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Thread: September 2014

  1. #1
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    Question September 2014

    So what do you think is coming from our dear friends at Canon?

    How can they keep so quiet and not let any info slip out, surely there are demo's out in the field testing. Human nature demands weakness, regardless of any signed legal documents...

    What do you think?

    Better yet what have you heard?
    Ciao,
    Giorgio Niro
    www.giorgioniro.com

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    Re: September 2014

    The silence is very worrying.

    I suspect no info leaks is probably due to nothing exciting to announce.

    I want a D800/810 competitor from Canon but don't think they have the chip yet.

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    Re: September 2014

    My opinion, based on anonymous sources who got their information from anonymous sources, is that there will be no new pro camera this year. However, a replacement for the venerable, but slightly flawed 100-400 is a real possibility.

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    Re: September 2014

    Here's an interesting rumor. A medium format camera from Canon at Photokina.

    Rumors: Canon Medium Format Camera to be Announced for Photokina | Camera News at Cameraegg

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by GlenC View Post
    Here's an interesting rumor. A medium format camera from Canon at Photokina.

    Rumors: Canon Medium Format Camera to be Announced for Photokina | Camera News at Cameraegg
    I've heard this one before, but find it hard to believe. Why would Canon want to enter that market. If true, I imagine they would have an adaptor of some kind for their existing lenses. If not, there are going to be a lot of unhappy people.

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    Re: September 2014

    Possibly they would have a new line of lenses, with enough coverage for the larger sensor and better optics for the higher res sensor.

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    Re: September 2014

    I don't think Canon will use / buy sensors from a 3rd party.

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    Re: September 2014

    Who knows, maybe they'll throw the towel.
    As camera market shrinks, it increasingly becomes harder to invest in new sensor technologies.
    After all, Canon never was interested in film making. As I can recall, the only major camera manufacturer to make film was Fuji, besides Kodak one hundred years ago.
    Perhaps the ultimate battle for sensor supremacy will be between Sony and Fuji.
    Eduardo


    Quote Originally Posted by alajuela View Post
    I don't think Canon will use / buy sensors from a 3rd party.

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    Re: September 2014

    I still have a great deal of affection for Canon products and hope they do well in the coming years.

    I successfully used the Pro Canons for many years shooting weddings and events, and in many ways miss some of the fast aperture L lenses to this day.

    Frankly, when the 1DX was announced, I thought it looked to be the perfect camera for everything up to major studio work (which I had a MFD to cover).

    After all theses years and numerous experimentations with this camera and that camera (currently I'm a Sony shooter), I've found that for all practical purposes, it has all been a huge waste of money and time learning new ergonomics and buying do-dads for a different system.

    IMO, it is a product of internet popularity contest and pixel peeping mentalities that has so many people in its grip, that perfectly fine gear is tagged with being "obsolete or inadequate" when the opposite is the reality.

    My lighting assistant and second shooter just bought a Canon 6D and a few Canon lenses including the 85/1.8, and while processing his work along with mine, I was struck by how his images technically met or exceeded those from my Sony A99 and A7R especially high ISO available light work.

    In retrospect (hindsight always being 20/20), I should have stuck with Canon and I'd have a lot more money in my pocket today, and the work would not have suffered one little bit.

    My 2 (which is about all I have left after swapping systems a couple of times)

    - Marc
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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    ....
    I successfully used the Pro Canons for many years shooting weddings and events, and in many ways miss some of the fast aperture L lenses to this day.
    .....
    - Marc
    Wasn't it you who said once you hated the waxy skintones of the Canon files? LOL

    But when we look back everything is painted in pink, isn't it?

    In any case your use of so much gear plus the way how you shared your experience gave at lot to be apprecheated on the online photogarphy forums.

    Thanks a lot for this.

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by T.Karma View Post
    Wasn't it you who said once you hated the waxy skintones of the Canon files? LOL

    But when we look back everything is painted in pink, isn't it?

    In any case your use of so much gear plus the way how you shared your experience gave at lot to be apprecheated on the online photogarphy forums.

    Thanks a lot for this.
    Yes, "Waxy" that was me. Just to be clear, I felt that way about almost all CMOS sensor cameras then now there are some with weaker or no AA filters.

    Yes again, hindsight is always rosier than at the time however, I am reminded on a daily basis of a fruitful relationship with Canon cameras because my wedding samples are peppered with images shot using Canons, which are some of my best. Or, perhaps I was just better back then

    Here's a trip down memory lane don't even remember which Canon camera it was, nor do I think it is specifically an example of technical excellence but this wedding is one of many reasons why I look back with fondness on my Canon days: (Please give it time to load, and turn ON your speakers!)

    Wedding Slide Shows to Music - fotografz

    - Marc

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    In retrospect (hindsight always being 20/20), I should have stuck with Canon and I'd have a lot more money in my pocket today, and the work would not have suffered one little bit.

    My 2 (which is about all I have left after swapping systems a couple of times)

    - Marc
    Marc,

    I am not a pro but went as well through numerous camera system changes during my whole life, including MF (Hasselblad analog and digital) and Leica including R9DMR - exactly same is true - it did not improve my work/output but just costed me tons of money and many hours of adopting to the new systems - far too much even for a passion.

    Having said that in the end I also enjoyed using these different systems, I stuck more with Nikon than Canon but there was no real reason fro that other than my dealer (friend) is mainly a Nikon shop. But I many times lusted after the Canon L glass and the one I used (1.2/85, 2.8/16-35, 2.8/70-200) was just stellar and at least as good as the Nikon pendents. And actually when the 1DX came out I was almost tempted to switch again, finally I stayed with Nikon. And the advantage is meanwhile - hand whatever camera of whatever brand to me and I will be in control of this new beast pretty shortly. Does it improve my photography? NO?

    Many times I feel sorry I did not buy back into an M240 for my M glass (which I kept and will keep forever including my analog M's), as the simplicity of this camera (concept) is (and has always been) a relief in our photography times. And actually the new MP digital is very tempting for me - I know this is maybe GAS again, but in my age I may not change anymore, only get slower

    I also wish Canon and Nikon good luck for the future, but given their ignorance of mirror less I feel other brands might take over.

    So you might go back to Canon? just kidding

    Peter

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Marc,

    I am not a pro but went as well through numerous camera system changes during my whole life, including MF (Hasselblad analog and digital) and Leica including R9DMR - exactly same is true - it did not improve my work/output but just costed me tons of money and many hours of adopting to the new systems - far too much even for a passion.

    Having said that in the end I also enjoyed using these different systems, I stuck more with Nikon than Canon but there was no real reason fro that other than my dealer (friend) is mainly a Nikon shop. But I many times lusted after the Canon L glass and the one I used (1.2/85, 2.8/16-35, 2.8/70-200) was just stellar and at least as good as the Nikon pendents. And actually when the 1DX came out I was almost tempted to switch again, finally I stayed with Nikon. And the advantage is meanwhile - hand whatever camera of whatever brand to me and I will be in control of this new beast pretty shortly. Does it improve my photography? NO?

    Many times I feel sorry I did not buy back into an M240 for my M glass (which I kept and will keep forever including my analog M's), as the simplicity of this camera (concept) is (and has always been) a relief in our photography times. And actually the new MP digital is very tempting for me - I know this is maybe GAS again, but in my age I may not change anymore, only get slower

    I also wish Canon and Nikon good luck for the future, but given their ignorance of mirror less I feel other brands might take over.

    So you might go back to Canon? just kidding

    Peter
    Pro use or not, the experiences are valid Peter.

    IF (a big IF), I were to continue shooting weddings and events at the rate I used to, I'd say the Canon 1DX and select L glass would be my first choice as a perfect camera for such fast paced and demanding work. At this stage, it is highly unlikely. What is more likely is jettisoning most of my DSLR/SLT type camera gear as I wind down this type of work and get more selective of which ones I'll do.

    RE: Mirror-less: I've been using a Sony A99 for over two wedding seasons now, and a A7R for almost a year (including a number of events). While I like some aspects of EVFs, and have adapted well to using them, I don't like it. It was a big adjustment at first, and while I do grasp all the advantages and put them to good use, it has done absolutely nothing to improve my work. Nothing. If anything, the process attached to EVFs just gets in the way. Had Sony advanced the A900 but kept the OVF, I'd be shooting that now.

    There are other little things that make certain systems work and other get in the way. Something as small as how fast you can remove and replace a rear lens cap can be a bigger deal than most would expect. I could change Canon lenses 4X as fast as I can with the Sony.

    Besides, it is all a moot point. I'm way out of budget to be swapping systems. I committed to the Leica S system some time ago, and THAT has had a big influence on my work because it acts as a DSLR for most work, the lenses are the best that a LOT of money can buy, and it doubles as a leaf shutter camera for use with strobes (where the S excels over all 35mm cameras and has made a huge difference in the diversity and quality of my work).

    Size of camera is way down my list of criteria. The only time I want really small is when I really don't care about image over convenience or I'm shooting more serious decisive moment stuff for which the Leica M Monochrome is overwhelmingly my weapon of choice (the camera that replaced my analog Ms which rarely if ever saw color film.) But even the MM has gotten less use these days as I get better and better with the S camera. Every time I think of selling the MM I pick it up and feel the promise is oozes. Not sure if it is nostalgia, or a true reminder of what I should be doing rather than what I have been doing.

    Thanks for sharing your experiences,

    - Marc
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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    the Leica M Monochrome is overwhelmingly my weapon of choice (the camera that replaced my analog Ms which rarely if ever saw color film.) But even the MM has gotten less use these days as I get better and better with the S camera. Every time I think of selling the MM I pick it up and feel the promise is oozes. Not sure if it is nostalgia, or a true reminder of what I should be doing rather than what I have been doing.

    Thanks for sharing your experiences,

    - Marc
    Yes, the M Monochrom is magical.
    "A fella, A quick fella, might have a weapon under there. I'd have to pin his head to the panel." The Gyro Captain

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by asiafish View Post
    Yes, the M Monochrom is magical.
    I don't want a play toy M camera or a CMOS S camera that Leica seem totally confused about what it is judging by the announcement that the latest 100mm f2 won't have a CS version. I just want a Canon body with great IQ, pixel density and DR to at least rival the Nikon/Sony stuff but with Canon ergonomics, focusing, live view and above all access to all the Canon glass I own......

    Every time I punish myself by looking at the 'Fun with D810' thread and seeing how great it looks just makes me wonder what the hell are Canon playing at?
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    Re: September 2014

    While looking on the net I stumbled across a site called Canon Rumours and what struck me is how little activity there is regarding (as the site title suggests) Canon rumours.

    Seems rather strange just a few days before Photokina opens?

    I remember before the 1Ds3 launch there was lots of info bouncing around about it so has Canon locked down its R&D department or is the D810 rival still months and months away (2015 or even Photokina 2016)

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    I don't want a play toy M camera or a CMOS S camera that Leica seem totally confused about what it is judging by the announcement that the latest 100mm f2 won't have a CS version. I just want a Canon body with great IQ, pixel density and DR to at least rival the Nikon/Sony stuff but with Canon ergonomics, focusing, live view and above all access to all the Canon glass I own......

    Every time I punish myself by looking at the 'Fun with D810' thread and seeing how great it looks just makes me wonder what the hell are Canon playing at?
    What surprises me is so many reviews look at higher ISO IQ as an important factor, but everybody criticizes Canon DR, which is worse than Nikon at 100 and 200 ISO, but better than Nikon at ISO400 and up. Add a better AF system and you have the 5dIII.

    Nothing against the Nikon D810, but IMO the 5dIII is still one of the best compromises between speed, size, low and high ISO IQ.

    So if one wants to shoot Canon lenses, just get a 5dIII or 6d or 1dx and shoot right away.

    Personally I am glad not every brand jumps on the hype of shorter and shorter product cycles.
    Just my opinion.
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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by Paratom View Post
    Personally I am glad not every brand jumps on the hype of shorter and shorter product cycles.
    I bought my 1Ds3 in December 2007?

    Canon has the market pretty much covered with sports/action cameras but their studio camera which they were alone with for many years in making is now 7 years old. Like you said there is plenty of choice for high ISO, great AF sport cameras in the Canon range however a 36Mpix camera is not what I would consider a sports camera and a big gap in Canons range.

    IMO, there is no denying that at lower ISO's, Canon can't touch that Nikon D810.

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    I bought my 1Ds3 in December 2007?

    Canon has the market pretty much covered with sports/action cameras but their studio camera which they were alone with for many years in making is now 7 years old. Like you said there is plenty of choice for high ISO, great AF sport cameras in the Canon range however a 36Mpix camera is not what I would consider a sports camera and a big gap in Canons range.

    IMO, there is no denying that at lower ISO's, Canon can't touch that Nikon D810.
    Already the D800 and D800E were superior in lower ISOs. Albeit the overall ergonomics of a 5D3 could never be touched by any Nikon.
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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Albeit the overall ergonomics of a 5D3 could never be touched by any Nikon.
    Yes, I have no desire to own a Nikon other than that chip as I really like my Canon's but having both 1DS3 and 5D2 I see no reason to upgrade (?) to a 5D3.

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    Yes, I have no desire to own a Nikon other than that chip as I really like my Canon's but having both 1DS3 and 5D2 I see no reason to upgrade (?) to a 5D3.
    AF would be the main reason for me
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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    AF would be the main reason for me
    Yes, never thought of the 5D3 focus improvements, a worthy upgrade over the 5D2 however, 95% of every shot I take is with a TS-E......

    Now don't get me started on the 45mm TS-E replacement.

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    Yes, never thought of the 5D3 focus improvements, a worthy upgrade over the 5D2 however, 95% of every shot I take is with a TS-E......

    Now don't get me started on the 45mm TS-E replacement.
    If I would switch to Canon again, it would be the 5D3 for me without any doubt. One of the best cameras ever designed!
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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    While looking on the net I stumbled across a site called Canon Rumours and what struck me is how little activity there is regarding (as the site title suggests) Canon rumours.

    Seems rather strange just a few days before Photokina opens?

    I remember before the 1Ds3 launch there was lots of info bouncing around about it so has Canon locked down its R&D department or is the D810 rival still months and months away (2015 or even Photokina 2016)
    Just to keep this thread going so Canon gets some band-width here

    I wonder how much Canon is driven by marketing events like Photokina verses events like the Olympics? Wasn't the 1Dx launched just prior to the 2012 Summer Olympics? I seem to recall that as a launch pattern, verses the various marketing events.

    I'll tell you one thing, be careful what you wish for. I've found that the drive for ever better Dynamic Range has added huge amounts of Post time. Okay for those fiddling around with a few images, but a real PITA for people like me who push through 1,000+ files per week-end shooting weddings. I hated my Nikon D3X because of that.

    - Marc
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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    I'll tell you one thing, be careful what you wish for. I've found that the drive for ever better Dynamic Range has added huge amounts of Post time. Okay for those fiddling around with a few images, but a real PITA for people like me who push through 1,000+ files per week-end shooting weddings. I hated my Nikon D3X because of that.
    What is the issue that adds so much more time in post?

    With regards to events like Photokina I always thought Canon did what the hell they want like pulling out of shows they've lost interest in to releasing cameras (1ds3) when they were ready (August 2007?) rather than wow crowds at shows.

    And now I see the 7D2 announcement /specs I think that Sony A7R is looking ever more likely to be in my hands before the end of the year.
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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by gazwas View Post
    What is the issue that adds so much more time in post?

    With regards to events like Photokina I always thought Canon did what the hell they want like pulling out of shows they've lost interest in to releasing cameras (1ds3) when they were ready (August 2007?) rather than wow crowds at shows.

    And now I see the 7D2 announcement /specs I think that Sony A7R is looking ever more likely to be in my hands before the end of the year.
    In my experience some cameras tuned for, or capable of, greater dynamic range tend to produce flatter files out of camera. This is great for more shot-to-shot consistent lighting scenarios and/or lower volume shooting where additional time in post is not an issue.

    For me (and many other wedding/event or higher volume shooters), where shot-to shot lighting can vary significantly it can mean a lot more time in post to produce consistency across 500 to 1,000 images at a crack.

    Presets can help, but in reality the huge spread of lighting scenarios I deal with makes it far less effective than one may think.

    In most cases, the amount of images in "real need" of greater dynamic range is quite low, so while the initial flatter files help in a few cases, they caused significant additional attention for the vast majority of remaining shots.

    When I switched from the Nikon D3X to a Sony A900 which used the same 24meg FF Sony sensor, my PP time was instantly cut in half. While I love my Leica M Monochrome, the files are notoriously flat and require individual processing of every shot to extract the full potential, usually in Nik Silver-Efex Pro which is slow going when you have 300 B&W shots to wade through.

    IMO, Canon has always done a decent job of balancing between dynamic range and reasonably easy PP files. In past Canon has been the overwhelming system of choice for wedding/event and higher volume shooters. Whether they still are is a matter of conjecture, but most wedding, sports, and auto racing pals of mine still shoot Canon.

    Different strokes for different folks.

    - Marc
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    Re: September 2014

    i think the 5D has become extremely popular , especially for shooting video with a still camera. would expect Canon to focus on that model

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    Re: September 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    In my experience some cameras tuned for, or capable of, greater dynamic range tend to produce flatter files out of camera. This is great for more shot-to-shot consistent lighting scenarios and/or lower volume shooting where additional time in post is not an issue.
    I shoot a lot of interiors and quite like that flat look. I just wish I didn't have to use a Sony with a crappy adapter to get it......

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