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GH5s

iiiNelson

iiiNelson

Well-known member
ptomsu said:
Here we go ....

The Lumix GH5S is Panasonic's most video-focused camera yet | TechRadar

An impressive video camera - although nothing what I lust for - but I am sure it will shuffle the video market up down :cool:
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Looks great for indie filmmakers, crash cams, B/C cams, and advanced YouTube content providers.

I wonder what the dual ISO levels will be set at. I know quite a few people were bummed that the EVA1 was set at 800/2500 when VariCam is at 800/5000. I hope they at least have the same options for this camera given the pricing.
 
Jorgen Udvang

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
What is initially clear is that for low light video, the GH5s sweeps the floor with the GH5. I did another comparison however, with stills from the Imaging Resource studio scene, which isn't a low light scene at all, but:

- When reducing the GH5 images to the resolution of the GH5s, the noise and general detail rendering seem similar.
- When it comes to colour accuracy and in particular colour detail, the GH5s is clearly superior. For colour detail in the red spectrum (orange to purple), the GH5s is vastly superior.

I only checked the ISO 6,400 and 25,600 images.

Would there be any point buying this camera to do 50% or more stills? For some people, maybe.

- If 10MP is enough for one's needs.
- It offers great high ISO straight out of the camera.
- Colour detail seems to be better than with the GH5.
- Smaller files.
- Oversized sensor for less difference in MP size between different aspect ratios (my GH2 used to be glued to 16:9).
- No IBIS means one thing less that may fail, and most Panasonic lenses offer OIS anyway.
- Less MP requires more self dicipline.
- I do an increasing amount of industrial video which is often low light.

In a way, it's like an E-1 on steroids that can also do very high-end video. I must admit I like the idea :loco: I don't expect many others to follow me on this one though :)

Oh... and during a re-organising of my image archive (more on that on a separate thread later) I found that more than 80% of the stills I've taken with digital cameras ever were taken with cameras that have 12MP or less. I still use a couple of them :)

Hmmm... at the moment there's no money under the mattress, but later maybe :rolleyes:

I sure will have to try one though.
 
ptomsu

ptomsu

Workshop Member
This is clearly not the camera for me - especially no IBIS and too much video centric - I would rather choose the normal GH5.
 
iiiNelson

iiiNelson

Well-known member
ptomsu said:
This is clearly not the camera for me - especially no IBIS and too much video centric - I would rather choose the normal GH5.
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Yeah I think the G9 is more what you’d want.

The GH series has always been about Video and this is no different. I see this more as a option for those without the GH5, indie shooters, YouTubers, or dedicated B/C/Crash Cam needs. Also those that need lowlight capability.
 
Jorgen Udvang

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
The better colour detail rendering that I mentioned earlier is probably due to the 14 bit RAW files in combination with the larger pixels. That's my guess at least. I've compared low ISO files as well now, and there's not any noticeable difference when it comes to colours between the two, and the GH5 obviously shows a lot more detail here.

Video is again the big strength of this camera, and due to the oversized sensor, Cine 4K, which uses the whole width of the sensor (4096 pixels), has a lower crop factor than 2 (I think I saw 1.86 mentioned somewhere), which means that the 7-14mm lens becomes something like a 13-26mm eqv. That's pretty cool actually :)

Here's another interesting video showing the video capabilities of this camera:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=519&v=ItSiupRG2Oo
 
iiiNelson

iiiNelson

Well-known member
Well it looks like the Dual ISO is set at ISO400/2500 which is likely so that it doesn’t cannibalize the EVA1 or VariCam. Another thing of note is that the GH5S loses 5-Axis IBIS so it’s importantly to choose carefully if you aren’t going to have this live on a tripod or gimbal. Maybe not a huge deal for filmmakers or Advanced Video users but it does mean that this isn’t the pure all arounder the GH5 or G9 are for most people.

Another great thing about the GH5/S is the built in Anamorphic film modes. I don’t know any other camera makers doing that at this price point. Excellent choice for those that make music videos as well.
 
Jorgen Udvang

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
iiiNelson said:
Well it looks like the Dual ISO is set at ISO400/2500 which is likely so that it doesn’t cannibalize the EVA1 or VariCam. Another thing of note is that the GH5S loses 5-Axis IBIS so it’s importantly to choose carefully if you aren’t going to have this live on a tripod or gimbal. Maybe not a huge deal for filmmakers or Advanced Video users but it does mean that this isn’t the pure all arounder the GH5 or G9 are for most people.

Another great thing about the GH5/S is the built in Anamorphic film modes. I don’t know any other camera makers doing that at this price point. Excellent choice for those that make music videos as well.
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For those who work with two bodies, GH5s plus GH5 or GH5s plus G9 would be ideal. As I keep watching videos and read reviews, lots of small details come up. One such detail is that the microphone jack can be set to line-in mode. That means that the camera can record sound from a sound recorder with line-out, like the more advanced Tascam and Zoom models (not to be confused with headphone out which operates with different, not constant levels).

Here's another, well thought out video that shows the difference between OIS and Dual IS very well, as well as the difference between the 180 fps of the GH5 and the 240 fps of the GH5s:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TvczoXB1aA

As for myself, most of my current video work being industrial and on a tripod anyway, the loss of Dual IS isn't that big a problem. The GX8 that I use now doesn't have it when shooting 4K. If or when I buy a new camera, I'll keep the GX8, which covers the 20MP part for me most of the time. We'll see. I can't afford it, right? :ROTFL:
 
iiiNelson

iiiNelson

Well-known member
Jorgen Udvang said:
For those who work with two bodies, GH5s plus GH5 or GH5s plus G9 would be ideal. As I keep watching videos and read reviews, lots of small details come up. One such detail is that the microphone jack can be set to line-in mode. That means that the camera can record sound from a sound recorder with line-out, like the more advanced Tascam and Zoom models (not to be confused with headphone out which operates with different, not constant levels).

Here's another, well thought out video that shows the difference between OIS and Dual IS very well, as well as the difference between the 180 fps of the GH5 and the 240 fps of the GH5s:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TvczoXB1aA

As for myself, most of my current video work being industrial and on a tripod anyway, the loss of Dual IS isn't that big a problem. The GX8 that I use now doesn't have it when shooting 4K. If or when I buy a new camera, I'll keep the GX8, which covers the 20MP part for me most of the time. We'll see. I can't afford it, right? :ROTFL:
Click to expand...

No I already understand the principles of all of that and I wasn’t implying the loss of 5-Axis was bad. Just another factor to consider. I believe the GH5S steps even deeper into the video production side than older GH camera to really differentiate the GH line even further from the G line. I believe this is a good strategic move and I hope Panasonic implements some sort of PDAF in the next generation of cameras. That’s the one area that I believe Canon, Olympus, Sony, and even Fujifilm to some extent now are far surpassing Panasonic in the Vlogging, event shooter, and one man indie video rig arena... I know that’s not the main market for them but it is a substantial piece of it that creates and generates a lot of buzz in their direction (good or bad)

As for audio recorders I personally lean heavily towards the Sound Devices MixPre series (or Zoom H6/F4/F8) for small production, wedding video, Youtube, or podcasting type functions.
 
Jorgen Udvang

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
iiiNelson said:
Well that’s nice but I guess the thing is that it’s not hard to make small 10mp images look good. For instance the A7S images look great ablove 51200. If you down-Rez A7RII Images they look great as well.
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The A7s models are certainly impressive at high ISO and the only A7 models I have considered. But m4/3 and usable ISO 20,000... I don't get that from the GX8 even if I downres to 10 MP.
 
ptomsu

ptomsu

Workshop Member
Jorgen Udvang said:
The better colour detail rendering that I mentioned earlier is probably due to the 14 bit RAW files in combination with the larger pixels. That's my guess at least. I've compared low ISO files as well now, and there's not any noticeable difference when it comes to colours between the two, and the GH5 obviously shows a lot more detail here.

Video is again the big strength of this camera, and due to the oversized sensor, Cine 4K, which uses the whole width of the sensor (4096 pixels), has a lower crop factor than 2 (I think I saw 1.86 mentioned somewhere), which means that the 7-14mm lens becomes something like a 13-26mm eqv. That's pretty cool actually :)

Here's another interesting video showing the video capabilities of this camera:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=519&v=ItSiupRG2Oo
Click to expand...
Definitely impressive tool! And impressive review!!!
 
Jorgen Udvang

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
ptomsu said:
Definitely impressive tool! And impressive review!!!
Click to expand...
Since digital cameras became mainstream, the discussions have mostly centered around resolution and high ISO noise. Only on medium format forums have the discussions around tonality and colour depth dominated. As a side effect of being a very competent video camera, the GH5s seems to have become a stills camera with some unusual abilities, like the Sony A7s, the Nikon D700 and the Fuji S3 before it. I'm sure there are more. The Olympus E-1? The Nikon Df?

Neither of those cameras are or were for photographers who wanted the ultimate resolution in stills. They did however all get a reputation for having qualities that were unusual for their time. Although tons of resolution is cool, cool like ultra wideangles, super telephoto lenses and drones, it is not what makes or breakes my photos. Solid image quality with a file size large enough for the sizes I print, a good viewfinder, fluent ergonomics and a build quality that makes the camera a tool, not a showpiece, that's what I'm after.

Would it be a better or worse tool for my work than the G9 or GH5? For video, certainly better. For photography, I would have to live with lower resolution and no dual IS. But the files I've seen so far have been impressive. I would love to play with some RAW files. They are available online, but how do I open them? My ACR, the 2018 version, seems unwilling.

It's a bit like loading a roll of Tri-X in broad daylight when there's plenty of Velvia in the drawer. I like that :loco: :ROTFL:
 
ptomsu

ptomsu

Workshop Member
Well I would not call 20MP of a G9, GH5 or EM1.2 an overkill or too much resolution. For me the 20MP (or also 24MP) are just the right resolution - and I guess that will not go away for me, even when higher standard resolutions become available.

But the 10 or 12 MP have always been too less resolution for my type of usage and also this will never change.
 
Jorgen Udvang

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
As for the lack of IBIS, there seem to be several reasons:

- The oversized sensor makes it more complicated, since the body is the same as the GH5 that has a slightly smaller sensor.
- It prevents the sensor from being mounted on a heat sink, increasing sensor temperature which again generates noise.
- Many professional video makers have specifically asked for a model without IBIS, since the IBIS mechanism tends to malfuncition or even com loose when the camera is mounted in or on race cars etc. where there's strong vibration.
- In most professional production environment, the camera is mounted on a gimbal, tripod, steadycam etc. anyway.

Makes sense to me, and since both the original GH5 and the G9 have IBIS, this is hardly a problem. Several Panasonic lenses have OIS anyway.

Me? The fewer moving parts the better. One thing less that will break or malfunction. I have owned and used dozens of cameras and only two have had IBIS, the E-M1 and the GX8 that I use now. Maybe get a mini fluidhead for my Gorilla-pod, if such a thing exists :)
 
ptomsu

ptomsu

Workshop Member
Jorgen,

I do understand that you really love to have this camera - BUT you should not try to find arguments against everything that was good till now and for everything that is great from now on with the GH5s.

If you like it as much, just buy it :D
 
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