prices of these lenses turns out to be. Asking price is one thing. The negotiation that happens through PM's is not public. So, we really don't know what prices are actually being paid for these lenses.

Finally, the best way to reform the sellers trying to make a "stupid" amount of profit is to ignore them. They will either drop the price or go elsewhere.