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Shipping Insurance

felix5616

Member
Not exactly a for sale ad but related to a sale, so please delete if inappropriate. I have an opportunity to sell my medium format gear, having previously sold here with no issues. My prospective buyer has asked my to ship a sizable amount of gear using his FedEx account and does NOT want shipping insurance. I have asked for a signed statement that this is their wish and that I would not be held liable for damage or loss that occurs during shipping. Does that protect me if the gear is lost or damage. The buyer will be paying via paypal, which may require shipping insurance to protect me in case of a claim by the buyer.
 

Don Libby

Well-known member
Just me thinking out loud however there's no way in hell I would ever ship without insurance.
 

Mark Rustad

New member
Not exactly a for sale ad but related to a sale, so please delete if inappropriate. I have an opportunity to sell my medium format gear, having previously sold here with no issues. My prospective buyer has asked my to ship a sizable amount of gear using his FedEx account and does NOT want shipping insurance. I have asked for a signed statement that this is their wish and that I would not be held liable for damage or loss that occurs during shipping. Does that protect me if the gear is lost or damage. The buyer will be paying via paypal, which may require shipping insurance to protect me in case of a claim by the buyer.
Does PayPal still release funds to you if the goods do not deliver--regardless of the carrier? I have had PayPal withhold payment to me on the sale of a Nikon 85mm f1.8 lens (a $350.00 sale) that was delivered to the wrong address and floated in an OOPS (UPS) Twilight Zone for 2 weeks. Luckily I did get the lens back and reshipped. Only once it was signed for did I get paid. Insure that sale!
 

Pemihan

Well-known member
I have shipped many high ticket items all over the world using FedEx and have never had any issues. But I always ship fully insured regardless of not having had any issues!
If a signed statement from the buyer will protect you if anything goes wrong I do not know.
 

Sparky16

Member
Most insurance DON'T pay for any damage caused by careless packaging, it'll be next to impossible to claim insurance coverage for damaged items. Packaging properly is seller's responsibility, period.

That said, shipping insurance is to protect you, the seller, not the buyer against loss of package, be it stolen from the porch, or in rare cases, theft by delivery personnel. Do I need to go further?

For lower cost items, carriers do not require signature even for insured items. For those cost less than, say $200 or less, I go without insurance, either tracking or signature required service is preferred, yes, I'm taking chances.
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
Some businesses have insurance that covers shipments on their account . For example a Leica Store can send you a shipping label and you do not have to buy insurance . They are technically the shipper .

Unfortunately their is no substitute for insurance in your case . You are dealing with an individual that has access to a company account .

Biggest question I would have is can you even get insurance from FED EX for a large MF kit .

You might consider using REGISTERED MAIL ..its the preferred method for shipping high value items ....like rare coins ,watches etc .

Maybe one of the many dealers on the forum can explain how they ship expensive gear ?
 

Rafael Macia

New member
You, as the shipper, are responsible for the buyer receiving the goods. Insurance protects YOU.
Ship with or forget the deal.
 

f8orbust

Active member
Since you can only insure for the declared value, if the declared value is zero then your insurance is zero too. Be prepared for a few sleepless nights if you go down that route.

99.9% of the time this is done simply to avoid import duties. This is, of course, illegal, and will be entirely on you as the shipper should TSHTF. Anything in writing from the buyer is going to be worthless in this situation, especially if you signed the Customs declaration.

If the buyer is using a credit card via PayPal they have two layers of protection. You, as the seller, just have PayPal - and I wouldn't trust them to find in your favor should the shipment be damaged, disappear or be seized by Customs. At the very least they are going to want to see what you insured the goods for. If that's zero, well that's what they'll refund you. That said, if you're shipping on someone else's dime (e.g. FedEx account), then this muddies the waters even further when it comes to PayPal's varies policies concerning refunds should a problem arise.

If you really want to do this, bank transfer (cash) is the only payment to take, and make it clear in writing to the seller what the full value of the shipment is. Then use their FedEx account and get them to prepare all the paperwork so that you just have to package up the goods and let FedEx attach the label.

That said, there will be a long 'paper' trail (including this thread) of the potential conspiracy to defraud Customs in the buyer's country, so I would just forget the whole deal.

MF gear is hard to sell these days, so it's really tempting when you get a single buyer for the lot, but I would personally insist on doing everything above board, with full insurance, or look elsewhere.

Jim
 

daf

Member
If he has a fedex account, then ask him to organise himself the «pick-up by fedex».
And adk for a simple bank transfert, or if he absolutly want a paypal transaction, the be clear that all goods are not shipped but delivered hands to hands ....so you're now fully covered :)
 
If you're accepting PayPal for payment, there's little, if anything, you can do to protect yourself. Either buy insurance, or find another buyer.
 

JohnBrew

Active member
I insure for full sale price. On the flip side it is incredibly difficult to collect from shippers for damaged goods. What they offer instead is to repair your damaged item. I lost a Cal Audio CD player and a Minolta 5400 scanner that way as they repeatedly damaged the repaired item. Eventually I had to throw in the towel. :banghead:
 

felix5616

Member
My feeling is that while shipping insurance is necessary, the shippers NEVER pay for their damage. Insurance is a scam that the insurers have perfected. Glad I'm not a retail operation.
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
My feeling is that while shipping insurance is necessary, the shippers NEVER pay for their damage. Insurance is a scam that the insurers have perfected. Glad I'm not a retail operation.
Agree but if they lose the package they pay ....so they don t lose many . How hard do you think they look for a package with zero declared value ?

Our community in Florida has a FED EX account thru a large business that manages our property . I shipped over 100 packages of all sizes this season without a single issue . I did expect the boxes to be slammed and packed accordingly with interior boxes when necessary . I self insured everything except a few boxes of expensive camera gear which I insured for a $1000 just so they would look if they were lost .
 

nanthor

Member
I rarely use insurance when I ship because, as you observed, they rarely pay, but.., the insurance is your business, not the buyers. I would be suspect of any buyer seeking to NOT have an item insured, it is usually the other way around. Also, as many have said, paypal really only protects the buyer, not the seller, so if the package is damaged or lost their signature won't mean a thing, IMO. It seems the only reason for them asking for no insurance is to avoid a customs charge, which is understandable but if that's the case then it also means the package is taking a journey and should probably be insured. I would think if it's a lot of gear it probably is worth a good deal of money and that the customs charge might not be that much as a percentage of the total so it should be paid and the package insured. Bob.
 

kinglang

Active member
Hi all, it seems many country`s national post or DHL &UPS can not provide insurance cover the entire declared value.As i know insurance at Swiss can not over 1000CHF. In most countries, can a third-party insurance company cover full value insurance for lost transportation?
 

Ron M

New member
If you are using the buyer's FedEx account, then doesn't he become the shipper, with the attendant responsibilities? Like Glenerrolrd (post # 7) mentioned getting a shipping label from Leica, which means that they become the shipper.
 
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