Any tips for deciding the moment?

[Vivek]

How so, K-H? You asked about the "other subjects".

One thing I found out (and I submit to the folks out here. May be this is 101 newbie stuff) is that most people have less aversion to a camera pointed at them than myself.

 

[Jorgen Udvang]

It all depends on which story you think you want to tell. The phrase "Decisive Moment" has little value unless it's placed in a context. HCB's own descriptions of how he worked is a good start. Access to time, preferably a lot of it, helps also. Until a couple of years ago, before I had a day job, I could spend hours at the same location, trying to blend in, trying to figure out what the story was, trying to prepare for the shot. Then, suddenly, within a fraction of a second, the story changes and the decisive moment arrives. A second later, it's gone. But if you're prepared and relaxed and realise how unimportant you are in the grand scheme of things, you'll be able to capture it, but only then.

GH1 with OM Zuiko 100mm f/2.8

I honestly think that catching the decisive moment is easier when using film. There's nothing more efficient than knowing that I have limited resources to sharpen my senses and improving my patience.

 

[Don Libby]

Shoot like you only have 3-frames left. Make them count...

 

[jonoslack]

But there are other subjects out there whose reaction time is much much faster than those of humans. What to do then?

Well, anticipate is the answer, and practice, and trust your reactions (I'm not saying I'm good at this, but I know when I'm in the 'zone' and I don't think it's very compatable with conscious thought).

 

[fotografz]

Machine gun or Sniper?

I would say that might depend on what you are shooting, either one could be the winner.
But of course weeding out lots of shots can be a chore, hopefully to be avoided.

I suppose hosing off shots from a distance could work in some situations ... but if working closer in, wouldn't a camera rattling off 10FPS tip-off the subject before the "Decisive Moment" even happened?

Usually, "Decisive Moment" type work is associated with photojournalism depicting some singular revealing human condition ... often of an unaware subject, or at least unaware before the photo was taken.

- Marc

 

[fotografz]

Well, I understand it completely, but only rarely can I manage it. But I'm willing to put my neck on the line here:

Here's two examples (mundane I realise) which constitute the decisive moment - neither lasted more than a second. . . the only contribution the camera had was in failing to stop me taking the picture.

The Dealer and her Dog

Man's best friend​

incidentally, I don't feel that dogs are compulsory in 'decisive moment' shots

and like Marc, I think anticipation is much more accurate than 10fps (but you do have to practice) Definitely sniper rather than machine gunner (isn't that what video is about)

:thumbs:

- Marc

 

[fotografz]

It all depends on which story you think you want to tell. The phrase "Decisive Moment" has little value unless it's placed in a context. HCB's own descriptions of how he worked is a good start. Access to time, preferably a lot of it, helps also. Until a couple of years ago, before I had a day job, I could spend hours at the same location, trying to blend in, trying to figure out what the story was, trying to prepare for the shot. Then, suddenly, within a fraction of a second, the story changes and the decisive moment arrives. A second later, it's gone. But if you're prepared and relaxed and realise how unimportant you are in the grand scheme of things, you'll be able to capture it, but only then.

GH1 with OM Zuiko 100mm f/2.8

I honestly think that catching the decisive moment is easier when using film. There's nothing more efficient than knowing that I have limited resources to sharpen my senses and improving my patience.

I agree with the film observation. In the beginning of photography it sort of forced the discipline because the promiscuous still camera didn't even exist yet.

We have to remember that the whole "Decisive Moment" notion came into being when even film was young, and high frame rates were the domain of movie cameras.

The power of still photography remains the capturing of a milli-second slice of life that other wise may have not even been "seen". I think our stream of conscience mind operates more like a movie camera than a still camera ... which is what makes snatching 1/500 slice of it so magical and intriguing.

- Marc

 

[Vivek]

Lets leave out nano, femto and such prefixes, if we can as all we discussing are milli second moments. Also about the gear choices.

Jorgen, What a lovely example! :thumbs:

 

[fotografz]

begs the question of what is defining the "decisive moment." is it the moment itself, so why not just bang away and sort though the images, or is it the photographer, deciding to press the shutter

The camera doesn't recognize irony, despair, humor, or any other human condition. It isn't a designer or artist. At best, it facilitates the logic and aesthetics of the photographer, and does their bidding in a subordinate manner.

Which is why, IMO, the rangefinder still reigns supreme for this type of work. It offers up the least intrusion between you and the subject ... other than framing, even the visual effect of focal length is absent ... leaving what the subject is doing as the primary focus of the photographer.

Not that "Decisive Moment" work can't be done with any camera since it isn't the camera deciding when to shoot. It just seems easier, or more natural when using a rangefinder with less visual distractions. But, to each their own.

- Marc

 

[fotografz]

Lets leave out nano, femto and such prefixes, if we can as all we discussing are milli second moments. Also about the gear choices.

Jorgen, What a lovely example! :thumbs:

"Milli" it is ...

Not sure about the last request. Do you wish to include gear choices or leave them out?

I mentioned my gear preference for this sort of work before I read this post.

- Marc

 

[Vivek]

Of course, your first post here mentions Doisneau.

 

[Jorgen Udvang]

Thanks, Vivek. When it comes to this kind of photography, most cameras can be used. There are however certain criteria, some of them purely psychological:

- No shutter lag. Interestingly, I never liked to use the D300 for this kind of photography, not because it has much shutter lag, but because the shutter release feels kind of "elastic".
- Manual focus (pre-focused) or extremely fast AF. My favourite for the latter is the Panasonic GH3/Zuiko 75mm. Very hard to beat for single shot focus. Still, I prefer manual.
- I prefer focal lengths between 85 and 150mm, because "it gives me more time". It doesn't, of course, but having a bit of distance to the subject makes it easier to spot people etc. that might enter the scene and interact within the next few seconds and I see some of what the subject(s) see. It gives better control.
- Although I mostly prefer to be seen before I take the photo, I don't like cameras that are noisy. The noise does attract attention, and if a second shot is needed, it often spoils the moment, even though the subject(s) know that their photo has been taken in beforehand.
- Clothing. Dress as neutrally as possible, not the same as the locals (if in a foreign culture) but in harmony with them. You are noticed but don't stick out like a sore thumb. Most of my travel clothing is khaki or different shades of grayish green. Head wear, I mostly buy locally.
- I mostly carry my camera in the open when I arrive, during my stay and when I leave. the size of the camera is unimportant, as long as people have time to getting used to it. I've done village photography with the GX680, and after a few hours, nobody noticed.

I agree with Marc that rangefinders are probably ideal for this kind of work, but since I've never owned one (they tend to be expensive), I've used what I have and come to the conclusion that it's about me and my relationship with the surroundings, not about the camera. Mostly.

 

[fotografz]

Well, anticipate is the answer, and practice, and trust your reactions (I'm not saying I'm good at this, but I know when I'm in the 'zone' and I don't think it's very compatable with conscious thought).

Jono, your last sentence is key thought IMO.

I've always believed that heightened sensitivity and intuitions played a huge role in doing this sort of photography. It was more apparently so when using a film camera since you didn't really know what you actually got until inspecting the contact sheets later and the real still image magic revealed itself.

- Marc

 

[Vivek]

I agree with Marc that rangefinders are probably ideal for this kind of work, but since I've never owned one (they tend to be expensive), I've used what I have and come to the conclusion that it's about me and my relationship with the surroundings, not about the camera. Mostly.

[That alludes to my cursory saying that- if all else fails, I can blame it on my gear.

I have known a great many dudes sporting expensive shiny gear who don't even know what they are carrying since it is all wrapped up in designer cases.

Sorry for that digression. Let us take that TLR from the bygone era to be non contentious. No lag, no noise and no RF. ]

Wonderful image, Jorgen.

 

[Jorgen Udvang]

Jono, your last sentence is key thought IMO.

I've always believed that heightened sensitivity and intuitions played a huge role in doing this sort of photography. It was more apparently so when using a film camera since you didn't really know what you actually got until inspecting the contact sheets later and the real still image magic revealed itself.

- Marc

I can relate to this very strongly. The feeling of wellbeing while exploring a location and its people gives me a shot of "Photonalin" directly into the centre of the brain. It's the strongest drug there is, 100% virtual and highly addictive. Luckily, there's no known cure against the addiction, but the addiction in itself reduces GAS to near zero while the addict is on a high

 

[Steen]

Any tips for deciding the moment ?


First of all I think an aptitude to see a telling situation when it suddenly arises, is a prerequisite.
Some people seem to have a particularly good eye for that.

From there the trick is either to draw and shoot quicker than a frog can eat a fly, or to be able to anticipate the situation.

(I have already shown these few examples elsewhere on the forum).

​

.

 

[Vivek]

If I may, I think, I was more in to asking about deciding the moment rather than how to capture it.

 

[segedi]

Sounds a bit scary, but not that far-fetched eh?

Hmmm....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zw-JFzMb6r0

 

[gandolfi]

If I may, I think, I was more in to asking about deciding the moment rather than how to capture it.

Zen and the Art of When.

You don't decide the moment,
The moment decides you.

 

[bradhusick]

Black Mirror - The Entire History of You

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sw3GIR70HAY