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Negative Feedback and Lesson Learned

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glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
Twice in the past two weeks have been screwed by two members of GETdpi (asiafish and viablex1) with long established recorded of positive participation . They both made WTB requests and I just happened to have what they were looking for . We agreed upon a price and terms . They offered and I excepted . Because in one case I was out of town and in another home with a temp of 100 ....we agreed that I would photograph ,send PayPal invoice and ship. date specific ..only 2-3 days out .

They both agreed and indicated no problem with the agreement . After photographing the lens and packaging I made contact ..preparing to ship next available day (monday ).

I get a message back ...I found a better deal and went with it . Asiafish ever pointed out how happy he was the other lens !

WTF ....in my book this isn t OK .

I wonder how they would feel if I said I found another buyer (after I had promised the lens ).

Asiafish and Viablex1 .....GFY. :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
 

rollei8is

Member
Twice in the past two weeks have been screwed by two members of GETdpi (asiafish and viablex1) with long established recorded of positive participation . They both made WTB requests and I just happened to have what they were looking for . We agreed upon a price and terms . They offered and I excepted . Because in one case I was out of town and in another home with a temp of 100 ....we agreed that I would photograph ,send PayPal invoice and ship. date specific ..only 2-3 days out .

They both agreed and indicated no problem with the agreement . After photographing the lens and packaging I made contact ..preparing to ship next available day (monday ).

I get a message back ...I found a better deal and went with it . Asiafish ever pointed out how happy he was the other lens !

WTF ....in my book this isn t OK .

I wonder how they would feel if I said I found another buyer (after I had promised the lens ).





Asiafish and Viablex1 .....GFY. :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

I had a similar experience. i sold a piece of camera gear, he paid me by Paypal. I shipped the item by UPS and then he turns around and says he found a better deal and wants tho cancel the transaction.( within half hour of the UPS picking up the package).
The item was at UPS loading docks in Phoenix and was able to retrieve the item before it left the city, and return the buyers money.
I had to spend half a day in retrieving the package. All this for nothing.

R----
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
I had a similar experience. i sold a piece of camera gear, he paid me by Paypal. I shipped the item by UPS and then he turns around and says he found a better deal and wants tho cancel the transaction.( within half hour of the UPS picking up the package).
The item was at UPS loading docks in Phoenix and was able to retrieve the item before it left the city, and return the buyers money.
I had to spend half a day in retrieving the package. All this for nothing.

R----
When I sell something I bend over backwards to be sure the buyer is satisfied . I had a Leica M8 that had problems 6 months after the original sale ..onto a 2nd buyer . Problem with the sensor wasn t caught by me or the original buyer ...we agreed it was probably there from the beginning . I paid $700 and the original buyer paid $700 to make the new owner whole .

When you commit to a buy ....people rely on your word .

I am really disturbed that this happened twice on GETdpi from long time members . :wtf:
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
Speaking of which, did you ever get the Cube Case? I also care about good transactions.

--Matt
I did Matt ..been out with cold since I got back from my trip . Case was a very nice gift ..hope I am in a position to return the gesture .

Roger
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
My point is that you should not require anything other than a “promise” . The amounts are so small in most cases that there is really no recourse . When someone posts a WTB and makes an offer ..followed by agreement on terms and conditions ..pictures,payment method ,shipping and timetable .....thats a handshake in my book .

Sure things come up ..in my case I was out off town and the other home sick as a dog . In both cases we agreed upon the timetable (a few days ) and was told no problem . To throw that out because you might find a better deal is unacceptable behavior . :thumbdown:

Both the sellers mentioned thought it was perfectly OK that they went with a better offer and saw absolutely nothing wrong with backing out of the deal . No one likes to feel slighted in the process and I am not happy .
 

Robert Campbell

Well-known member
This happens when buying a house in England (but not Scotland or N Ireland). A price is agreed, but the seller then gets and accepts a higher offer. It's called 'gazumping'; it is not illegal in England.
 

jdphoto

Well-known member
If you didn't list these items specifically for sale, then I'm not sure why this is such a big deal. Perhaps the potential buyer should've asked if you could match the better price, if not, let it go. Also, this should be posted in the feedback section.
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
...I'm not sure why this is such a big deal.
Says more about you than the thread.

One's word for centuries represented a contract ... between seller and buyer. Has been honored on this site
since I joined.

Integrity is demonstrated when it exacts a cost ... foregoing a better deal because you have committed to
the present one. Or paying for a new sensor months after the sale.

Not sure what the lesson learned is here ... there will always be individuals who justify their immoral economic
behavior. Nice to identify them.

Thanks for the heads up.

God ... feeling older by the day.

I hope that you can find someone who will appreciate your ethic and integrity Roger.

Regards,

Bob
 

viablex1

Active member
Says more about you than the thread.

One's word for centuries represented a contract ... between seller and buyer. Has been honored on this site
since I joined.

Integrity is demonstrated when it exacts a cost ... foregoing a better deal because you have committed to
the present one. Or paying for a new sensor months after the sale.

Not sure what the lesson learned is here ... there will always be individuals who justify their immoral economic
behavior. Nice to identify them.

Thanks for the heads up.

God ... feeling older by the day.

I hope that you can find someone who will appreciate your ethic and integrity Roger.

Regards,

Bob
Does anyone in this sausagefest actually understand how comnerce wotks.

Any buyer is allowed to change their mind thats not immoral thats reality.

I do thinks its bull to buy something let the seller pay for something then put it all back on the seller.

I think the real issue here is its a,sore spot for some reason heck i dont know why

Also dont be so greedy to sell something unless you can close the deal
 

jdphoto

Well-known member
One's word should be a valuable consideration. A deposit would have sufficed as a commitment and show good faith negotiations going forward. . Unanticipated events such as deadlines or pricing should be considered for WTB items if more than one person responds to an ad. Ideally, it would have been nice for the potential buyers to honor the sale, or at least negotiate a new price, but does it merit the value of tarnishing a forum member(s) reputation for being prudent? I once sold a Rolleiflex 3.5F that had sticky shutters and the buyer complained albeit, respectfully. I offered to have him send it to Harry Fleenor for a complete CLA on my cost. I had no obligation to do so because it was an "as is" sale, but because the buyer was respectful and grateful, he now has an almost new Rolleiflex. Moral integrity intact.
 

MGrayson

Subscriber and Workshop Member
On a trading desk, where deals worth hundreds of millions of dollars happen regularly, the moment someone says "Done", the deal is binding. That's why trading desk lines are recorded.

Anything else is dishonest.

--Matt (Yes, I was an options trader)
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
Does anyone in this sausagefest actually understand how comnerce wotks.

Any buyer is allowed to change their mind thats not immoral thats reality. put it all back on the seller.
Sounds like your view of the world and ethics may differ from the OP and many of us.

Glad that you have the imprimatur of NW Law ... the paradigm of moral ethics.

Enjoy your new new thing and glide past this somewhat uncomfortable social point.

I imagine that my OT tutor from Oxford would be less than satisfied with your logic.

Just sayin ...

And it is a new new world ... God help us.

Bob
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
Does anyone in this sausagefest actually understand how comnerce wotks.

Any buyer is allowed to change their mind thats not immoral thats reality.

I do thinks its bull to buy something let the seller pay for something then put it all back on the seller.

I think the real issue here is its a,sore spot for some reason heck i dont know why

Also dont be so greedy to sell something unless you can close the deal
Your are proving my exact point ...a distorted view of ethical behavior . The sore spot is that you totally don t understand the issue . When dealing with established members of a community ...you should expect that both parties are trying to work together to create a successful transaction . The win win concept to state it plainly . I trust members of this community to treat me fairly ..trust is the key element . My dealings with both you and Asiafish proved to be unsatisfactory and I was caught by surprise at the callous manner you defended backing our of our arrangements.


We agreed upon on the details ....price,terms , TIMETABLE etc . I explained that being quite sick I needed a few extra days to bill and ship . You agreed and indicated you would be out of town in any event so no problem. There was no greed involved ...I don t need the money and I sure don t need the bull I received from you . You gave your word that we had a deal and you argue that an email is not a contract ? That finding a better deal is a valid reason to “change your mind” ..then you comment “when you snooze you lose” .

The sore spot should be obvious .....I spend an hour finding the lens, photographing it: for you and intending to send you an invoice .....only to find out I wasted my time so you could what ...save a few $ . The whole deal was $840 .

Hopefully you now have the reputation you earned .

In fairness I did tell you to Go F*** Yourself...which in this case I feel fully justified in expressing .
 

BANKER1

Member
In my forty-two years of banking, I saw fluid ethics at play every day. In my latter years of work, I gave the following example to first-timer borrowers. The example was the fact that one's word should be sufficient to be morally binding in all cases. However, a promise or handshake is an even greater moral responsibility. Finally, a signature becomes the highest moral binding one can offer. More often than I like to remember, all three examples were breached regularly. But, toward the end of my career, I was still able to make decisions based on my optimistic view that there were still many men of honor on whom I could rely. It seems that the optimism I showed is more and more shown to be at odds with current trends. Sadly, when it comes to money, rationalization and contortion tends to be more and more of a trend. So sad.

Greg
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
I think the real issue here is its a,sore spot for some reason heck i dont know why

Also dont be so greedy to sell something unless you can close the deal
To a certain extent I get your concern ... but this is not the wild west.

Actually a small community of like minded individuals who strive to lift up each other and
appreciate if not authenticate their attempts at art.

Not eBay ... not Amazn ...

So if you play by NW Law rules ... may find yourself without a core group ... may not matter to you.

Honestly,

A genuine apology to the seller that you have found something closer to your heart ... would work wonders.
As it is you have reneged on a promise and then blamed the other party.

Imagine that his ire would be mollified with a simple "Sorry, forgive my transgression."

You can integrate into this community or distance yourself ... your call ... and invoking your wife's training, expertise
may not be that helpful.

Find a better forum on the web ... not likely.

Discernment is not a license to judge ... just an opportunity to intercede.

Hope you both can find a resolution to this ....

Bob
 

algrove

Well-known member
All excuses aside from non-buyers, I know 2 users here that I will not communicate with since I know all I need to know about one of them from comments made in this very thread.
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
Hmm, perhaps it was more instinctive than actual reasoning on the potential buyers end. Reading these responses i'd say this belies something more than just sour grapes.
You may be correct ... it is either a Ship of Fools or a community of committed individuals lifting each other up.

I prefer the latter ... and have to say I don't have a dog in this race.

Regards,

Bob
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
Apologize for the run on ...

Roger ... I do not even attempt to sell anything at this point ... time to move it I send it to Sean at CameraWest.

Been doing this for 18 years ... the small difference in price is not worth the angst or disappointment. And CW has
never disappointed me.

One phone call ... done.

Let them buy it at retail ...

Bob
 

JohnBrew

Active member
I was born and raised in West Texas where a man's word was his bond. Moved to Dallas in the early 70's and had an interesting experience with reality. Nothing new under the sun...
 
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