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Thread: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

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    Senior Member douglasf13's Avatar
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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    I would imagine that using the thumb to trigger a shutter would increase the chances of shake, because it is probably the more stable of the digits to hold the camera, no?

    That being said, a very popular way of holding the NEX-5 is with the camera at sternum level, arms braced to the side, ldc flipped up, and thumb on the shutter release. I shoot like this all of the time.

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    Subscriber Member Jorgen Udvang's Avatar
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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    What I never understood with new designs like the Sony and Minolta posted above, is why they didn't come with adjustable angle grip. In many ways, I find the grip angle of videocams much more ergonomic than on traditional style DSLRs etc. My feeling is that it's more conservatism than actual search for the optimum solution that dictates the shape of still cameras.

    Unfortunately, the most innovative camera with regards to ergonomics lately, the Hy6, is caught up in a jumble of bankruptcy and intellectual rights. That's an attempt that I would really have liked to succeed.

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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    Interesting idea about the video camera-type grip. FWIW, the lens portion of that Sony pictured does swivel, so you could get the grip a little more horizontal.

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    Re: New Designs

    Quote Originally Posted by m3photo View Post
    Or just the one hand.
    Besides, since Panasonic can come up with touch-sensitive LCD's, others could surely keep the traditional shutter button and offer an alternative thumb-press option on the back of or next to the LCD where the thumb falls naturally when gripping a small camera at arm's length. Ergonomically, this firm grip is considerably lessened by having to then curve the index finger above the top edge and lightly press the traditional shutter button.
    This is one of the aspects of modern digital camera design flaws that I am absolutely astounded at.
    I'm not sure if you were saying the Panasonic implementation was good or in the wrong spot but I do like both the touch focus and touch shooting on the G2/GH2/GF2.

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    Re: New Designs

    Quote Originally Posted by m3photo View Post
    Or just the one hand.
    Haven't the "usual" camera makers realized that people with phone-cameras just hold it out in front of them and fire the shutter with their thumb?. ...
    I've seen probably a dozen different takes on thumb, palm, etc located releases. None work as well as a top mounted or top-forward mounted release for an eye level camera, for me at least.

    Alternative release locations, for when you're holding the camera a different way, do make sense.

  6. #56
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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    What I never understood with new designs like the Sony and Minolta posted above, is why they didn't come with adjustable angle grip. In many ways, I find the grip angle of videocams much more ergonomic than on traditional style DSLRs etc. My feeling is that it's more conservatism than actual search for the optimum solution that dictates the shape of still cameras. ..
    With the Sony F505/707/717/828, the body swiveled with respect to the lens so you, in effect, did have an adjustable angle grip (at least for making horizontal exposures).

    Conservatism does have a lot to do with it too. Listen to how many people on this forum moon and swoon over the X100's "classic" control layout ... They want their shutter on the top, aperture and focus on the lens, dammnabit, and nothing else! ;-) The fact that it works well becomes almost secondary after a little bit.

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    Subscriber Member Jorgen Udvang's Avatar
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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    Conservatism does have a lot to do with it too. Listen to how many people on this forum moon and swoon over the X100's "classic" control layout ... They want their shutter on the top, aperture and focus on the lens, dammnabit, and nothing else! ;-) The fact that it works well becomes almost secondary after a little bit.
    And of course, it does work rather well. Like a bicycle. Every time I see some inventor along the road with his (it's always a him, women don't waste time trying to re-invent the wheel) revolutionary bike that in just a couple of month will, at least in theory, outsell all traditional bikes with a huge margin, traditionalist me thinks: Aren't we supposed to sit on top of the bike, not under it?

    So maybe the current design of cameras do work best in our conservative hands after all

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    Senior Member m3photo's Avatar
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    Re: Panasonic Design

    Quote Originally Posted by TEBnewyork View Post
    I'm not sure if you were saying the Panasonic implementation was good or in the wrong spot but I do like both the touch focus and touch shooting on the G2/GH2/GF2.
    In fact I was congratulating them and offering them as the only example so far. I see it works for you.
    I'm still with my trusty G1, but then again I use it up to my eye. I'd like an alternative shutter press on my S90 though.

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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    And of course, it does work rather well. Like a bicycle. Every time I see some inventor along the road with his (it's always a him, women don't waste time trying to re-invent the wheel) revolutionary bike that in just a couple of month will, at least in theory, outsell all traditional bikes with a huge margin, traditionalist me thinks: Aren't we supposed to sit on top of the bike, not under it?

    So maybe the current design of cameras do work best in our conservative hands after all
    Hi Jorgen
    Don't you think that these kind of design changes are incremental and evolutionary rather than revolutionary? (to keep the bike metaphor going). Bikes have changed - there used to be uprights / racing bikes, and now there are also mountain bikes.

    I think camera design has changed as well, small advantages gradually become universal - If you look at cameras from 20-30 years ago there was no bulge on the right for your hand for instance (and even the retro X100 has this). AF has gradually become the rule rather than the exception etc.

    I don't think it's so much that we're conservative, more that BIG changes inevitably get some things wrong, whereas incremental changes may simply be improvements. Piecemeal Camera Engineering as Mr Popper might have had it

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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    Don't you think that these kind of design changes are incremental and evolutionary rather than revolutionary?
    Jono, some changes cannot be incremental. For instance, there is no way the body style could change gradually from the standard rectangular prism shape to a pistol grip design. The only way to go from A to B is via a "revolutionary" change. I hope manufacturers are spending some design money to explore possible "revolutionary" designs. BTW I am not advocating that a pistol grip would be a superior design; I really don't know.

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    Senior Member m3photo's Avatar
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    Re: Pistol Grip

    Quote Originally Posted by tom in mpls View Post
    BTW I am not advocating that a pistol grip would be a superior design; I really don't know.
    I do. The minute you take it out of the bag you'll have all manner of "anti-terrorist" paranoiacs jumping on you - the photographer as it is is already an instant suspect for these people.

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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    Quote Originally Posted by tom in mpls View Post
    Jono, some changes cannot be incremental. For instance, there is no way the body style could change gradually from the standard rectangular prism shape to a pistol grip design. The only way to go from A to B is via a "revolutionary" change. I hope manufacturers are spending some design money to explore possible "revolutionary" designs. BTW I am not advocating that a pistol grip would be a superior design; I really don't know.
    Having used pistol grips with several cameras (Rolleiflex TLR, Hasseblad, Mamiya 1000TL, Nikon F3 w MD-4, Linhof 120/220 press, etc), I'd say that such designs address a niche use and are somewhat bulky and clumsy in general for still camera operation.

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    Re: Pistol Grip

    Quote Originally Posted by m3photo View Post
    I do. The minute you take it out of the bag you'll have all manner of "anti-terrorist" paranoiacs jumping on you - the photographer as it is is already an instant suspect for these people.
    Added to which, pointing something which resembles a gun is really not the best way to make them relaxed!

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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    OK then, the pistol grip is a bad idea. (Maybe it works great, but I had never considered this other problem.) I'll await other, safer, revolutionary designs.

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    Re: Fuji Finepix X100 Show Report

    Quote Originally Posted by TechIV View Post
    I just pulled the trigger (although I imagine it will take a while).

    On a another note, I don't even look at the DPReview forums if I can help it... it's like a bunch of whiny children over there. Fred Miranda is decent, but this form is easily one of the best on the web.
    I think I need to spend more time over here. I always forget to come over to these civilized forums, and then I see posts or e-mail from Terry and I'm reminded that there are much nicer forums and people than the ones at DPR. There are great people over there too, but so much cr** to wade through. After 10+ years over there it's hard to break the habit.

    Great conversations going on here about the X100. Looking forward to getting mine, especially after the more recent videos and posts with the performance and higher ISO images.

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