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Thread: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    M4 & Helen shooting FILM


    Well, I have officially taken the Plunge
    & am shooting more Film than Digital
    there is something about Film that is just so lush & retro real....can't put my finger on it but having a BLAST
    Please Critique and feel free to make suggestions....Thanx
    BTW,this is with the M4 (1966) and I just ordered a BEAUTIFUL m2 (1963) black leathertone Paint Kenichi Abe...Yes I'm Whacked!
    Best to You-H
    Last edited by helenhill; 24th October 2008 at 16:45.

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    Subscriber Member mwalker's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    I like those shots Helen...what film are you using and how are you processing it?
    Mike

    website under construction

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Helen, *love* the grain! Is that by any chance T-Max 3200?
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Aw shucks, Helen, now you're making me think about shooting some film!

    Thanks for posting these. I agree with Jack that the grain is very cool. I was also wondering if it was T-max 3200 when I first opened the thread.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Mike,Jack,& Dale.....Thank You for viewing!!

    I used Neopan 1600 / however at some point in the roll I noticed
    my light meter was set at 3200 so my readings were OFF...
    this was done at a Lab 'Imagination' in NYC (had them develop film,contact sheet.& scan)

    I think this Sunday i am popping by B&H to buy a stainless steel reel
    play with it w/my eyes open then closed and if I get the knack will start developing just my Film for the moment and send out for Prints

    ANY IDEAS which Film I should start with (Tri X???)
    that inexpensive film ARISTA (a copy of Tri x?)

    Any suggestions.....
    Best to You-H

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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by helenhill View Post
    Any suggestions.....
    Best to You-H
    There is an endless variety of "looks" you can achieve with different film+developer combinations, but I think it is as easy to obsess about it as about megapixels, so I'd suggest simply going for any combination that you can regularly buy at your camera store, stick to it for a while and learn what you can and cannot do with it. I tend to use Fuji Across+ Rodinal (clean and sharp), but I'm not dogmatic about it and if necessary I'll shoot anything, HP5+, Tri X, whatever...

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by helenhill View Post
    Mike,Jack,& Dale.....Thank You for viewing!!


    ANY IDEAS which Film I should start with (Tri X???)
    that inexpensive film ARISTA (a copy of Tri x?)

    Any suggestions.....
    Best to You-H
    For really fine grain with good contrast and tonal separation, try Acros.

    For fine grain, good exposure latitude and general overall usability, try T-Max 400 or HP5 at ISO 400. For same as above with a more traditional grain structure, try Tri-X at ISO 320 . If you want a single all-around B&W film, I'd start by trying a few rolls of each of these and deciding which you prefer -- all are superb IMO.

    For lots of grain, try T-Max 3200 at ISO1600 but processed normally. T-grain films have a more even grain pattern than previous films, but TM3200 has a propensity to halate in high contrast lighting and can create a somewhat etherial effect.

    Also, don't rule out the chromogenic emulsions for quick turn-around 1-hour C41 minilab processing and quite good B&W results.

    Keep us posted!
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    So Beautifully Whacked Helen!

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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Fuji Neopan 400 is my preference for a great all arounder. For slightly more grain and classic pj ooomph I'll turn to Tri-X. I also shoot Fuji 1600 quite a bit these days.

    Good luck! I'm thinking about shooting more b&w film as well. In fact I'm off to Paris next week for an opening and will have my Rollei TLR along with 20 rolls of Neopan 400 and either a Sigma DP1 or an M8, though the M7 is tempting.

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    Senior Member Joan's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Oh, boy!! Tres retro and arty, Helen. Now you may get me to resurrect my old Minolta ... It sits there and stares at me, and I neglect it because I'm too lazy to buy film and find someone to process it.
    Regards,
    Joan

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    Deceased, but remembered fondly here... johnastovall's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    To me the perfect film and developer is Tri-X and one shot full strength D-76 at 68F for 7 minutes full strength.

    "The market wants a Leica to be a Leica: the inheritor of tradition, the subject of lore, and indisputably a mark of status to own."
    Mike Johnston


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    Super Duper
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Hi Helen. Nice shots. Gritty realism.

    Can't say I'm "retroing" it because I never really left film. Everytime I look at my B&W silver prints on the wall it reminds my why.

    In fact, after selling off some digital gear, the last replacement camera I got was film based. A Nikon F6 to use wih the Zeiss ZF lenses. I miss my M film camera ... and eventually will also replace that.

    I did some B&W shooting around Detroit last weekend, and am in NYC this coming weekend (my wife is running the NY Marathon.) I'll be shooting B&W film there also. When I return I'll send off all the rolls to AI in California for developing and contact sheets. (I don't have the time to process the rolls myself right now). However, I do scan my own selects.

    Using Illford HP5 PLUS rated at 320 recently. But like all of them in some way or another.

    Here's a great resource for films and information on each one of them:

    http://www.freestylephoto.biz/c402-B...hite-Film-35mm

    If you are going to get into processing your own films take a look at this one which has a very high silver content like the films used in the 1950s:

    http://www.freestylephoto.biz/191364...xp.?cat_id=402

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    So Cool Everyone
    THANK YOU...... xoxoxoxo hugs & kisses

    I will order from FREESTYLE !!!!
    getting a few ROLLS of: TMAX- TRIX- & EFKE

    I must be absolutely MAD .....
    to be doing Film w'this economic downturn/possible looming Depression
    but what an opportunity to be Drunk on Life & fixitive and to document it

    Best-H

  14. #14
    asabet
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Helen these are great! I love shooting with my old Olympus OM-2N. I can't get that nice grain since I'm shooting C41 B&W, but I still enjoy the process and results of shooting film.

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    Super Duper
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Hey Helen, the last Depression was documented on film ... why not this one? :-)

    $1.99 a roll and a few bucks for chemicals ... not really that much more because the prints cost the same.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Hey Helen, the last Depression was documented on film ... why not this one? :-)

    $1.99 a roll and a few bucks for chemicals ... not really that much more because the prints cost the same.
    Well actually the only roll for $1.99 is Arista /supposedly a great trix copy
    All the other film ranges from $3.99 & up
    BTW thanx soooo much for the efke suggestion
    lokked at shots under efke at best of flickr....Lovely Dreamy Ethereal Film but does have sharpness / Cool
    H

  17. #17
    nei1
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Helen, thats a great start!Now youve tried the grainy side of life it might interest you to see the other side of the coin.Ive not used this for a while but kodak technical pan and its developer(comes as a liquid in a glass vial)will blow your socks off in the quality stakes.Not sure if its still available though but maybe there are alternatives .Its worth seeing just to appreciate what 35mm film is capable of and if you make a large (very)print the grain that it has is stunning,gradation etc,but you do need its own special developer.
    As for the stainless steel spiral ,I might start with a plastic one,there a bit easier to load.Good luck_________ Neil.

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    Senior Member simonclivehughes's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Very nice, Helen! Funny, I can't help thinking that if you'd posted them without saying that they were film, that you would have had a flurry of replies about how horrible the noise performance of your camera is.

    Ciao,

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    ThanK YOU !! Amin. Neil & Simon

    Amin: I agree Film is Great
    for me it makes me see differently

    Neil: I will ask about for the Kodak technical pan /Is that the proper term-name?

    Simon: loved your noise thought
    isn't it Funny how it can drive some people mad digital or film
    and YES turn up the VOLUME on Noise

    helen

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    Super Moderator Cindy Flood's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Helen,
    What is a "and I just ordered a BEAUTIFUL m2 (1963) black leathertone Paint Kenichi Abe...Yes I'm Whacked!"? (I know what an M2 is, but the rest I don't know about????)
    Congratulations on your exploration of film. I enjoyed these shots and am looking forward to more.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by Cindy Flood View Post
    Helen,
    What is a "and I just ordered a BEAUTIFUL m2 (1963) black leathertone Paint Kenichi Abe...Yes I'm Whacked!"? (I know what an M2 is, but the rest I don't know about????)
    Thank you....
    Its a tres chic & very hi end black paint finish /leathertone paint kenichi abe
    HOWEVER now i am having second thoughts & debating with Igor (the seller)
    whether to get an m3 and Wetzlar Cron for the same amount as opposed to a collectors trinket
    Just received today from Igor a mint /1950 summitar w/two filters green & yellow

    Best to You Cindy

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    Deceased, but remembered fondly here... johnastovall's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Helen,

    Go with the M3 and 'Cron....

    "The market wants a Leica to be a Leica: the inheritor of tradition, the subject of lore, and indisputably a mark of status to own."
    Mike Johnston


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    Subscriber Member mwalker's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by helenhill View Post
    Just received today from Igor a mint /1950 summitar w/two filters green & yellow

    Best to You Cindy
    Damn Helen....you're my hero
    Mike

    website under construction

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    Super Moderator Cindy Flood's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Hi Helen. ... When I return I'll send off all the rolls to AI in California for developing and contact sheets. ...

    I usually just use C41 and have the lab develop the film. I scan in the keepers myself. I would like to know more about AI in California and their services. Would you please give me more information, Mark? Thanks.

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    Super Duper
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by Cindy Flood View Post
    I usually just use C41 and have the lab develop the film. I scan in the keepers myself. I would like to know more about AI in California and their services. Would you please give me more information, Mark? Thanks.
    B&H sells pre-paid mailers. I've learned to NOT send the individual packets through the mail. The Post Office likes to lose them. Better to box a bunch and send them off for processing.

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/shop/3...g_Mailers.html

    Oh, while grabbing that URL for you Cindy, I saw B&H also has mailers for Agfa Scala ... I haven't used that for a looooong time. So I will order 2 rolls and 2 mailers. It's a B&W slide film.

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...nal_Black.html

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...35mm_Agfa.html
    Last edited by fotografz; 28th October 2008 at 17:39.

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    Super Moderator Cindy Flood's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    There is a lot of good info in this thread and I appreciate it.

    Thanks, Marc. I will give the AI lab a try.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Here are Two more shots....
    400 TX /shot @the Pre Fab Exhibit / Museum of Modern Art
    Neopan 1600 / shot @ Coney Island Carousel

    I have just ordered EFKE : Normal & Infared /which Marc 'Fotografz' highly recommended...THANK YOU again Marc
    Quite excited about this Film because of the high silver content .... which creates A truly Superb atmospheric feel / Can't wait
    Last edited by helenhill; 9th November 2008 at 16:32.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    neopan & coney island shore

  29. #29
    nei1
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Helen, the first is terrific,well done!
    Now you really must try developing your own film, its a revelation.The very slow and high speed films are very specialized and are best maybe left until later ,triX is the king(queen)of films,it will do almost anything.Having said that Ill be very interested in the results you get with the efke films as Ive not tried them.
    ______________ good luck ,best regards,Neil
    Last edited by nei1; 10th November 2008 at 00:00.

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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Helen, you are very brave. If I would go this way it would make me a better photographer for sure.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Thank you Neil & Gero.....for Ya Support & Generous thoughts
    Best xo-H
    Last edited by helenhill; 11th November 2008 at 15:27.

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    Super Moderator Cindy Flood's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Helen, It is fun to see you having so much fun. I am going to be watching for your report and photos on the EFKE.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Another m4 shot-neopan1600

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    Senior Member emmawest72's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Helen,
    Really dig those dark tones.

    William

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    Senior Member ecliffordsmith's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Hi Helen,

    I like those images a lot. The first one especially so. I love the way film is kind with highlights.

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    Subscriber Member mwalker's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    If you're going to process your own film how do you start...what do you need? I have a Nikon 5000 scanner.......
    Mike

    website under construction

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by mwalker View Post
    If you're going to process your own film how do you start...what do you need? I have a Nikon 5000 scanner.......
    Well I took Marc's/fotografz suggestion to shop @ FREESTYLE
    and they have a kit Arista Starter Kit $55.99
    the whole shabam...cylinder vessel.developer tank,thermometer.two clips. squeegee, stainless steel reels etc
    as well as bought a Developer bag $21.99
    The hard part is DECIDING DEVELOPER
    I can't decide between Rodinal (lots of Hipsters/TRI X users FAVOR
    ILford DD-X (abit more expensive) but also Coool
    here is where I LOSE MY MIND...decisions,decisions

    Roger Hicks & his dear wife Frances have a Lovely site
    www.rogerandfrances.com
    which has a wonderful 35 & 120mm Developing Tips
    Roger has it down to 21 to 27 minutes for developing /not film drying time
    with the Ilford developer
    so that might sway me
    plus I don't want a powder developer /too much waste & breathing dust

    On RFF.com there are wonderful threads on various Souping techniques for your modest to whacked out B&W developing.
    YES I know Blasphemy mentioning another site...but I do LOVE my GETDPI & Friends
    Just received my Film from Freestyle yesterday /Arista Premium & Efke
    Perhaps in a week I will have my developer & will be doing the film thing
    and then just having a lab scan for me & make GRANDE prints

    So now besides Poisoning myself as a Decorative Artist
    I will continue with more Toxins in developing film...

    Cheers- xo-H

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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by charlesphoto View Post
    I'm off to Paris next week for an opening and will have my Rollei TLR along with 20 rolls of Neopan 400 and either a Sigma DP1 or an M8, though the M7 is tempting.
    Sounds great! Tell us about your show and do show us some of your pics when you return!!

    All the best,

    Irenaeus

  39. #39
    Zeiss
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    Quote Originally Posted by helenhill View Post
    Rodinal
    Rodinal
    Kindermann tank
    Hewes steel rolls

    Neopan 100 acros
    APX 100
    Neopan 400
    TriX

    Diafine for using TriX @1000

    That's all I use. Happy with it.
    Mostly using stand development with Rodinal, because I am lazy.
    1:100, 60 minutes, agitate for 30 sec, stand, agitate for 15sec after 30 minutes - that's it. Temp doesn't matter. If you forget time, doesn't matter. It develops to exhaustion. In the meantime I can browse photo stuff... actually, I am developing right now

  40. #40
    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    ZEISS:

    well Thank You for your Tips
    Very Much Appreciated

    Best-H

  41. #41
    Subscriber Member TRSmith's Avatar
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    Re: M4 & Helen shooting FILM

    I have some somewhat foggy but pleasant memories of Rodinal. Very nice developer. A few things come to mind in terms of its care and handling which may or may not still be true. The concentrate came in a bottle with a rubber stopper (way back then!). We used to use a long hypodermic needle and syringe inserted thru the rubber stopper to extract the required amount thus avoiding exposure to the air and extending the life of the valuable liquid. And, wash your hands well, it's a harsh chemical mix that contains Phenol. Also, there's a trick using two-stage development with a water bath between that can yield some yummy results if you have the patience and plan for it.

    Good luck!

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