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Thread: Shift adapter

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    Shift adapter

    Has anyone tried this shift adapter?

    http://www.fotodiox.com/catalog/prod...roducts_id=435

    I know a tilt adapter was discussed on here last month but this is a shift adapter. So now there is a shift and a tilt adapter available for m43 cameras would there be any benefit in these function being built into a single adapter?

    Cheers

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    Re: Shift adapter

    Definitely it would be nice to have shift and tilt in one adapter.

    I am unaware of any for the m4/3rds at the moment.

    The fotodiox adapter you linked is very pretty and looks like a nice design!

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    Senior Member pellicle's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    definately both in the one would be good. My own style means that as I tend wider I make use of shift more than tilt, and as I tend more tele I use more tilt than shift

    if I was using something like a 20mm lens I'd use both to effect

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    Subscriber Member Jonathon Delacour's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    Quote Originally Posted by kainekainekaine View Post
    Has anyone tried this shift adapter?

    http://www.fotodiox.com/catalog/prod...roducts_id=435

    I know a tilt adapter was discussed on here last month but this is a shift adapter. So now there is a shift and a tilt adapter available for m43 cameras would there be any benefit in these function being built into a single adapter?

    Cheers
    I picked mine up from the post office today but, apart from making a couple of quick shots, I haven't had a chance to play with it properly. It's an Minolta MD mount adapter (rather than the Canon FD model you linked to) but -- apart from the different mount -- it looks identical to the FD adapter and is well made. My only disappointment is that it shifts horizontally but not vertically and there's no way to rotate the adapter as there is with the Canon and Nikon T/S lenses.

    That's not a huge problem, though, because I intend to use it with a Rokkor 35/2.8 Shift lens which has both vertical and horizontal shift and -- relative to the m4/3 frame -- a huge image circle.

    For what it's worth, I found the Fotodiox people very helpful and easy to deal with. Though if a combined tilt/shift adapter became available for m4/3 in MD mount, I'd find it difficult to resist.

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    Re: Shift adapter

    Jonathon, Can't you unscrew the mount (rear or front) and reorient the shift direction?

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    Subscriber Member Jonathon Delacour's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Jonathon, Can't you unscrew the mount (rear or front) and reorient the shift direction?
    Vivek, I owe both you and kainekainekaine a steak dinner! I'd started a reply in which I thanked you for the suggestion, noting that the front of the adapter mount (where the lens attaches) has four screws at 90 degree angles making it feasible to unscrew the mount and rotate it 90 degrees to get vertical shift.

    But I looked again at the images on the Fotodiox site (to which kainekainekaine linked and that I'd completely ignored) and immediately tried rotating the adapter while it was mounted on the G1. And guess what!? It rotates in 45 degree increments:



    I can't believe I didn't try this before writing my original post -- particularly since it's an MD-mount adapter in the photos. Thanks guys!

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    Re: Shift adapter

    Awesome, Jonathan! Thanks for the info!

    I would like to see Nikon and M42 mounts. I only have one MD mount lens (I think!).

    Show some pics using that adapter when you get to it!

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    Senior Member pellicle's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    interesting ... I had of course been considering this with that 8mm fisheye ... where shift would be real nice.

    wonder how the optical quality goes with that as the angle changes off the perpendicular?

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    Re: Shift adapter

    Quote Originally Posted by pellicle View Post
    wonder how the optical quality goes with that as the angle changes off the perpendicular?
    Well, I'll soon find out! The Rokkor 35/2.8 Shift lens certainly delivers the goods on the G1, though my stitching technique could use some improvement -- hopefully that will come with practice.

    I could be wrong but it seemed to me that, even with the Fotodiox shift adapter, I'm still just moving the relatively small m4/3 sensor around within the limits of the Rokkor 35mm Shift image circle. Although, as we have all learned, digital sensors behave very differently to film. In any case, if the Fotodiox shift adapter doesn't play nicely with the 35mm Shift lens, I can use it with one or more of my other Rokkors.

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    Senior Member pellicle's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathon Delacour View Post
    Well, I'll soon find out! The Rokkor 35/2.8 Shift lens certainly delivers the goods on the G1, though my stitching technique could use some improvement -- hopefully that will come with practice.

    In any case, if the Fotodiox shift adapter doesn't play nicely with the 35mm Shift lens, I can use it with one or more of my other Rokkors.
    firstly I'm a bit confused as to why you bought a shift adaptor for a lens which already has a shift mechanism.

    As to "technique" there is not much to learn really. Keep the camera squared up and shift instead of re-angling your camera (you know, like looking that way with the camera). Alternatively combine shift and camera angle to exaggerate perspective (rather than nullify it).

    The wider angle the lens is, the more noticeable shift is as an effect. With a 35mm I reckon you'll hardly notice anything. Even on a full frame camera 35mm was never a popular focal length to employ shift with.

    I guess that's why the 70's declared them a flop I reckon as the "widest" shift lens was about 28mm and it wasn't till Canon came along with their 24mm shift lens that (people who used them) shift lenses in 35mm format were popular (IMHO)

    what's your widest rokkor?

    one of these would be fantastic

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    Re: Shift adapter

    This guys blog contains more info about the adapter http://www.ayton.id.au/wp02/?p=2771

    he says tilt and shift lens combined will become available later in 2010.

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    Senior Member pellicle's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    Quote Originally Posted by kainekainekaine View Post
    he says tilt and shift lens combined will become available later in 2010.
    oh ... baby! I'm there

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    Subscriber Member Jonathon Delacour's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    Quote Originally Posted by pellicle View Post
    firstly I'm a bit confused as to why you bought a shift adaptor for a lens which already has a shift mechanism.
    I didn't buy the shift adapter specifically for the 35mm shift lens -- I'll use it with other lenses but thought it would be interesting to try a "double shift" (so to speak) with the 35mm shift.

    As to "technique" there is not much to learn really. Keep the camera squared up and shift instead of re-angling your camera (you know, like looking that way with the camera). Alternatively combine shift and camera angle to exaggerate perspective (rather than nullify it).
    Regarding technique, I was thinking more of doing the stitching. I've tried Photoshop (OK) and Hugin (trickier to use) and have just downloaded a trial version of PTGui to see if I think it's worth paying for.

    The wider angle the lens is, the more noticeable shift is as an effect. With a 35mm I reckon you'll hardly notice anything. Even on a full frame camera 35mm was never a popular focal length to employ shift with.
    Even with the 35mm it's definitely noticable -- three frames roughly double the horizontal angle of view of a single frame.

    I guess that's why the 70's declared them a flop I reckon as the "widest" shift lens was about 28mm and it wasn't till Canon came along with their 24mm shift lens that (people who used them) shift lenses in 35mm format were popular (IMHO)
    Well, I guess my mileage varied. I got great use from Nikon 28mm and 35mm shift lenses shooting interiors for a project in the early 80's.

    what's your widest rokkor?
    20/2.8. I'm not really a wide angle fan -- 28mm on a full-frame (35mm) sensor is ultra-wide for me. 20mm, 40mm, and 60mm on m4/3 are like wide, normal, and tele lenses for the way I shoot. (So an 85mm lens on m4/3 is really long for me.) I've thought about getting either a 16mm or a 17mm Rokkor but for ultra-wide I think the upcoming Panasonic 14/2.8 would be a better choice.

    one of these would be fantastic
    No way, Josť! That's just abnormal!

    oh ... baby! I'm there
    You and me both!

  14. #14
    Senior Member pellicle's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    Hi

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathon Delacour View Post
    Regarding technique, I was thinking more of doing the stitching. I've tried Photoshop (OK) and Hugin (trickier to use) and have just downloaded a trial version of PTGui to see if I think it's worth paying for.
    I use PTGui, its simply fantastic, this for instance is 3 portrait orientations stitched



    since its also HDRI it was from 12 exposures ... its HUGE in full size. It is also flawed, because I just rotated the camera on the tripod. Normally this works well, but not always, and as I don't have a shift lens right now ...

    I suggest you try to mount the lens on the tripod and apply shift to the body this way you are 100% sure that perspective does not change.

    the poor mans (and I'm not wealthy) way around this is mount the camera on a macro rail ($29) and wen you shift the lens, re-shift the camera to place the lens back where it was. If you do anything close up or have something like that pole in the image foreground you won't have funny converging lines like I got with those pews in the lower section of the image

    Even with the 35mm it's definitely noticable -- three frames roughly double the horizontal angle of view of a single frame.
    if you think about this all one can say is QED, however it is not the reason that shift lenses were made. You are employing it for stitching, which is essentially making your lens cover a larger sensor (using post processing not having a larger sensor). The perspective correction advantages of a 35mm lens (even on a "full frame") are minor and can easily be fixed in printing (tilting the enlarger) or in photoshop with invisible losses.

    Heck I even corrected this one in PS



    taken with my 9mm. It looked severe before I corrected it and even pixel peeping it its hard to see what's been lost by the algorithm.
    have fun with that :-)
    Last edited by pellicle; 13th February 2010 at 22:02.

  15. #15
    Subscriber Member Jonathon Delacour's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    Quote Originally Posted by pellicle View Post
    I use PTGui, its simply fantastic, this for instance is 3 portrait orientations stitched



    since its also HDRI it was from 12 exposures ... its HUGE in full size. It is also flawed, because I just rotated the camera on the tripod. Normally this works well, but not always, and as I don't have a shift lens right now ...
    Great to hear your endorsement for PTGui. Given the above image was HDRI, am I correct in assuming that you are using PTGui Pro? I was intending to get the Standard version then, if I decided I needed the HDR support, to upgrade to the Pro version. Doing it in two steps like this would cost EUR 9.00 more than buying the Pro version. But now I see that the Pro version also offers viewpoint, vignetting, exposure and WB correction plus tone mapping.

    I suggest you try to mount the lens on the tripod and apply shift to the body this way you are 100% sure that perspective does not change.

    the poor mans (and I'm not wealthy) way around this is mount the camera on a macro rail ($29) and wen you shift the lens, re-shift the camera to place the lens back where it was. If you do anything close up or have something like that pole in the image foreground you won't have funny converging lines like I got with those pews in the lower section of the image
    Ahah! Is that why the Fotodiox adapter has the tripod bush?

    if you think about this all one can say is QED, however it is not the reason that shift lenses were made. You are employing it for stitching, which is essentially making your lens cover a larger sensor (using post processing not having a larger sensor). The perspective correction advantages of a 35mm lens (even on a "full frame") are minor and can easily be fixed in printing (tilting the enlarger) or in photoshop with invisible losses.
    Understood!

  16. #16
    Senior Member pellicle's Avatar
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    Re: Shift adapter

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathon Delacour View Post
    Great to hear your endorsement for PTGui. Given the above image was HDRI, am I correct in assuming that you are using PTGui Pro?
    actually I'm not, I didn't think it supports HDRI properly (seems to work only in 16 bit not 32bit floating point). My flow is to:
    1. generate HDR for each segment
    2. determine right parameters on one segment
    3. batch process the others
    4. join segments in PTGui
    5. tweak final image and crop in PS


    hardly rapid but sometimes the only way to work with interiors.

    http://cjeastwd.blogspot.com/2009/03...agnificat.html


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