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A900 Reasons not to purchase

L

Light

Guest
I am currently using canon 1dmk3 cameras with all L lens and am considering Sony A900 cameras with Zeiss lens as replacement cameras.

However the lack of TWO recording cards with the ability to record RAW and JPEG at the same time to both cards seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in regard to moving the Sony A900.
Any thoughts would be appreciated.
(I am a professional wedding photographer)

Regards Light
 

douglasf13

New member
I agree, and although Ive been hopeful of a firmware change to this, that hope is dwindling. If there is a change, Id say it would happen when the A850 is announced, but I'm doubting it.
 

fotografz

Well-known member
I am currently using canon 1dmk3 cameras with all L lens and am considering Sony A900 cameras with Zeiss lens as replacement cameras.

However the lack of TWO recording cards with the ability to record RAW and JPEG at the same time to both cards seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in regard to moving the Sony A900.
Any thoughts would be appreciated.
(I am a professional wedding photographer)

Regards Light
Well, I know exactly where you are coming from.

Let me make a suggestion ... based on my experiences.

I WILL NOT shoot a wedding with a single card camera because I refuse to carry around two cameras at once for back-up. Being able to capture to two 16 gig CFs at once is cheap insurance against card malfunction.

As a wedding professional, assuming you are the first line shooter, perhaps think of the A900 as a suppliment. Shoot the "must haves" with the dual card camera, and portraits/candids/isolating guest from the background shots with the Sony.

I sometimes take one with me along with the dual card camera (previously a Canon 1DsMKIII, now a Nikon D3X or D3 both of which are FF and shoot to two cards). When I do that, I only take the Sony A900 with just two lenses ... the 85/1.4 and 135/1.8. All the zooms like a 14-24 and 24-70 are Nikon ...plus one fast Nikon lens just in case (like a 50/1.4 ... if it were the Canon I'd take the 35/1.4L)

Since you have a Canon 1DMKIII you have low light work covered ... the Sony isn't that great in low light when shooting on the fly like at a wedding ... and doesn't focus as fast as your Canon in low light (with the exception of when using the 85/1.2MKII-L). But for the most part the RAW files come out of the A900 camera pretty much there, and can be processed to jpgs in the PS Image Processor in just minutes. Same for Lightroom.

If you want to use flash with the A900, you can buy a converter adapter to fit Sony's propritary flash mount and just use one of your Canon flashes set on A ... works fine without buying yet another flash.

Just a thought ... you get to have your cake and eat it too ;)
 

tom in mpls

Active member
Light, is this problem "insurmountable" or is it "a time-wasting, workflow disrupting PITA"? I think the difference is more than hair-splitting, as the Sony might offer other benefits that you would consider to be major; else why would you even consider the Sony? Not being a photo professional, my point of view may be radically different from yours.

I suppose when it's your business, a "time-wasting, workflow disrupting PITA" might consitute an insurmountable obstruction.
 
The Sony A900 is a great camera, but it is a long way from perfect. I want better weather sealing and 16-bit capture, and if it is going to have two card slots, they should be the same card and you should be able to write to the cards serially or in parallel -- I have no use for redundant capture, but occasionally shoot in environments where I would prefer not to open the camera.

If you don't like the A900 as it sits today, don't buy it. There is a pretty good chance a replacement in only a few month out.

Light, is this problem "insurmountable" or is it "a time-wasting, workflow disrupting PITA"?
Bob, this is one of those things that if you have to ask you don't need it, and if you need it you have to have it. I can see this being important for wedding photographers and some journalists. For everyone else I think it is unnecessary. I would say the problem can be mitigated by downloading on the go to a suitable device (Epson, Vosonic, Colorspace), but if the card was farked at the time of capture, you now have a backup of the farked images rather than the original capture.

Everyone's needs are different and right now I am loving the A900, but about 90 percent of my photography is bright daylight, with the rest being strobed (studio or outside) or low light.
 
L

Light

Guest
To clarify I am very impressed with the pro features of the A 900 ie Resolution, Stabilisation, Zeiss lens, Viewfinder, Lack of live view and NO VIDEO.
I do not think that I can live with the risk of no backup at weddings ie only one card recording images.
Looks like the D3x of 1Dsmk3 as possible upgrades as I wish to only use one system.

Regards
Light
 

dhsimmonds

New member
To clarify I am very impressed with the pro features of the A 900 ie Resolution, Stabilisation, Zeiss lens, Viewfinder, Lack of live view and NO VIDEO.
I do not think that I can live with the risk of no backup at weddings ie only one card recording images.
Looks like the D3x of 1Dsmk3 as possible upgrades as I wish to only use one system. RegardsLight
Sony have never claimed the A900 to be a pro camera, although I know a lot of pro's do use them very successfully. Rumours are beginning to circulate about a pro A900 replacement, so it might be worth checking some of these out before discarding the Sony system altogether just yet. Always assuming that you can wait!

In fact the A900 has rather better sealing than you think......as I recently discovered from a shoot in a monsoon type downpour! There are also quite a few internet shots circulating from a Polish pro sports photographer with his A900 and Zeiss lens covered in dust from an international motor rally, in the Sahara desert I think it was. But this doesn't get over your twin card requirement.

Imagine having a twin card outfit but then your one and only camera fails with some other fault on a pro wedding shoot.......nightmares! Marc's advice above is very sound in my view.
 

douglasf13

New member
Agreed there, Dave. I'd put the A900's weather handling up there with just about any camera. I do wish the card slots had more functions, though.
 

fotografz

Well-known member
To clarify I am very impressed with the pro features of the A 900 ie Resolution, Stabilisation, Zeiss lens, Viewfinder, Lack of live view and NO VIDEO.
I do not think that I can live with the risk of no backup at weddings ie only one card recording images.
Looks like the D3x of 1Dsmk3 as possible upgrades as I wish to only use one system.

Regards
Light
Depending on your shooting style, I wouldn't underestimate Live View. At first I thought it just a gimmick, but it's proved to be a very valuable feature that I wish were also available on my Medium Format digital cameras.
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Agreed there, Dave. I'd put the A900's weather handling up there with just about any camera. I do wish the card slots had more functions, though.
Yeah, it's an odd oversight IMO given how well thought out the A900 is in many other respects. To have a second slot and limit its use to just a second card to select ... I don't need that feature to just carry a second card with me :wtf:

Maybe it was a nod to previous Sony owners looking to move up with a fist full of Sony's propritary cards?

But I thought the Canon solution was kinda dumb also making you use a SD card for the second slot (at the time SDs were way behind CFs in speed and capacity). IMO, the dual slots should be the same type ... either SD or CF.

I use two 16 gig Extreme IVs in the Nikons and rarely have to open the camera during a wedding shoot.
 
In fact the A900 has rather better sealing than you think.....
I think that it is pretty good, but until I know I can shoot in any condition without fear I will ask for better sealing. (In Jeff Foxworthy voice) "Unless your camera says "Nikonos" on it, you may need better weather sealing." Sorry guys, it's early. :D

I have also considered asking Leitax to machine a groove in the adapter for a rubber o-ring a la Canon. I saw the pictures from the Polish photographer and that was a deciding factor in my purchase as I occasionally shoot in similar conditions. I suppose this is a bit of a rant here, but there are two parts to weather sealing, the first being good seals on the camera, the second being a manufacturer that stands behind them.

Light, I hate to say it, but unless you can wait for a new camera, I think you have to go with Canon or Nikon. Buying into a system for a feature they are rumored to implement is a dangerous game. I was given the full feature list of the Canon 1DsmkIII along with vibrating sensor cleaning from someone who was/is heavily NDA from Canon in mid 2005 and told the camera would be out by October 2005. He had nothing to sell, he was excited to be getting one. Didn't happen.

Sony gets pretty attached to their proprietary formats and I think a CF slot in place of the memory stick slot will be a tough pill for them to swallow. While they are at it, ditch the Minolta hot shoe for an ISO hot shoe. I don't care if it the Sony/Minolta mount is better, the rest of the world already decided to go with the ISO shoe. Betamax was better to. Get over it and assimilate.
 

tom in mpls

Active member
To clarify I am very impressed with the pro features of the A 900 ie Resolution, Stabilisation, Zeiss lens, Viewfinder, Lack of live view and NO VIDEO.
I do not think that I can live with the risk of no backup at weddings ie only one card recording images.
Looks like the D3x of 1Dsmk3 as possible upgrades as I wish to only use one system.

Regards
Light
I see. I failed to understand that the issue is file backup. Thanks.
 

Eoin

Member
If I were a wedding photographer, 2 cameras would be an absolute minimum requirement. Dual slot writing is a nice function for added redundancy, but in 10 years of using genuine sandisk cards, I've never had an issue with any card or camera I've used. I'd feel comfortable with a couple of cameras and a pocket full of top quality cards, YMMV.
The medium format wedding photographers must be having the same concerns, can MFDB s write to 2 cards at the same time?.

Anyway, it's your reputation on the line, nothing should be left to chance.
 

dhsimmonds

New member
If I were a wedding photographer, 2 cameras would be an absolute minimum requirement.
My sentiments exactly! I am not a wedding photographer but for most shooting where it costs me money to get the shot I would take along some sort of back up system. Touching wood......I have never in nearly 10 years of digital shooting ever had a card problem but I always have a spare with me. When travelling long distances from base, I also back up to a portable hard disc.

However, I have had a digital camera malfunction big time..............and that was a Leica. Fortunately, my back up saved the day for me and I have never forgotten that one very important lesson! If something can fail, then sooner or later it will!
 
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douglasf13

New member
Well, I know exactly where you are coming from.

Let me make a suggestion ... based on my experiences.

I WILL NOT shoot a wedding with a single card camera because I refuse to carry around two cameras at once for back-up. Being able to capture to two 16 gig CFs at once is cheap insurance against card malfunction.

As a wedding professional, assuming you are the first line shooter, perhaps think of the A900 as a suppliment. Shoot the "must haves" with the dual card camera, and portraits/candids/isolating guest from the background shots with the Sony.

I sometimes take one with me along with the dual card camera (previously a Canon 1DsMKIII, now a Nikon D3X or D3 both of which are FF and shoot to two cards). When I do that, I only take the Sony A900 with just two lenses ... the 85/1.4 and 135/1.8. All the zooms like a 14-24 and 24-70 are Nikon ...plus one fast Nikon lens just in case (like a 50/1.4 ... if it were the Canon I'd take the 35/1.4L)

Since you have a Canon 1DMKIII you have low light work covered ... the Sony isn't that great in low light when shooting on the fly like at a wedding ... and doesn't focus as fast as your Canon in low light (with the exception of when using the 85/1.2MKII-L). But for the most part the RAW files come out of the A900 camera pretty much there, and can be processed to jpgs in the PS Image Processor in just minutes. Same for Lightroom.

If you want to use flash with the A900, you can buy a converter adapter to fit Sony's propritary flash mount and just use one of your Canon flashes set on A ... works fine without buying yet another flash.

Just a thought ... you get to have your cake and eat it too ;)
Marc, I have a feeling that the Sony dual memory card setup was more of an upgrade path option for prior memory stick users, and was never really considered to have dual card usages. I'm worried that there may not even be the appropriate switching hardware in the camera to enable such features in a firmware update, which would be too bad. :thumbdown:
 

fotografz

Well-known member
My sentiments exactly! I am not a wedding photographer but for most shooting where it costs me money to get the shot I would take along some sort of back up system. Touching wood......I have never in nearly 10 years of digital shooting ever had a card problem but I always have a spare with me. When travelling long distances from base, I also back up to a portable hard disc.

However, I have had a digital camera malfunction big time..............and that was a Leica. Fortunately, my back up saved the day for me and I have never forgotten that one very important lesson! If something can fail, then sooner or later it will!
It's a rare wedding photographer that doesn't have redundant gear in all respects, sometimes three. The ones that do not are either beginners, Uncle Bob that's shooting for free, or fools.

But that isn't the point. Redundancy of once in a lifetime, non-repeatable, lifestage images is the point.

Yes, if something can fail, it will .... including memory cards.
 
Marc, I have a feeling that the Sony dual memory card setup was more of an upgrade path option for prior memory stick users, and was never really considered to have dual card usages. I'm worried that there may not even be the appropriate switching hardware in the camera to enable such features in a firmware update, which would be too bad. :thumbdown:
Pure semi-educated guesswork here, but unless Sony planned for this from the outset it may be difficult to accomplish. Sure, cards can be switched via firmware but to do this right it needs to write to both in parallel. If it would require switching from card to card internally(e.g. write one, then the other) Sony may be reluctant to add this feature because of the impact on stated fps/buffer performance.

Also you have the ridiculous pricing on Memory Stick Duo cards that can keep up with the a900 to consider.

If something like this could support RAID 1 it would address the problem IMHO: http://dvice.com/archives/2009/06/compactflash-ad.php
 

Arne Hvaring

Well-known member
I have two reasons for not buying the A900: lack of live-view, this has become an essential feature for focusing precisely MF and Alt glass, and lack of tilt/shift optics, another "must" for much of my photography. Otherwise the Sony (which I used for a few days) proved itself at least as good in terms of colour and tonality as my Canon and Nikon gear, I particularly liked the open, detailed midrange with refined, subtle transitions.
For me, maybe next generation, definitely a system to watch.
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Pure semi-educated guesswork here, but unless Sony planned for this from the outset it may be difficult to accomplish. Sure, cards can be switched via firmware but to do this right it needs to write to both in parallel. If it would require switching from card to card internally(e.g. write one, then the other) Sony may be reluctant to add this feature because of the impact on stated fps/buffer performance.

Also you have the ridiculous pricing on Memory Stick Duo cards that can keep up with the a900 to consider.

If something like this could support RAID 1 it would address the problem IMHO: http://dvice.com/archives/2009/06/compactflash-ad.php
Interesting device. If that worked (1.e., shoot to cards at once), it would solve the problem pretty inexpensively.

Wouldn't the dual card camera have a split channel? I mean, take the Canon 1DMKIII that shoots 10 FPS to two cards.
 

gsking

New member
Photofast also makes a dual microSD-Memory Stick adapter that serves the same purpose. It also can do RAID, but allegedly can be used with a single card as well.

Thinking of getting one in case I need to email a photo on the fly. I can shoot it onto microSD, then send it through my cell phone.

Just in case taking the photo WITH my cell phone wasn't sufficient. ;)

Greg
 
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