Panasonic FF Mirrorless to be announced on September 25th

[pegelli]

Well - and we are again miles away from the original topic of this thread :banghead:

Maybe if it helps - I reiterate again - Sony make the greatest and best cameras and lenses - second to none!

And now we hopefully can continue with the real discussion

C'mon Peter, you're smarter than that.
We're only reacting to your off-topic and erroneous comment.
We never said Sony was "better" than any other camera (contrary to your statement) and have no problems you like the Nikons better (and said so), also Panasonic make great cameras and lenses. Wether they are "better" or "worse" depends largely on personal factors.
It's such a pity when toes are longer than arms can reach. :toocool:

 

[iiiNelson]

C'mon Peter, you're smarter than that.
We're only reacting to your off-topic and erroneous comment.
We never said Sony was "better" than any other camera (contrary to your statement) and have no problems you like the Nikons better (and said so), also Panasonic make great cameras and lenses. Wether they are "better" or "worse" depends largely on personal factors.
It's such a pity when toes are longer than arms can reach. :toocool:

In fairness I did say the best of Sony is better by objective measurables but that completely discounts subjective factors by inference.

What I never said is that Nikon was crap and I stated that objectively they’re fine - but when people are trying to compare a system of 2 lenses to one that’s pretty fleshed out (without acknowledging it) then I personally feel that’s a bit disingenuous to objectivity. I fully acknowledged the obvious shortcomings of the Sony system when I bought into it (few lenses and the need to fast track maturation development) and did so from a flexibility standpoint and overall long term direction. I have no issue with Nikon users (or really that of any system) doing the exact same thing but just be honest about the obvious shortcomings they didn’t initially correct from Sony’s missteps. Even if the A7RII not having dual card slots was a mistake, doesn’t mean you have to follow the same mistake - especially considering that Nikon execs were some of the most publicly vocal critics.

 

[iiiNelson]

Well - and we are again miles away from the original topic of this thread :banghead:

Maybe if it helps - I reiterate again - Sony make the greatest and best cameras and lenses - second to none!

And now we hopefully can continue with the real discussion

No need to be sensationalism... no one is saying Sony cameras are without flaws/desired improvements. Obviously I’ve stated my interest in what panasonic is doing several times. Obviously I sold off pieces of my Sony kit earlier this year. Obviously I got hands on time with the Nikon, Canon, and Fuji bodies throughout the year. I’m obviously completely open to something truly better if/when it comes... if it doesn’t then I’m confident in existing gear but if it does I have no issue dropping what’s left of my Sony kit.

With that hat said I agree we should get back to Panasonic topics. I withheld my opinions of the Nikon Z for this exact reason. I can be critical of the obvious perceived shortcomings other cameras without defensive rhetoric when I call out the hypocrisy of many users and when I correct misinformation I get called a fanboy... whatever though.

 

[k-hawinkler]

:worthless:

By Easter maybe? :facesmack:

 

[Vivek]

To be fair, Nikon and Leica have dented my pockets with defective products. Nikon was worse with refusing to acknowledge design flaws.

 

[rayyan]

For every camera, there are people with horror stories re: support, repair, out of the box malfunction etc...

But people didn’t and won’t stop buying new cameras/lenses.

We are human, after all...hopefully. And said without going OT of what constitutes being human or possessing human attributes

 

[iiiNelson]

:worthless:

By Easter maybe? :facesmack:

Well we still need a dedicated L-Mount section IMO. At least then we could add SL pics for those that own them.

 

[Jorgen Udvang]

:worthless:

By Easter maybe? :facesmack:

Why not right now? This is the way new cameras should be presented, from the back. I couldn't care less about what it looks like from the front. This is the part I see and use.

 

[k-hawinkler]

:grin::grin:

Why not right now? This is the way new cameras should be presented, from the back. I couldn't care less about what it looks like from the front. This is the part I see and use.

:grin::grin:

That camera clearly needs an elongated soft rubber Eyecup to block out the light from the side. :grin:

 

[Jorgen Udvang]

:grin::grin:

That camera clearly needs an elongated soft rubber Eyecup to block out the light from the side. :grin:

It possibly does. Panasonic makes that for the GX8. I have it on both of mine.

Edit:
I suppose they have chose the round shape due to requests from photographers. It seems to be the preferred viewfinder shape among Nikon users, and this rubber ring is much deeper that the ones on high end Nikon cameras. It looks very similar to the one on the Leica SL, so hopefully it's the same one. I wouldn't mind a 90 degree attachment and maybe a loupe/enlarger.

 

[Jorgen Udvang]

Well we still need a dedicated L-Mount section IMO. At least then we could add SL pics for those that own them.

I agree. The group of L-mount users can quickly become very large here, with an interesting bunch of SL, CL, Panasonic and Sigma users. I'm already an ethusiast :ROTFL:

If one of these launches a couple of compact, full frame primes, I can even see myself considering a TL/2 or even a CL as a replacement for m4/3 (I wouldn't buy any of the APS-C lenses since they wouldn't be very useful on the S1). Actually, the CL would be a great backup for the S1

 

[bensonga]

I have not been following all the back and forth on this thread. That said...I am very happy to see Panasonic enter the FF sensor market with L-mount cameras and lenses.

For me, these would not be a replacement for my m43 Panasonic/Olympus cameras and lenses. I doubt that any comparable focal length Pana FF L-mount camera/lens combo will be as compact as my versatile pair of GX8s with the 12-35/2.8 and 35-100/2.8 lenses. Nor as a replacement for my G85/G9 or Oly E-M1 with the other outstanding compact m43 lenses from Panasonic and Olympus with FF equivalent FL ranges between 16 and 600mm.

I see the Panasonic FF L-mount camera as an alternative to my current Sony FF cameras/lenses, not as a replacement for my m43 cameras/lenses. That said, I'm happy enough with the images from my Sony A7(monochrome), A7II and A7rII cameras and Sony etc FE mount lenses, so it is very unlikely I will be changing FF mirrorless systems to the Panasonic L-mount (or any other FF mirrorless system).

Gary

 

[iiiNelson]

I have not been following all the back and forth on this thread....

Gary

You didn’t miss much... if I’m being 100% honest.

I agree that the Lumix S isn’t a direct replacement for anything Micro 4/3. It’s a complimentary system for existing users that may happen to be interested in a pro FF system with high end lenses and weather sealed bodies. I’m very interested in it to if for no other reason to see if it’ll beat what Sony is doing and to see if it’ll allow me to consolidate everything under one brand largely. I already have Sony Pro Support and the Lumix Pro Support looks interesting as well.

 

[iiiNelson]

I agree. The group of L-mount users can quickly become very large here, with an interesting bunch of SL, CL, Panasonic and Sigma users. I'm already an ethusiast :ROTFL:

If one of these launches a couple of compact, full frame primes, I can even see myself considering a TL/2 or even a CL as a replacement for m4/3 (I wouldn't buy any of the APS-C lenses since they wouldn't be very useful on the S1). Actually, the CL would be a great backup for the S1

I really don’t know how much an APS-C will add above your Micro 4/3. The lens selection for Micro 4/3 is hands down better and it’s really not even close. What’s currently available in Cropped L mount is borderline laughable with about 6 native lenses total being released. I’d personally stick with a Micro 4/3 where you have wide, normal, telephoto, and specialty zooms and primes available now. Also the bodies are quite a bit more advanced and capable though to be fair I hadn’t tested a Leica APS-C body newer than the TL2. I just don’t see them as being more capable than either the G9, GH, or OMD series...

Also if money IS an object maybe hope for Panasonic or Sigma to release a cropped body and for Sigma to put out their Art and Contemporary APS-C lenses. I’m sure any of the cropped Leica’s will cost as much as the S1/S1R Cameras.

 

[Jorgen Udvang]

I really don’t know how much an APS-C will add above your Micro 4/3.

It's not a qustion of adding anything, but to avoid dealing with two different lens mounts. The announced Panasonic 24-105mm, a lens that I most likely will buy if I go for this system, would become a very usfeul 36-158mm on a Leica CL. Add a WA prime (that would normally be mounted on the CL, like the Zuiko 12mm is on my GM5 nowadays) for the cropped format, and the CL (or cheaper used TL) becomes an excellent backup for the S1. Add a couple of primes (50 and 135mm?), and I would have a complete travel setup.

 

[ptomsu]

I have given up on the CL since long time as Leica is obviously not interested in IBIS and not even sensor shake to remove dust. And all the TL lenses are WITHOUT any IS. So this part is dead for me and no replacement for any of my m43 gear.

BTW I am starting to see more clear now - I will keep all my Olympus m43 gear and probably add a FF mirrorless later next year (either Z7 or S1R as soon as we know more real details) - no hurry at all and this will do one thing right: it helps my bank account :ROTFL:

 

[k-hawinkler]

Peter, keeping m43 gear and adding a FF system makes a lot of sense to me. :watch:

 

[iiiNelson]

I have given up on the CL since long time as Leica is obviously not interested in IBIS and not even sensor shake to remove dust. And all the TL lenses are WITHOUT any IS. So this part is dead for me and no replacement for any of my m43 gear.

BTW I am starting to see more clear now - I will keep all my Olympus m43 gear and probably add a FF mirrorless later next year (either Z7 or S1R as soon as we know more real details) - no hurry at all and this will do one thing right: it helps my bank account :ROTFL:

That seems to make a lot of sense. You’ll have a better idea of what Panasonic and Sigma will release and probably have a good idea of the lens roadmap for both companies. Also you probably won’t get telephoto options that are as small when compared to the Micro 4/3 so it makes a lot of sense to keep the Micro 4/3 for a travel kit at least. Seems like the OMD + 12-100/4 would make a lot of sense as an all in one solution.

 

[ptomsu]

Hat seems to make a lot of sense. You’ll have a better idea of what Panasonic and Sigma will release and probably have a good idea of the lens roadmap for both companies. Also you probably won’t get telephoto options that are as small when compared to the Micro 4/3 so it makes a lot of sense to keep the Micro 4/3 for a travel kit at least. Seems like the OMD + 12-100/4 would make a lot of sense as an all in one solution.

Have thought about that EM1.2 and 12-100/4 as travel kit already. Waiting to get this lens as soon as there are some significant discounts.

Waiting for the right FF system seems to be the right thing to do. Was a bit overwhelmed by how I liked the Z7 and I still find it a great camera (system) although giving this decision some more time is obviously good because of several reasons

 

[iiiNelson]

Have thought about that EM1.2 and 12-100/4 as travel kit already. Waiting to get this lens as soon as there are some significant discounts.

Waiting for the right FF system seems to be the right thing to do. Was a bit overwhelmed by how I liked the Z7 and I still find it a great camera (system) although giving this decision some more time is obviously good because of several reasons

Yeah there’s rumors that they’ll be launching a new Mirrorless Nikon next year as well. Apparently Nikon doesn’t view the Z6/7 as pro level cameras but they certainly priced them as such - especially the Z7. In any case waiting is probably a good option for anyone looking to potentially move across systems unless you’re certain which system to buy into or a deal is happening that’s too attractive to pass up.