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Let's get some things straight RE: Condition

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Well said Dan. Bottom line use common sense , report issues. We are doing our best or at least try really hard. If I had a way to limit users post to 100 before they could use this section. I would use that button faster than I could blink. Problem is there is no button. LoL
 

weinschela

Subscriber Member
Dear Vobluda, I am not sure what you mean and even qualified by adhering to the rules of the B/S forum (whose prime rule is caveat emptor), as an "emptor" I would have lots of "caveat" about buying anything if your view of condition varied dramatically from Daniel's list. What is it about the list that you disagree with?
 
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Erik Five

Member
Seeing how many camera systems most of the users have here I would guess that 95% have the proper equipment to take som fair shots of their equipment. If new is spotless, you tell about the spots thats there, which wouldnt be there if it was new in box. If you cant see a big scratch on the front element or a paint chip on a lens you should probably get another hobby IMO.
 

Anders_HK

Member
NEW = in the box, unused, as you would get it from a shop, no exceptions.

MINT = looks LIKE NEW, no marks other than fingerprints, functions like NEW.

EXCELLENT = a couple of VERY light signs of use, maybe a little dust between elements, but nothing visible without a bright light shining through. No brassing. Functions perfectly.

USER = brassing/marks on the body, no deep (deforming) dents or gouges. maybe light faint cleaning marks. Functions very well with no problems.

UGLY = deep gouges in body, scratches that may affect image quality, possibly fungus, functioning. Maybe missing large sections of leatherette.

FOR PARTS/AS-IS = not functioning, serious scratches/dents/marks. ANYTHING from a smoking environment.

If anyone disagrees please let me know but I am SICK AND TIRED of buying things online described as MINT, MINT- or EXCELLENT++ only to find out they're more like USER or even UGLY in some cases. I'm at wits end. I think I'm going to happily pay the premium to buy used items from a store in future. Mods please move if I didn't post it in the right place :)
Daniel,

I agree, it is important with genuine. At same time it is difficult to adopt a specific standard to describe since all will likely not follow. I am also unsure that a used shop will be more fair.

It is important in my opinion to be cautious when buying, to ask questions, study images of item, and... from regulars in forums, or on Ebay only from people with good ratings. All of which lends to gather an opinion to proceed or not.

In my opinion a fair deal is one made in honesty. As a seller I am among the ones who genuinely meticulous describe any blemish and find importance to describe accurate. That is important as means for a fair deal. And if as seller I make sure buyer is happy, then I will have no complaints. Simple :). The funny thing is that my two best condition items (80/1.9 and 45D) from my Mamiya condition remain for sale after having posted for sale for a couple of months... It is funny to point that perhaps people even at times doubt when described correct and in fine condition as I stated... that people buying also find difficult to trust what is fair and correct. Honesty works both ways, and I have also rejected selling when encountered buyers that appeared difficult such as doubting even when I stretched out and showed fair and honest. In any business that is good, fair and honest is important, and both ways.

Happy to do business with anyone on such terms. Anywhere.

Best regards,
Anders
 

Vobluda

New member
I dont have a single problem with the list but there are two bosses here and they should set the rules. Not the mob.

Dear Vobluda, I am not sure what you mean and even qualified by adhering to the rules of the B/S forum (whose prime rule is caveat emptor), as an "emptor" I would have lots of "caveat" about buying anything if your view of condition varied dramatically from Daniel's list. What is it about the list that you disagree with?
 

thrice

Active member
My main problem was a Hasselblad 500CM where the user neglected to mention certain flaws (filthy focusing screen, WLF magnifier scratched to oblivion, leatherette shrinking - common on older Hasselblads). The seller accepted a return but the return post with insurance cost me $112. I then bought a 501CM kit for $350 more, locally and mint.

I am going to look for more opportunities to buy local in future. Nothing beats inspecting in person before buying and having a chat with an interesting person.

I dont have a single problem with the list but there are two bosses here and they should set the rules. Not the mob.
So the two bosses as Palpatine and Darth? :p Empire vs Rebel scum!
 

Vobluda

New member
Well, I am not sure that the prescribed condition would solve your problem as some people just dont want to understand and they are trying it.. On the other side some people are gear collectors and some people are using cameras as tools.. And sometimes those two worlds colide..

My main problem was a Hasselblad 500CM where the user neglected to mention certain flaws (filthy focusing screen, WLF magnifier scratched to oblivion, leatherette shrinking - common on older Hasselblads). The seller accepted a return but the return post with insurance cost me $112. I then bought a 501CM kit for $350 more, locally and mint.

I am going to look for more opportunities to buy local in future. Nothing beats inspecting in person before buying and having a chat with an interesting person.



So the two bosses as Palpatine and Darth? :p Empire vs Rebel scum!
 

thrice

Active member
I certainly don't collect, I turn over cameras every 3-4 years. I use them all, and all tend to leave me in the same condition they arrived (except maybe the M9 with 1 or 2 marks), not sure what other people are doing to their cameras to wear them down so much.
 

stephengilbert

Active member
I wonder whether there's a correlation between sellers whose only contact with the forum is to sell things, and the likelihood of misdescribed gear? I suspect there is.

There are people on this forum who I've come to consider friends even though we've never spoken, and whose word I accept regarding something they had for sale. Anyone who doesn't meet that standard is someone I wouldn't buy anything from.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
For me on a personal level. I won't buy from anyone who is here just to sell. I buy from members that are here And participate in our forums. That is not a GetDPI rule that is just my personal preference. I work hard to be here and I want to support members who share here and spend there hard earned time here.
 

charlesphoto

New member
I certainly don't collect, I turn over cameras every 3-4 years. I use them all, and all tend to leave me in the same condition they arrived (except maybe the M9 with 1 or 2 marks), not sure what other people are doing to their cameras to wear them down so much.
Awww, c'mon now you are just being insulting. Everybody uses their gear differently. Same with cars. Some people you could eat off the hood of their car at any given time because they fawn over it so much. To my wife's chagrin I'm not that way - it's a way to get from point A to point B and I make sure the oil is changed etc.

With cameras I'm somewhere in between. I use them, and I maintain them. And they tend to stay with me longer than 3-4 years. But often when I'm working fast lenses get piled up in the bag, camera swung into chairs, etc etc. I don't baby them while getting the job done.

Sometimes I prefer to buy a piece of cosmetically user gear and save $. I'm not a fondler. But the price should reflect the condition. That's the bottom line. But how somebody wants to treat their gear is their business. Just be sure you get good pics, etc and the right price. Simple as that.
 

4season

Well-known member
As a community service, I thought I'd provide a cheat sheet on how to interpret typical sale ads.

  • Mint+: I do not know how to grade equipment
  • Mint: Ex+ to Mint- if you are lucky
  • Minty: Kinda sorta nice but don't hold me to it
  • As-New: Like a display sample from Best Buy or Target
  • Like New In Box: See "As-New", but with a box
  • Includes blank warranty card: But not a valid factory warranty
  • Average / typical for age: You look like a glutton for punishment
  • "It appears to be working": And the sun appears to revolve around the Earth
  • "It worked the last time I tried it": In 1969
  • "I don't know much about this": And yet I will charge you top dollar for it
 

SYGTAFOTO

New member
Honestly, your cheat sheet is fun to read, but I don't think it helps the community.. maybe I missed the smiley face somewhere.

Anyhow, pictures can probably solve 9/10 problems when it comes to online sales.
 

thrice

Active member
I love your cheat sheet :p I see 'mint' so many times on ebay and then "only one or two marks" later in the description and then the pictures show a user condition item haha
 

4season

Well-known member
Anyhow, pictures can probably solve 9/10 problems when it comes to online sales.
Ironically, some really excellent gear seems to get photographed in a dimly-lit closet using a cell phone that may have been a decent picture-taker before it got dropped for the third time. Not that it really matters since the photo was taken at 1/8th sec. Handheld.
 
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