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Thread: helen's First Attempts @Developing

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Well Did IT at Last....

    Rodinal 1:50 @20 Celsius 9 minutes
    probably should have done longer but used a Recipe
    from my pal 'Maddoc'/Gabor....
    First shot M4/dr cron /neopan ss100
    2nd shot M2 /pre lux / Ilford Pan F 50

    Lots to Learn but having FUN

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    Subscriber Member mwalker's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Looks good Helen, did you scan the shots?
    Mike

    website under construction

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Thank You my Kentucky Man....

    No scanning ...
    a) Too Lazy
    b) no scanner have I
    c) costs me just a few dollars to be put on disc

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    Subscriber Member TRSmith's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Helen, congratulations! I think you did very well. It's hard to tell exactly what the negs look like since you've added your own post processing digitally. But for a first try they're remarkable for what's NOT in them. Namely over-developed edges from too tight winding and/or uneven development, fog, streaks, scratches, water spots, and a host of other potential hand-developing disasters. Do more! You're off to a great start.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Quote Originally Posted by TRSmith View Post
    Helen, congratulations! I think you did very well. It's hard to tell exactly what the negs look like since you've added your own post processing digitally. But for a first try they're remarkable for what's NOT in them. Namely over-developed edges from too tight winding and/or uneven development, fog, streaks, scratches, water spots, and a host of other potential hand-developing disasters. Do more! You're off to a great start.
    YES I see YOU'VE been there
    and NO
    we won't Discuss the other negatives...
    and PP , WHO ME....

    actually I just tweaked slightly with the red/green/blue mixer
    THANK YOU Tim for your generous Eye & Heart

  6. #6
    nei1
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Well done Helen!see how easy it is!Now if you could find a friend who has a darkroom and you could watch a photo of yours slowly appear from nothing youll be well and truely bitten.................all the best,Neil.

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    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Yes, no sprocket streak marks, not under-agitated. Shadows and Highlights look good, gamma about right.
    Ahhhh The smell of fixer, daub some of that behind your ears, and every photographer will follow you (sort of the photo-geek equivalent of eau de cinnibon)
    I'll have to make some soup and process a roll from Moab.
    -bob

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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    i think they look exceptional and much prefer them! the just shine! brava!!!

    Gabor makes some of my favourite prints -- i think he gave you a winning recipe. kudos.

    (reminds me of my chimichurri sauce; very simple and better than any i've had in a restaurant)

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    Subscriber Member TRSmith's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    I second what nei1 has suggested... find some way to get into a print darkroom and slide those negs into an enlarger...the dim orange light barely illuminating a cozy room scented with chemicals... surrounded by the faint slosh of liquid and the squeak of rubber-tipped bamboo tongs against slippery trays as you caress your 2-dimensional world into existence. Oh baby, oh yeah!

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    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Tim,
    err sounds like we need an Adult forum?
    Don't get carried away, and be wary of Metol allergies
    But, yes, the physical/chemical processes had a tactile something going for them that digital lacks.
    I miss shuffling the prints in the washer at the end of a long darkroom session and the "flip-flip" of agitating 4x5 film while processing by inspection.
    but... not so much that I would do the majority of my work there anymore.
    -bob

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    Subscriber Member TRSmith's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Sorry Bob, I may have become a bit carried away. During my impoverished youth I spent many years working as a printer in various darkrooms. My favorite was the institutional print darkroom I managed for 3 years that was populated by two motorized Besslers, a cold-light head Omega, and a Focomat IIc (in my mind that little Focomat is one of the finest pieces of photographic equipment ever produced.) You might say that those early experiences "imprinted" a certain fascination with the process that borders on fetish. Sayyyy, is it a little warm in here?

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    Member beamon's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Oh my, I'm positively swooning! So nice to not be the only FOF (film old fellow...yeah right!) on the frequency.

    Makes me almost want to find that Tri-X back in the corner of the freezer in the garage, and load up the M6.
    Roger
    Leica M6, M8.2 & assorted Leica glass

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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Congratulations Helen and welcome to the real photographer's club!

    Just one thing I'd liek to mention - dont get too caught up in perfection and dont be afraid of so called mistakes - they often produce the most interesting and happy accidents!

    Pete

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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    H.....BRAVISSIMO
    especially like the 1st one.
    FWIW (and I know you like fun) I got some great results with 35mm TriX rated @1600ASA and processed in a fun developer called Diafine (google it) which if I recall was a 2 bath dev., and it almost seemed one did not have to worry too much about agitation and temp., and the dev. lasted for ever and a day! I can remember some shots I did at the National Cat Show in London printing 16x12 with some lovely grain structure.

    Cheers,
    Gandolfi.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Bob & Tim & Neil: I will have to head up to Mass., Maine , & Spain
    for personal Darkroom Secrets

    Roger ...Sweet /Thank you for your poetic Swoon

    Peter: Thanks for your congrats and
    YES mistakes can be Atmospheric & Cool looking
    particularly when shooting Tired or under the influence....

    Gandolfi: Diafine sounds Great particularly with the ease of temp & agitation
    But I agitate very GENTLY ...

    Thanx Cam for your Enthusiasm

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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Diafine, like most other two bath developers, divide the developing agents in the first bath, which soak in to the film, and then the activator (alkali) in the second. Add the developing agent that film will see in what had absorbed into the emulsion in the first bath. It tends to accentuate the appearance of grain, and makes for rather flat negatives. I recall that when using diafine, a grade 3 paper was more or less equivalent to a normal.
    Ont thing to remember with Diafine is to agitate very little if at all in the second bath, since over-agitation would leach out the developing agent from the emulsion.
    I used to make a divided D-76 which IMO worked a bit better. I will rummage around and see if I can find the recipe.
    -bob

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    Subscriber Member TRSmith's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    I have to mention (again) how odd it seems to read others say that they like the grainy look. What I remember from those long ago film days was that grain was the enemy. It was an unfortunate byproduct and to be minimized at all costs. Now I'm sure there were some who included grain as an artistic or stylistic statement, but as a budding "commercial" photographer, it was a sin.

    Maybe it's popular as a reaction to the smoothness of the digital age, or maybe it's nostalgia, but I can't get my head around the idea that enhancing or exaggerating the grain (especially in digital photos where it doesn't exist) is desirable. Year's of fighting against it have left me unable to appreciate it I guess.

    Anyway, what I remember of Diafine is that it did a nice job of holding shadow AND highlight detail in contrasty scenes. Which is really nice if you want a smooth somewhat flat negative to work with.

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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    is still an ugly lamp... (it's beautiful, btw) -- a reference to the T-Man (aka known as Hot Stuff -- due to your comments above) posting in another thread.

    about grain.... yes, i understand it is commercial undesirable. always has been, probably always will be, unless a retro edgy look is wanted.

    but for personal work and artistic expression, i tend to prefer it. (yes, i'm one of those who thinks most digital photography and high def television looks too plasticky.) i'm one of those who likes to see the texture, feel the imperfections. i prefer viewing artwork done in oil versus watercolour, mostly because i really want to touch it. i love nuance combined with bold statements. i want something real, not fantasy, to taste the grit of living.

    but that's me. not you. and i respect our differences. it's like the whole film vs. digital debate, or analogue vs. digital in audio. i prefer film and analogue -- yet i shoot with digital and made my living through digital audio. life is strange that way.

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    Subscriber Member TRSmith's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Thanks CAM (it's been awhile since anyone called me "Hotstuff").

    Kind of cool really, all these overlapping predilections. I'm old enough to remember the combination of black vinyl and the glow of a McIntosh tube amplifier. In fact, when times are flush, it's a Mac amp I really lust for and not another lens.

    Long live grain then!

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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Long live grain then!

    (and can i come over for a listen after you get it when i'm in your neck of the woods??? sigh! i've always lived in the most acoustically crap apartments on earth. one day....)

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    Subscriber Member TRSmith's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    You're always welcome of course!

    44.781N, 69.221W.

    Early Fall is a great time of year.

    Tim

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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    what a sweet thing! and you're telling me -- i went to Goddard for a few years.... my favourite place on earth to be at that time of year. the reds just slay me!

  23. #23
    Oxide Blu
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Helen, welcome to the dark side of photography.

    Bob casually mentioned it, let me drive the point home: STAY OUT OF THE CHEMISTRY!!!

    Or to rephrase that; STAY OUT OF THE CHEMISTRY!!!

    Metol is one of several chemicals used in photography that can cause an allergic reaction in your skin. You may not have an initial reaction, it may be delayed. But once you get a reaction it can take 20+ years to go away, supposedly. I have know several photographers with the condition, one that still had the reaction 15-years after his last contact with photo chemistry.

    You should be wearing vinyl gloves (available wherever household cleaning supplies are sold -- as a woman you prob already know that ). After loading your film, you put on your gloves BEFORE you pop open the chemistry. Make it a habit.

    Next, there is oodles of info on developing film, less on fixing it. I'm going to suggest you move to TF-4 fixer (or TF-3, if you make it yourself -- cheaper). It is good stuff, makes developing a whole lot easier and faster, both film and paper.

    TF-4 is here: http://www.photoformulary.com/Deskto...ion=0&langID=0

    They are ammoniun thiosulphate fixers, archival quality results, much higher pH (close to the developing pH) than the commonly used lower pH acid fixers. No need for stop bath, wash times are seriously shortened. Again, both for paper and film.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxide Blu View Post
    Helen, welcome to the dark side of photography.

    Bob casually mentioned it, let me drive the point home: STAY OUT OF THE CHEMISTRY!!!

    Or to rephrase that; STAY OUT OF THE CHEMISTRY!!!
    D**N, and here I thought the Inhaling & Drinking while Souping was doing Wonders for my Skin..... No Seriously I take your ADVICE to heart and DO ALWAYS wear Gloves
    I have stayed away from xtol & D76 (even though I want to use them but don't like the aspect of powders)

    Many Thanks for your Link & Advice
    Last edited by helenhill; 26th February 2009 at 04:29.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    M4 /DR Cron
    shot a few weeks back /developed this weekend...Grain & Fog

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    Member maddoc's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Helen, the first one looks great !! Very well done !! Welcome to the dark side of photography ! (... the real photography ! )

    I dunno what happened in the last one, looks a to grainy to my eyes (but could also be over sharpened after scanning ?). Rodinal ? Remember with Rodinal to keep the temperature exactly at 20 degrees Celsius or a tad below ! I usually use 19 to 19.5 degrees Celsius.

    Keep going !!

    Cheers,

    Gabor

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Hey Gabor...Hello
    I'm Embaressed to say after all your Fine Help
    The other shots and ones posted in 'more leica M Fun ' analog thread
    I followed YOUR recipe !! It was Brilliant ...THANX
    however this last shot I got spaced out and DID 1:4 instead of 1:50 /rodinal at 20 celsius

    So I killed the Film with that ratio- too strong / it was arista 400
    One would have thought neopan 1600 with all that grain
    (I DO LOVE neopan 1600 /one of my favorites )

    Don't know what I was thinking when mixing

    Best to You

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    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Helen,
    Well now you know how to get that effect :-)
    Sometimes darkroom accidents generate new techniques.
    -bob

  29. #29
    Oxide Blu
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    Re: helen's First Attempts @Developing

    Quote Originally Posted by helenhill View Post
    ... however this last shot I got spaced out and DID 1:4 instead of 1:50 /rodinal at 20 celsius

    So I killed the Film with that ratio- too strong / it was arista 400
    One would have thought neopan 1600 with all that grain

    You can get that grain without "killing" your film by using any phenol developer (like Rodinal) on a tabular grain film (like Kodak T-max or Ilford's Delta), process warm (above 20C) following the recommended dev times, and shake the crap out the tank when you agitate. No gentle agitation. Be sure to tap the tank after agitating to dislodge any air bubbles you got on the film abusing it during agitation. ISO 400 films work great, a mid-point on the graininess you are going to create. Higher ISO films produce exponentially grainier results using this developing scheme. Even ISO 100 tabular grain films can be made grainy and they have more contrast than ISO 400 and up.

    I haven't followed Freestyle's products in years, but their 'D' film was -- past tense, don't know any more -- was being made in an Ilford factory that closed, re-opened making generic film that was amazingly similar to Ilford product. At the time some folks speculated it was rebranded Ilford film. It also worked with this scheme to create grainy negs.

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