Site Sponsors
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 61

Thread: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Week before last there was an exhibition in the UK - Focus 2009.

    It was mentioned here a couple of times.

    On the Hasselblad stand we had three professional models with makeup and stylist. Customers were invited on the stand to shoot with an H3D31, take a look at their own images in Phocus and then walk away with a Sandisk 2GB card and a copy of Phocus with our compliments.

    We had just released a firmware upgrade on the H3DII31 to increase the ISO by one stop and improve the overall noise levels at higher ISO.

    I attach one of my own images and a couple of crops. They have been retouched (If you hadn't guessed) or she really would have been blessed with perfect skin.

    Ill see about some RAW files being hosted next week, so just JPEGs for now.

    Best,



    David

    PS. Lighting was overhead HMI's and a touch of H pop-up flash!

    PPS. Lens was the 100mm at f4.8 (Somebody say they didn't perform at larger apertures?)
    Last edited by David Grover / Phase One; 8th March 2009 at 09:29.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Mmmm.. color looks a bit washed out in Safari?

    Not sure if the forum module does something color-management wise but I will try re-upoading in sRGB.

    D

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    1,513
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    David,
    I was just looking at them in Safari, and they did not look washed out to me....but then I do not know what your intentions were.

    Thanks for sharing these. From the brief glimpse I got, things looked pretty good at ISO400. Would be interested in seeing anything that may have been pushed a bit further, realizing that the setting will probably be kind to most captures, anyway (good light always helps any ISO if you get the exposure correct) ;-)

    And, if you care to share, just how much skin retouching did you do? Looks pretty smooth, which is great for the model and maybe the client, but you know us critical pixel peeping idiots that want to see the detail....good, bad or ugly ;-)

    LJ

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    860
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    76

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    David,
    I am not seeing the image. Did you take it down?

    Mark

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Hi LJL,

    Seems the saturation is a bit lacking. Most likely human error on my part!

    Anyway, I guess it gets the point across. I changed one of the crops to the metal necklace as its quite good for detail.

    Ill dig out the 'before' so you can see how much I did. ;-)

    Exp Comp was on 0 in Phocus, so not much adjustment. The only thing done was white balance and some USM. Rest is out the box settings.

    David

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Gowin View Post
    David,
    I am not seeing the image. Did you take it down?

    Mark
    Should be back now!

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    And one with no retouching...

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    860
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    76

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Thank you for the images and the crops. They look very clean.

  9. #9
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    David we would all love to see the new firmware high ISO stuff for sure. If anyone you know has some test please ask them to post them for us. Thanks Guy
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    1,513
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    David,
    Thanks for reposting and adding the unretouched crop. The images do look pretty clean and holding good detail. This is good. I really wish Hasselblad does release more info and samples and the updated version for folks to play with and test. I downloaded Phocus v.1.1.3 for the other shots to view corrections and stuff, but it sure would be nice seeing some more things that are taken at the higher ISOs and being able to play with things.

    Keep 'em coming. Good to see these much less expensive advancements coming from the manufacturers as they keep working on things.

    LJ

  11. #11
    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Austria, close to Vienna
    Posts
    3,872
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by David Grover / Hasselblad View Post
    Week before last there was an exhibition in the UK - Focus 2009.

    It was mentioned here a couple of times.

    On the Hasselblad stand we had three professional models with makeup and stylist. Customers were invited on the stand to shoot with an H3D31, take a look at their own images in Phocus and then walk away with a Sandisk 2GB card and a copy of Phocus with our compliments.

    We had just released a firmware upgrade on the H3DII31 to increase the ISO by one stop and improve the overall noise levels at higher ISO.

    I attach one of my own images and a couple of crops. They have been retouched (If you hadn't guessed) or she really would have been blessed with perfect skin.

    Ill see about some RAW files being hosted next week, so just JPEGs for now.

    Best,



    David

    PS. Lighting was overhead HMI's and a touch of H pop-up flash!

    PPS. Lens was the 100mm at f4.8 (Somebody say they didn't perform at larger apertures?)
    Thanks for this sample! It shows in a very convincing way the quality which can be achieved with that "only 31MP back" and that "very bad 100mm lens"

    Anyway, thanks for sharing and it proves I am on the right way if I move to the H System

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Fort Collins, Colorado
    Posts
    2,077
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    man I don't know who is dissing the Hassy 100 2.2. I find it one of the best. Perhaps not a Zeiss 100 2.0 but not far off.

    Woody

  13. #13
    Workshop Member Woody Campbell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    2,120
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    66

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    man I don't know who is dissing the Hassy 100 2.2. I find it one of the best. Perhaps not a Zeiss 100 2.0 but not far off.

    Woody
    The Woodys of the world need to stick together on this - I see no issues at all with this lens, which I use a lot - it is one of my all time favorites. To my eyes it out resolves the 39m back probably with some headroom I'm mainly a wide shooter but I've been using it to stitch some pretty big, and really remarkable, files.

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    man I don't know who is dissing the Hassy 100 2.2. I find it one of the best. Perhaps not a Zeiss 100 2.0 but not far off.

    Woody
    Hi Woody(s),

    Its been knocked a few times on the Leica thread, but I imagine not by anyone using the lens as your remarks represent the people who have bought and enjoy using it.

    David

  15. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Thanks for this sample! It shows in a very convincing way the quality which can be achieved with that "only 31MP back" and that "very bad 100mm lens"

    Anyway, thanks for sharing and it proves I am on the right way if I move to the H System
    Thanks Peter,

    I rarely hear any user say anything but complimentary about the 100 2.2

    David

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,338
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    52

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Thanks David - especially for posting the un retouched crop.

    Regarding the 100/2.2 - those of us who own it and use it- have always sung its praises. It holds its own very well against my favourite - 110/2 - and it has autofocus a great lens.


    Cheers
    Pete

  17. #17
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    I imagine that I am the one who is described as "knocking it". Or at least one. I have never tried it, so I can only go by what others have said, and no one should take my criticism of the lens too seriously.

    However, here is food for thought: if the 100/2.2 is the spiritual successor of the brilliant 110/2, then why does the 110/2 remain the favorite, as expressed by several who have tried both? 25 years of knowledge bought what, exactly?
    Carsten - Website

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,338
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    52

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Carsten - the Zeiss 110/2 was made to shoot on 6x6 film negative wether on Hasselblad cameras or on Rollie mount cameras. This is a pretty simple and obvious factoid.

    The HC 110/2,2 was made to shoot on a 645 format NOT a square. It also has autofocus capability and is part of an integrated digital solution which Hasselblad (wether you like it or not) has delivered to the marketplace. For its intended purpose - the 110/2,2 is an outstanding lens -as testified by those who actually own and use it. This is another simple factoid.

    Hope this helps.

  19. #19
    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Austria, close to Vienna
    Posts
    3,872
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    man I don't know who is dissing the Hassy 100 2.2. I find it one of the best. Perhaps not a Zeiss 100 2.0 but not far off.

    Woody
    Woody, there have been these dissing comments about this H lens in some other threads about S2 and Leica glass.

    I find this lens outstanding! And BTW I am not a MTF curve aficinado although I understand the importance of MTF charts, but I rather go after the final result in the photo in order to judge a lens.

  20. #20
    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Austria, close to Vienna
    Posts
    3,872
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    I imagine that I am the one who is described as "knocking it". Or at least one. I have never tried it, so I can only go by what others have said, and no one should take my criticism of the lens too seriously.

    However, here is food for thought: if the 100/2.2 is the spiritual successor of the brilliant 110/2, then why does the 110/2 remain the favorite, as expressed by several who have tried both? 25 years of knowledge bought what, exactly?
    Do not understand why some people still have the 110/2 as their favorite, especially as this one cannot be used to full potential on the H cameras. Maybe if you use it on an H1 with film back, the lens can be better. But definitely not on an H3D2 with digital back, there the 2.2/100 is far ahead.

  21. #21
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post
    Carsten - the Zeiss 110/2 was made to shoot on 6x6 film negative wether on Hasselblad cameras or on Rollie mount cameras. This is a pretty simple and obvious factoid.

    The HC 110/2,2 was made to shoot on a 645 format NOT a square. It also has autofocus capability and is part of an integrated digital solution which Hasselblad (wether you like it or not) has delivered to the marketplace. For its intended purpose - the 110/2,2 is an outstanding lens -as testified by those who actually own and use it. This is another simple factoid.

    Hope this helps.
    I presume you mean 100mm for the HC lens, not 110.

    In any case, just so I understand you right, 25 years of R&D then bought a shorter lens with a smaller max aperture, with autofocus and electronic communication. Yet people who own both still pick the ancient 110/2 as their favorite, and only say that the 100/2.2 compares well?
    Carsten - Website

  22. #22
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Do not understand why some people still have the 110/2 as their favorite, especially as this one cannot be used to full potential on the H cameras. Maybe if you use it on an H1 with film back, the lens can be better. But definitely not on an H3D2 with digital back, there the 2.2/100 is far ahead.
    Ah, far ahead? So, this is interesting, finally. In what way is it far ahead (ignoring the obvious AF and electronic communication)?

    By the way, I own the 110/2 and have never even seen the MTF chart for it, so I am most certainly talking about final results.
    Carsten - Website

  23. #23
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    The only way to tell Carsten, is to pick up and shoot with one and form your personal opinion, good or bad.

    David

  24. #24
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    154
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Very nice picture and I'm sure the model is more than "happy" with the sharpness of the lens...
    This "noise" seems similar to the noise we get from 800ASA (1600ASA is already worse) of the D3X. This is a 4 years old Kodak-sensor and it's time that certain myths (MFDB only usable below 100ASA, my Nikon/Canon is noiseless up to 5000ASA...) are destroyed...

    Here is the data sheet of the Planar:

    http://www.zeiss.de/C12567A8003B8B6F/EmbedTitelIntern/Planar2_110mm_FE_102188_d/$File/Planar2_110mm_FE_102188_d.pdf

    These lenses are certainly not bad stopped down, but sophisticated designs in the 35mm-world have clearly shown that much better open aperture performance is possible.

  25. #25
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    3,623
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    I havent analysed any data sheets but so far I have to say that I really like what I get with the 110/2.0
    Maybe its not designed for digital or an old design or whatever, i like it.
    As long as I like what I see I dont even care if its a little better or a little worse than a Hassy 100/2.2 or whatever.
    And I assume its the same for any H3D-user with the 100/2.2

  26. #26
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,338
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    52

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    I presume you mean 100mm for the HC lens, not 110.

    In any case, just so I understand you right, 25 years of R&D then bought a shorter lens with a smaller max aperture, with autofocus and electronic communication. Yet people who own both still pick the ancient 110/2 as their favorite, and only say that the 100/2.2 compares well?
    Carsten - do yourself a favour and re -read what I wrote and after you have done that - spare me your attitude - you are coming across like a dense troll.

    The reason why many people use an F/FE 110/2 is that they were designed to give coverage for a 6x6 film. Do you know what this means? It means I can put one of these on a 205TCC and shoot film. It can be used via adaptor on many focal plane bodies. They are great lenses - delivering a lovely OOF rendition similar to my 75 lux, similar to the 85/1.2: and the 80 1.4 R - all of which I either own or have used extensively.

    The reason I own a 100/2.2 is because I can use this lens on an H body. H bodies are designed to shoot 645 film or similar in digi. It has a leaf shutter. It cant be used on a focal plane body. It has much higher strobe sync than the 100/2 it is auto focus it communicates directly to the electronics and software system which delivers DAC corrections. It also delivers a beautiful out of focus smooth bokeh. It is a great lens.

    How difficult is this for you to understand? Do you 'get' the difference now? I don't answer for what other people say to you or think or have read or have heard or quote - I could care less. I only ever speak from my own direct experience about gear. To be frank there are very few people whose opinion I respect or even care to listen to about anything to do with gear - everyone has a different take on everything - all the time - that is the nature of individuality.

    If I were you I would stop worrying about 'opinions' stop quoting 'opinions' and start testing these things for yourself.

    Now if you wish to find out for yourself - rather than making up nonsense or carrying on like a typical internet troll - go rent a body and back and the lens and find out for yourself.


    Good Luck you will need it.

  27. #27
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by t_streng View Post
    I havent analysed any data sheets but so far I have to say that I really like what I get with the 110/2.0
    Maybe its not designed for digital or an old design or whatever, i like it.
    As long as I like what I see I dont even care if its a little better or a little worse than a Hassy 100/2.2 or whatever.
    And I assume its the same for any H3D-user with the 100/2.2
    Absolutely yes.

  28. #28
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterA View Post
    Carsten - do yourself a favour and re -read what I wrote and after you have done that - spare me your attitude - you are coming across like a dense troll.

    The reason why many people use an F/FE 110/2 is that they were designed to give coverage for a 6x6 film. Do you know what this means? It means I can put one of these on a 205TCC and shoot film. It can be used via adaptor on many focal plane bodies. They are great lenses - delivering a lovely OOF rendition similar to my 75 lux, similar to the 85/1.2: and the 80 1.4 R - all of which I either own or have used extensively.

    The reason I own a 100/2.2 is because I can use this lens on an H body. H bodies are designed to shoot 645 film or similar in digi. It has a leaf shutter. It cant be used on a focal plane body. It has much higher strobe sync than the 100/2 it is auto focus it communicates directly to the electronics and software system which delivers DAC corrections. It also delivers a beautiful out of focus smooth bokeh. It is a great lens.

    How difficult is this for you to understand? Do you 'get' the difference now? I don't answer for what other people say to you or think or have read or have heard or quote - I could care less. I only ever speak from my own direct experience about gear. To be frank there are very few people whose opinion I respect or even care to listen to about anything to do with gear - everyone has a different take on everything - all the time - that is the nature of individuality.

    If I were you I would stop worrying about 'opinions' stop quoting 'opinions' and start testing these things for yourself.

    Now if you wish to find out for yourself - rather than making up nonsense or carrying on like a typical internet troll - go rent a body and back and the lens and find out for yourself.


    Good Luck you will need it.
    My god Peter, you are accusing me of attitude, but look at what you just wrote! FWIW, here is the original sentence from you which made me wonder about the 100/2.2:

    "It holds its own very well against my favourite - 110/2 - and it has autofocus a great lens."

    In other words, you prefer the 110/2. This made me question 25 years of development. Nothing more. I am not interested in putting the lens down personally as I don't know it, and likely never will because I have little interest in an H system. I was simply left scratching my head after you posted the above.
    Carsten - Website

  29. #29
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Los Altos, CA
    Posts
    10,486
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1031

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Easy boys -- remember we're all friends here...

    Have a Hendrick's martini and make up
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  30. #30
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    California/Thailand
    Posts
    1,206
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Is it too early for Hendrick's?


  31. #31
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Yes, pops. I'll be nice. And I adore my 110/2.
    Carsten - Website

  32. #32
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    All this talk of Hendrick's has gotten me all curious. In the past I haven't liked gin much at all. Actually, I've pretty much hated it. Then again, I have only tried Beefeater and others of that ilk. Is this very different?

    http://www.hendricksgin.com/uk/about/index.asp
    Carsten - Website

  33. #33
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    I stick with Vodka. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  34. #34
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    Yes, pops. I'll be nice. And I adore my 110/2.
    End of the day that is all that matters is you get the look you like. Look at some old glass like a Mamiya 80 .19 which is 200 dollars and softer than a cotton ball but it has a look and character that some love. Bottom line image.

    For example I will pick on Kurt here he has shot some really nice stuff with it and recently switched I think to a 110 Zeiss or something like that .
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  35. #35
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Kurt switched? I thought he really liked his 80/1.9.
    Carsten - Website

  36. #36
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Yea he bought one used on the Buy and Sell and I think he like the Zeiss better which I am sure is the better lens anyway
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  37. #37
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    The Zeiss does have awfully creamy boke, so if that is what he is after, I could understand it.
    Carsten - Website

  38. #38
    Subscriber Member KurtKamka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    1,232
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    26

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    I actually still have both.

    I have one copy of the 80/1.9 that is wonderfully sharp wide-open. It's been a go-to lens for a lot of shots ... especially in low-light conditions. I keep thinking I can't possibly like the lens as much as I do as it cost me less than $200. For the most part it has very smooth bokeh. Every once in awhile, however, it throws out some funky swirly bokeh that catches you by surprise ... like it has a mind of its own.

    I also picked up the later N version of the 80/1.9 about two months ago to see if I could see if there was any difference in characteristics between the two versions. The latter version is a bit softer than my first sample. I really can't tell the difference between the two lenses except that this sample seems to offer a little bit more saturation. I have this copy of the lens for sale on the buy and sell forum.

    About a month ago, I bought a used 110/2 from David Farkas on the buy and sell forum. Although, I'm still learning the ins and outs of the lens, I really like it ... especially the consistent, buttery smooth bokeh. Like others have mentioned in the past, it has an 80lux or 75lux look to the images it produces with the caveat that the colors are a bit less saturated than either of those two Leica lenses.

    The focal length between the 80/1.9 and 110/2 is enough for me to want to keep both. In addition, the color, contrast and bokeh are dissimilar enough for me to find ways to use both.

    Kurt

  39. #39
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    I have heard that the 110/2 also has some, erm, interesting boke once in a while, although I haven't seen it yet myself. How do the two compare in look? They sound similar.
    Carsten - Website

  40. #40
    Senior Member yaya's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    London, UK
    Posts
    1,168
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    38

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    The Zeiss does have awfully creamy boke, so if that is what he is after, I could understand it.
    110mm/f2 @ f4.5, 1/60th handheld and fairly high iso...one of my favourite lenses. It's sharp where you want it to be sharp, partly because it (and the waist level finder) are so bright.

    Yair Shahar | Product Manager | Phase One | Mamiya Leaf
    e: [email protected] | m: +44(0)77 8992 8199 | yaya's blog

  41. #41
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,338
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    52

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Carsten I dont give a toss how many times you scratch your head. Clealry there is some kind of comprehension issue going on. You have NOT replied ONCE to any simple substantive point that was repeatedly made to you. Instead more smarty pants pedantry and selective quoting - typical trol behaviour.



    I

  42. #42
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Well, I *am* Danish, and there were trolls there once, although the two 'l' variety. What did you want to ask again? I got lost last time.
    Carsten - Website

  43. #43
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Los Altos, CA
    Posts
    10,486
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1031

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    All this talk of Hendrick's has gotten me all curious. In the past I haven't liked gin much at all. Actually, I've pretty much hated it. Then again, I have only tried Beefeater and others of that ilk. Is this very different?

    http://www.hendricksgin.com/uk/about/index.asp
    It's way more delicately flavored than the typical British gins. Most of my friends who "didn't like gin" now have a bottle in their cabinets And it is so delicate vermouth, an olive or an onion will kill it; maybe a gentle twist would be okay, but not a squeeze, and definitely a slice of cucumber is the perfect garnish. If I am out of cucumber, I drink it straight, bone dry and shaken to very cold and imagine the cucumber

    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  44. #44
    Workshop Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Brooklyn
    Posts
    4,043
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1253

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    i used to drink plymouth gin, now it's boodles...maybe i'll try that hendricks. must have something to do with keeping my angst under control. try it straight with a couple of cubes and a splash or two of angostura bitters, something i picked up from travis mcgee

  45. #45
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Hmm, I'll have to try it then. I'll keep an eye out for it in my favorite store. Shouldn't be too hard to find, given the number of decent scotches they have.
    Carsten - Website

  46. #46
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Los Altos, CA
    Posts
    10,486
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1031

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by jlm View Post
    i used to drink plymouth gin, now it's boodles...maybe i'll try that hendricks. must have something to do with keeping my angst under control. try it straight with a couple of cubes and a splash or two of angostura bitters, something i picked up from travis mcgee
    John:

    I read all the Travis McGee's -- and *used* to drink my Tank or Sapphire with a dash of bitters. But the Hendricks is too delicate even for a small dash of the pink
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  47. #47
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Los Altos, CA
    Posts
    10,486
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1031

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    Hmm, I'll have to try it then. I'll keep an eye out for it in my favorite store. Shouldn't be too hard to find, given the number of decent scotches they have.
    It's in a squattish, very dark brown or possibly sepia-black bottle
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  48. #48
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    PeterA, I just went back and carefully re-read everything that you wrote, and discovered that I missed nothing.

    The difference between 6x6 and 645 is, to me, irrelevant, because I use my 110/2 on both a Hasselblad 2000FC/M and a Contax 645, i.e. the one lens covers both formats. Apart from that, the only differences you list amount to electronics and flash sync, neither of which interest me, since I don't use flash and prefer manual focus.

    To be honest, I have no idea why you got so upset in the first place. David Grover seems to have taken my post in the way intended. My original comment was a slightly flippant remark, and I wasn't expecting anyone to really take it seriously, and I especially wasn't expecting anyone to feel mortally wounded, get all wound up, and start calling me a troll.

    My stance is simply to be slightly underwhelmed that it took Hasselblad 25 years to slightly worsen the specs of a lens, and to add a dab of electronics. Nothing more.

    If you hold my opinion in such low regard, I don't even know why you bother with an ad hominem attack on me. Why not just ignore me? That's what my friends do.
    Carsten - Website

  49. #49
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    561
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    My stance is simply to be slightly underwhelmed that it took Hasselblad 25 years to slightly worsen the specs of a lens, and to add a dab of electronics. Nothing more.
    Slightly worsen the specs?

    Please take a look at the MTF graphs again (not that they particularly interest me).

    Are we going to quibble over f2 to f2.2? Really?

    A 'dab' of electronics would include...

    A completely new electronic shutter with a massive increase in accuracy. (holds a number of patents)
    In Lens AF Drive motors with instant switch over to manual
    Aperture dependant Focus Correction


    David

  50. #50
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    carstenw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,530
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: H3DII 31 - 400ISO Sample

    Oh dear. Et tu, Brute? I only ever meant it as a flippant remark, and really don't understand why people are getting so upset instead of just skipping over it. Okay, since I respect you a great deal, I will try to go along.

    - Since I said "slightly", I think f2 vs. f2.2 is allowable. I never said it was significant, just that it is there. Also, 100/110 is quite short for a portrait lens, yet the characteristics of both lenses make them very interesting exactly in this field. Hasselblad shortened an already short portrait lens. Slightly. Those two factoids were all my comment was about. Nothing deeper than that. It was really not meant as an insightful, helpful, deep comment.

    Continuing...

    - You mention that the shutter of the HC100/2.2 is massively improved. Presumably, you don't mean over the Zeiss 110/2... This is a non-issue for me, and keep in mind, what I write is just my opinion. Both the cameras I use for my 110/2 are focal plane.

    - AF, well I don't use it, so I will skip this.

    - Aperture dependent focus correction: well, that sounds very nice. I am in no position to say whether either lens needs this, nor whether the difference made by this is significant, so I will just leave this point. I tend to shoot mine wide open or stopped down to f/4 or f5.6, so I may avoid any nasty issues. I also don't have a high-res DB so I may not see the potential problems in my lens.

    This leaves just the question of MTF. Now, the 110/2 is kinda like the Noctilux or the 75 Lux/80 Lux in that these lenses are a bit soft wide open, while still appearing quite sharp, and also in that they are somewhat legendary.

    I personally consider it a complete failure to understand what is going on when manufacturers (Hasselblad and Leica here) go in and *sharpen* a slightly soft lens, when this slight softness is exactly what people love! As I understand from PeterA and others, the 100/2.2 still has enough of this look left that it is similar to the 110/2, so that sounds great. Still, everyone I have heard of who have compared the two and have preferred one over the other has picked the 110/2. I am sure that they are very similar, but why do manufacturers feel compelled to change something which doesn't need changing??? In this case, I understand that Fuji needed to replicate the performance of the Zeiss lens, so that H owners could also use it, but they still chose to make specific changes and these were simply not requested by users of the old 110/2. Leica has done the same with the Noctilux and they have even dropped the 75 Lux and 80 Lux completely, with no replacement. What goes on inside the decision rooms of these companies that results in such a fundamental failure to understand this segment of their customers?

    So in the end, improving the MTF of a lens like is bizarre. Not every lens has to be sharp, and people love these lenses so because they are not clinical. They have real mojo, real character. In other words, a slight improvement in the MTF is a slight failure to give people what they want. I am sure that there are people who swear by this lens, especially those who have never used the 110/2, but those who have tried both still seem to pick the 110/2 as their favorite, not the 100/2.2.

    And so, I hope that this explains my opinion, and yes this is only my opinion on the matter, with sufficient clarity, and that there is no need for anyone to get further upset about it. Can we just move on, please?

    Quote Originally Posted by David Grover / Hasselblad View Post
    Slightly worsen the specs?

    Please take a look at the MTF graphs again (not that they particularly interest me).

    Are we going to quibble over f2 to f2.2? Really?

    A 'dab' of electronics would include...

    A completely new electronic shutter with a massive increase in accuracy. (holds a number of patents)
    In Lens AF Drive motors with instant switch over to manual
    Aperture dependant Focus Correction

    David
    Carsten - Website

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •