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Thread: Hey G1 fans.

  1. #51
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by monza View Post
    All in good fun. Every camera will miss that expression if it is only around for 1/100.



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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    Maybe that's a part of it. The slowness of EVFs does something to my concentration and ability to shoot a changing scene precisely, even if the EVF updates fast enough, at least theoretically. It's more the fact that there is a lag, as short as it may be, and how that changes my attitude. More of a brain-lag than an eye-lag, but still...
    Hi Jorgan
    I hope you're well?
    Happy New Year!

    Have you shot with a G1?
    It's interesting leaving review on, and then shooting people with the EVF - you follow the expression (as one does), press the shutter, then, up pops something quite different - most disconcerting!

    Of course, it may simply be that when you shoot with an SLR (or a rangefinder) the review is not immediately shoved in your face, and by the time you look at the LCD on the back . . . . you've kind of forgotten what you were expecting.

    Monza - we do understand each other (don't we?) - I'm not knocking here, and no longer playing the grumpy old man - I think it's an interesting and useful discussion (and I certainly think the G1 is a splendid camera).

    Just this guy you know

  3. #53
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    no matter the gear, i seem to be the biggest limiting factor in my own photography.

    that being said, the g1 works quite well for my kind of street shooting. i'm thinking that with a zm 21 lens attached it will make a great street shooter. i hope the 20/1.7 is released asap as that sounds like it would be perfect for me. i'm liking this whole auto focus thing too much.
    i like really wide also and am wondering what i might do about that.

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Jono,

    Your response puzzles me. On the objective reviews that have been published the G1 has been shown to have higher resolution than the M8. The same is true for color accuracy and my own eyes seem to confirm both. However, if you are talking about some perzang or presence that you see and is your subjective interpretation of "better" that is different. I did not find the M8 to be a particularly fast camera in any area but certainly anticipatory shooting is possible and probably easier with a RF viewfinder. The M8 is slow to start and slow to write its file and present it for review. This is in no way meant to put down the M8's file quality which is excellent. I would say the difference in resolution is so small as to probably only be visible under extreme conditions unlike say the Nikon D3x versus the Nikon D3. I can't speak to the A900 as I only know what I have read in LL on that camera.
    V/r John

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    Hmm - to be honest, this was exactly what I had in mind when I bought the G1, and in some respects it's exceeded my expectations



    I didn't think we were discussing price - and I'm sure that Woody wouldn'tbe
    Still, I'll accept a variation of opinion on that one.


    Yes, but we all get lucky . . . Seriously though, I wasn't talking about portraits, I was talking about candids, when the moment is sooo fleeting. I'm really impressed with the EVF of the G1 . . . but it's still true that shooting candids of people, what you get is something quite other then what you saw.
    Hey Jono

    My opinon is based on the bias that with the EVF of the G1 the number of "misfires" due to poor focus should be less. Thus the G1 may improve the number of "keepers" in total. This is in terms of absolutes, not a few percent of keepers with one system vs another.

    I am remaining impressed with what can be done with this (seemingly)primitive system compared to a $6K+ Leica rangefinder. I have to say that I think Panasonic has hit the nail on the head with this one. Let's have some cheers for the G1

    Woody

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    Hmm - to be honest, this was exactly what I had in mind when I bought the G1, and in some respects it's exceeded my expectations



    I didn't think we were discussing price - and I'm sure that Woody wouldn'tbe
    Still, I'll accept a variation of opinion on that one.


    Yes, but we all get lucky . . . Seriously though, I wasn't talking about portraits, I was talking about candids, when the moment is sooo fleeting. I'm really impressed with the EVF of the G1 . . . but it's still true that shooting candids of people, what you get is something quite other then what you saw.
    Jono

    I have been a fan of yours for a long time, admiring the shots you have captured etc.

    But what the hell is the snide comment about me you managed to sneak in. Do you think I am some rich kvetch that doesn't need to think about money in order to get decent images. I have certainly owned a lot of gear but have been lucky to sell when the value is still high in order to get a newer system which I feel may contribute to even better images.

    Why not confine yourself to evaluating images from all of us, regardless of what you think our disposable incomes may be, without stepping under the stairs to make the images you review (or just put down) appear less when viewed from the preamble you presuppose.

    Maybe I am just biased but I think your comment is a really cheap shot. Do you know me? If not then why not shut up unless you have some evidence as to my motives.

    Christ I thought we had ended this kind of cheap commentery on forums like DP Review. This is not the stuff that the GEt DPI forums are made of. Of if it is, then I will gladly retire to my own thoughts.

    Have a nice day

    Woody

  7. #57
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    I was a former subscriber to ReidReviews, also. Couldn't stand the interface. Just didn't see the value of the articles.

  8. #58
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Jono, in my brief time w/the G1 so far, *in which I've come to the camera on it's own terms* (not expecting to use it in exactly the same way as my other cameras -film...), I've not noticed an obstacle to capturing the moment I see for the shot --assuming that moment is viewed on one of the G1's screens. Now if you wanted to shoot w/out looking through/at the camera, then you're SOL. You have to accept the screen time as where the action takes place, and I think you can stop that w/fair accuracy.

    (disregard all of the above if you're moving the camera fast in lower light, though, when the randomness principle will just about Completely take over.)

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    Yes, but we all get lucky . . . Seriously though, I wasn't talking about portraits, I was talking about candids, when the moment is sooo fleeting. I'm really impressed with the EVF of the G1 . . . but it's still true that shooting candids of people, what you get is something quite other then what you saw.
    What the HELL is that supposed to mean?

    Seriously though, the harder I work, the luckier I get

    I think I know what you mean Jono, and with that particular shot I was using the articulating LCD, shooting at waist level (can you do that with your M8? ) which allows me to see everything and not intimidate the subject with a camera in front of my face.

    Hope you're having a better day today

    Kind Regards

    Brian

  10. #60
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Brian you appear to be saying that using this camera is like pressing the pause button on a video recorder,doesnt appeal a great deal to be honest.



    Just to put in a good word for Shaun,for me its as if Im doing the tests myself,he appears,on this subject,to think as I do and so his opinion is invaluable to me,just luck but there you go.
    Last edited by nei1; 13th January 2009 at 00:57.

  11. #61
    Senior Member Brian Mosley's Avatar
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by nei1 View Post
    Brian you appear to be saying that using this camera is like pressing the pause button on a video recorder,doesnt appeal a great deal to be honest.
    No, just having a little fun with Jono nei1 - please don't be offended, the M8 is lovely really

    Kind Regards

    Brian

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    Jono

    I have been a fan of yours for a long time, admiring the shots you have captured etc.

    But what the hell is the snide comment about me you managed to sneak in. Do you think I am some rich kvetch that doesn't need to think about money in order to get decent images. I have certainly owned a lot of gear but have been lucky to sell when the value is still high in order to get a newer system which I feel may contribute to even better images.

    Why not confine yourself to evaluating images from all of us, regardless of what you think our disposable incomes may be, without stepping under the stairs to make the images you review (or just put down) appear less when viewed from the preamble you presuppose.

    Maybe I am just biased but I think your comment is a really cheap shot. Do you know me? If not then why not shut up unless you have some evidence as to my motives.

    Christ I thought we had ended this kind of cheap commentery on forums like DP Review. This is not the stuff that the GEt DPI forums are made of. Of if it is, then I will gladly retire to my own thoughts.

    Have a nice day

    Woody
    Well, what I thought I meant was that you would be more concerned with image quality than the cost of the G1, which doesn't seem to me to be excessive enough to warrant selling an M8 body.

    If it was a cheap shot, then as an owner of two M8 bodies and a G1, I could certainly be accused of living in a glass house!

    Truth is, I was seduced by the idea of the Woody wouldn't he.

    Ah well, i suppose I should apologise, but I rather feel like having cracked an innocent joke in the pub and immediately been punched hard in the face with no preamble.

    Just this guy you know

  13. #63
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    I was refering to your opinion of the G1 not the M8 Brian,seems to me people get offended a little too quickly or to too great a degree here sometimes.To such a degree that Im constantly on guard not to say anything that might offend,not the best thing for an open honest discussion.Those that are regulars here to my mind are a great bunch of people,a bit of slack does not go amiss.

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    Hey Jono

    My opinon is based on the bias that with the EVF of the G1 the number of "misfires" due to poor focus should be less. Thus the G1 may improve the number of "keepers" in total. This is in terms of absolutes, not a few percent of keepers with one system vs another.
    Well, I think that is definitely true (in terms of in focus keepers). Whether you'll catch the moment in the same way is what I was questioning.
    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    I am remaining impressed with what can be done with this (seemingly)primitive system compared to a $6K+ Leica rangefinder. I have to say that I think Panasonic has hit the nail on the head with this one. Let's have some cheers for the G1

    Woody
    Nothing primitive about this - definitely the most advanced autofocus of it's kind.

    There have been nothing BUT cheers for the G1, and I quite subscribe to it, but I've not seen any (informed) criticism, and I thought it was worth putting down my feelings - of course, anyone can disagree (and they certainly do )

    Just this guy you know

  15. #65
    Senior Member Brian Mosley's Avatar
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Sorry nei1, as Jono has demonstrated quite masterfully, text is a crap form of communication - often, one can't read the emotional intent behind the post... and all kinds of offence can be taken.

    Now what the hell's wrong with my opinion of the G1?

    Kind Regards

    Brian

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Mosley View Post
    What the HELL is that supposed to mean?

    Woody - why couldn't you have responded like that?


    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Mosley View Post
    Seriously though, the harder I work, the luckier I get
    Absolutely - so you can understand that I was simply telling you how hard you work

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Mosley View Post
    I think I know what you mean Jono, and with that particular shot I was using the articulating LCD, shooting at waist level (can you do that with your M8? ) which allows me to see everything and not intimidate the subject with a camera in front of my face.
    No, I can't do that with the M8, and you must understand, I think that the G1 is a fabulous camera, both in terms of useability and image quality - with reference to your excellent shot, that expression was not a fleeting one (or, at least, it doesn't look like it).
    Mind you, one of the joys of the M8 is that it really doesn't seem to intimidate people when held to your face - certainly less than any other camera I've used.

    I'm allowed to make a negative point though - and of course, to be slagged off accordingly
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Mosley View Post
    Hope you're having a better day today
    I was having a fine day yesterday thanks very much
    Today is also looking up.

    (p.s. sorry to remove two of your cusses, I was told I had too many images)

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by nei1 View Post
    a bit of slack does not go amiss.
    Hey!
    Neil, I take that personally - you've got to be careful what you say around here

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  18. #68
    Senior Member Brian Mosley's Avatar
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Heehee, I used all your cusses up! result!

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    the 1/100s was plucked from the air (silly me), but if you understand what I'm saying then that's fine.

    I think that with an optical viewfinder (and practice) there's a whole business about anticipation and response, which really doesn't work that well with an EVF, but hey - it's my opinion, and I'm not trying to present it as a universal truth - simply that if you're used to using an RF (and like it) then you'll find the EVF on the G1 troublesome, even if it is the best EVF ever made!
    I've tried the same thing myself, not with an M8 mind you, but against a Ricoh GX-200 - snap or manual mode of course.

    Its a nice idea to use the G1 in a street shooting role, but I find the moment can easily be lost somewhere in puddle ...

    Give me rough frame deep DOF grainy hip shooting any day - but the G1 has its other strengths of course!
    Last edited by rich s; 13th January 2009 at 03:01.

  20. #70
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    like I said Jono,I chose my words carefully

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by rich s View Post
    Give me rough frame deep DOF grainy hip shooting any day
    That sounds a bit kinky Rich!

    Kind Regards

    Brian

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Mosley View Post
    That sounds a bit kinky Rich!

    Kind Regards

    Brian
    Don't forget I'm a fully signed up Frenchman these days ...!

  23. #73
    Senior Member Brian Mosley's Avatar
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Haw hee haw!

    lucky so & so...

    Cheers

    Brian

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by rich s View Post
    Don't forget I'm a fully signed up Frenchman these days ...!
    HI Rich
    HAPPY NEW YEAR
    Are you really - how very delicious . . . are you spending all your time there too?

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Mosley View Post
    Heehee, I used all your cusses up! result!
    Is that what those are??? LOL.

    Diane

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diane B View Post
    Is that what those are??? LOL.

    Diane
    aren't cusses
    is angry
    is cussing

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    HI Rich
    HAPPY NEW YEAR
    Are you really - how very delicious . . . are you spending all your time there too?
    A Happy New Year to you too Jono...!

    My primary residence is now in France, so al being well, next week I'll be off & away!
    Will be at my flat in Pont Aven for most of the time. Soon be spring there ... warm weather, glorious dawns and dusks, slow afternoons in cafes ... can't wait!

    Now who fancies a photo trip to sample the delights of Brittany .. ??

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Time for ADMIN to jump in with a gentile reminder. Let's keep in mind we are all friends here and no need to make or take things personally: No single person has done or said anything wrong, and everybody is entitled to freely expressing their opinion, but the temper from a few of you is changing toward becoming personal and if continued to let build, will head to dangerous territory for a forum discussion. So let's lighten up, and enjoy and respect each other's company even though we are disagreeing.

    Thanks,
    Jack
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  29. #79
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    ...All I know, is that when I've been shooting the G1 in low light with people, the picture I get is something quite other than the picture I saw in the viewfinder...
    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    ...The slowness of EVFs does something to my concentration and ability to shoot a changing scene precisely, even if the EVF updates fast enough, at least theoretically. It's more the fact that there is a lag, as short as it may be, and how that changes my attitude...
    Thanks for warning guys. I was interested by this little beast as a small digital back for my M lenses and a possible successor to my good old Digilux 1 but if it has more shutter lag or whatever slowness than the latter it is a deal breaker for me i'm afraid.

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flesher View Post
    Time for ADMIN to jump in with a gentile reminder. Let's keep in mind we are all friends here and no need to make or take things personally: No single person has done or said anything wrong, and everybody is entitled to freely expressing their opinion, but the temper from a few of you is changing toward becoming personal and if continued to let build, will head to dangerous territory for a forum discussion. So let's lighten up, and enjoy and respect each other's company even though we are disagreeing.

    Thanks,
    Okay Jack
    For my part I regret causing any offence, but I certainly didn't intend any (I thought it was lighthearted enough).
    As for the banter on this page, isn't it just that? I don't see any ruffled feathers.

    Maybe some kinds of humour don't travel across the Atlantic so well.

    Just this guy you know

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Thanks Jack my brain is finally waking up after a long 10 days in LA but I agree. Maybe use those emotion icons a little more effectively. Words get twisted sometimes and honestly folks first send a PM and see what gives first before reacting. I know i should talk. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by LCT View Post
    Thanks for warning guys. I was interested by this little beast as a small digital back for my M lenses and a possible successor to my good old Digilux 1 but if it has more shutter lag or whatever slowness than the latter it is a deal breaker for me i'm afraid.
    Well, I wouldn't be put off by a couple of oldies like us! - it's sooo much faster than the Digilux 1 that you wouldn't believe it. There is lots of good press for this camera, and it's such a huge step forwards.

    My remarks were about personal use for taking pictures of people in low light - I'd rather use the M8, but I'm sure lots would disagree quite radically.

    Go and try one out - seriously, I'd hate to be responsible for putting anyone off. The G1 is a huge leap forward in so many different ways, using it to replace the good old digilux1 would be like replacing a trusty old ford fiesta with a new scirocco!

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  33. #83
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    Well, I wouldn't be put off by a couple of oldies like us! - it's sooo much faster than the Digilux 1 that you wouldn't believe it....
    Did you have a slow Digilux 1 really? Mine is hardly slower as far as shutter lag than my DRFs (R-D1s) or DSLRs (D70, 5D).

  34. #84
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Thanks Jack my brain is finally waking up after a long 10 days in LA but I agree. Maybe use those emotion icons a little more effectively. Words get twisted sometimes and honestly folks first send a PM and see what gives first before reacting. I know i should talk. LOL
    Aw, Guy - I think those emotion icons are a lot of fun! I think they help to convey a lighthearted intent - the ones I've used above are supposed to be in good humour.

    Sorry if that wasn't as obvious as it could have been (another slap to forehead)

    Kind Regards

    Brian

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Well I almost didn't say anything, but I was concerned a few folks were maybe starting to get their feathers a bit ruffled, or knickers in a knot if you're on the other side of the pond (), so my intent was just to prevent that from happening.

    And speaking personally re the emoticons, I chose most of them, so I think they are all pretty neat
    Jack
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  36. #86
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Mosley View Post
    Aw, Guy - I think those emotion icons are a lot of fun! I think they help to convey a lighthearted intent - the ones I've used above are supposed to be in good humour.

    Sorry if that wasn't as obvious as it could have been (another slap to forehead)

    Kind Regards

    Brian
    Quite right too Brian - I note with glee that there are nine emoticons left so here are several more well deserved slaps to your head:

    Just this guy you know

  37. #87
    Senior Member Brian Mosley's Avatar
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Jono,

    but which emoticon is best? there's only one way to find out!

    Emoticon f i g h t ! ! ! ! ! ! ( apologies to our stateside cousins who don't get Harry Hill's TV burp)





    Kind Regards

    Brian

  38. #88
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    After reading through this thread again (a little painfully) I was at first

    Then :sleep006:

    Next I was

    And finally

    My final conclusion was to for everyone involved.

    P.S. As one of the less-well-informed "stateside cousins" I would realy appreciate a short glossary of terms from those residing in the British Isles. For instance, is "slagged off" a good thing or a bad thing? Thanks in advance.
    Last edited by TRSmith; 13th January 2009 at 09:15.

  39. #89
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by TRSmith View Post
    P.S. As one of the less-well-informed "stateside cousins" I would realy appreciate a short glossary of terms from those residing in the British Isles. For instance, is "slagged off" a good thing or a bad thing? Thanks in advance.
    Hmm, what an interesting question.
    Conventionally, to be slagged off would be to be criticised by someone. However, a 'slag' is a sexist term to denote a girl of erm should we say looser than normal morals (just the type of girl I like . . and just the sort of expression I don't).

    So, I suppose you could say with respect to being 'slagged off' . . I should be so lucky!

    Just this guy you know

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    Subscriber Member TRSmith's Avatar
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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Sounds like an all-occasion expression. I'll try it out on a few of the locals. Thanks!

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    LOL, I think we should look into getting more of the emoticons myself. There just a lot of fun.

    Brian your were fine BTW.

    I do think it would be fun to do a list of slang words and there meaning. Obviously US ones are different than the Brits and Aussie's. Also our German folks around here have some interesting sayings too. Not ruling anyone out but like Tim said about the slagged off is a great example.

    On a serious note if one does feel slightly offended than a quick PM to someone saying it maybe the best bet. Just ask what the meaning is. Obviously we all know the blatant ones and that is Jacks and my job to handle.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Thanks Jack my brain is finally waking up after a long 10 days in LA but I agree. Maybe use those emotion icons a little more effectively. Words get twisted sometimes and honestly folks first send a PM and see what gives first before reacting. I know i should talk. LOL
    The real problem is ASCII is Too Intimate as Mike Godwin (yes, Godwin's Law Godwin) has observed.

    "The market wants a Leica to be a Leica: the inheritor of tradition, the subject of lore, and indisputably a mark of status to own."
    Mike Johnston


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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    Interesting theory - but I'm not buying it... I think we project our own emotions, insecurities and imagined motives onto what other people text. It's not that simple imho.

    Kind Regards

    Brian

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    Re: Hey G1 fans.

    The problem, said the director,... is that the system cannot transmit "prana." That is, it cannot transmit that almost mystical sense of life force or presence that one wants in a true meeting of minds.
    Or smell either
    (actually I'm not joking, there is so much that is transmitted in face to face meetings).

    I agree with Brian though - it's all rather complex . . . and isn't that GREAT!

    Just this guy you know

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